Madeleine documentary

[mentallyfacked]

New documentary due to be released on Netflix on Friday.

I've covered this subject quite extensively while I was studying law. I will be watching with a heavy heart, it is just one of those cases I can't let go of sadly.

Anyone else going to be watching?

Why am I mentioning it? Because people do blame them and continue to disbelieve that Madeleine was abducted.

It's possible to disbelieve the version of events that the McCanns insist on without suspecting them of foul play.

They were naturally biased, emotional, protective of their remaining children, defensive of their choices, cogniscent of their livelihoods. And so on.

All of which makes them unreliable, even assuming they're entirely innocent of criminal wrongdoing.

Of course we don’t know. But we all have an opinion one way or the other and after weighing up the information given I’ve always believed she was taken.

There is a video of them on the bus at the airport where one of them says 'cheer up Gerry, you're on holiday' To which he replies 'fk off, I'm not here to enjoy myself' Definitely a bigger picture surrounding all this.

Oh come on. That's clearly a joke.

@acciocat "read the thread " - you're assuming of course that I haven't ,based on nothing .
I can assure that I have read the thread and that I keep checkingthings said on it with source materials .

There are various other possibilities.

wandering out and abduction from outside the apartment , yes wandering out as I've said

accident, or harm from someone in some way other than abduction from the bed. right so this is a third possibilty - something happened to Madeleine inside the apartment ( I'm guessing you're rightly being careful not to implicate any individuals )

My problem is that the McCanns are criticised for concentrating on the theory of abduction . But that criciticsm must surely come from ppl who have made up their minds that someone close to Madeleine intentionally or unintentionally caused her harm .

Only ppl with that closed mindset would see it odd that the parents focus on the most likely explanation .It's not that it's odd that the most plausible happening is the one that comes to the McCanns mind ,it's only described as odd in an attempt to bolster a judgement already made .

hunting, why do you think he might have said that? What do you think he meant? What are you trying to imply?

If DH said that, I'd assume he was deadpan joking. Or feeling stressed by the journey and wanted the camera out of his face.

The trouble for me on these threads is that I'm very good at putting myself into other people's heads, and I generally prefer to the simplest explanation for things. I'm a big believer in Occam's Razor and I don't tend to be taken in by conspiracy theories.

Re the video on the bus, that's total deadpan Scottish humour. No biggie

myeyes that link suggesting 6 possibilties gives

1 The parents were involved

2 Madeleine wandered off

and 4 other possibilties involving abduction . Different motives for abduction but all abduction .

So very few possibilties .

Peridito- you asked what other possible explanations there could be and I pointed you in the direction of a few, that’s all!

It’s your opinion that abduction from her bed is the ‘most plausible’ one - but as it stands there is no substantiated evidence. Of that or of any other theory. Despite extensive investigation over years and years.

Hopefully one day the truth will be uncovered. Not sure it ever will be though

But Kate and Gerry accounts kept subtly changing . That is the issue ! They changed their story about which doors were and weren't locked etc and which door they went into the apartment through when they found her missing. Also the confusion over the forced window that wasn't etc etc

@flapjackfairy having read the transcripts of the Portugese police interviews with Kate and Gerry there are no subtle changes ,they agree .

The sort of child that jumped out of a boat to get another child's hat would surely wander off to find her parents if she woke up in the middke of the night and the door was unlocked.

^Why did the two dogs identify the smell of death and blood independently of each other in multiple places in the McCan’s apartment and in their hire car? Two of those places were her bedroom wardrobe and her toy ‘cuddlecat’*

I don't know how to regard the reports re the dogs ,how reliable they are .If they can detect traces of blood as claimed even after surfaces are washed and bleached is it really credible ( as another poster mentioned ) that their failure to alert in other apartments means that there was never any blood spilled in them - no radom cuts ,no razor nicks nothing ,ever ?

I've read the reports and see that the dogs did alert to food in other apartments - so one wonders if this could account for them alerting to the McCanns car ?

I've not seen mention ( might have missed it ) to alerting to a wardrobe .

. Why then did Kate wash cuddlecat before the dogs were involved? because she wanted it to be clean for her daughter's return ? Because she thought the abductor had handeled it ?

Why was Garry out playing golf two days after Madeline went missing? To try and retain his sanity ?

Why did they pay off their mortgage with the funds raised to search for Madeline?
Have you got a source for this ?

The sort of child that jumped out of a boat to get another child's hat would surely wander off to find her parents if she woke up in the middke of the night and the door was unlocked

Possibly, if a nearly 4 year old could reach the handle and open the door. But what would be the likelihood of her wandering out of the apartment and never being seen again, no sighting of a small girl in her pjs on her own from anyone, nothing at all.

She knew where the tapas bar was and that the group were eating there, she would imo have gone there to find her parents. Even had she wandered further afield someone would have seen her, had she had some kind of accident again she would have been found. So the wandering off theory doesn’t hold much water to me.

Ben Needham wandered off and met with an accident. There was a lot of talk about kidnappers then too.

The sort of child that jumped out of a boat to get another child's hat would surely wander off to find her parents if she woke up in the middke of the night and the door was unlocked.

Yes, that crossed my mind.

They also kept saying that drawing the curtains back, sliding the door open, drawing the curtain again, sliding the door closed, walking down the steps, and unlatching and relatching the gate would be beyond her.

But I've never found that completely convincing. Children lift large door curtains out of their way and duck under them, IME. I also remember moving into a house with sliding patio doors when I had two preschoolers and being surprised that they could slide them so easily.

A small confident, responsible child of almost four could conceivably wake up, set off to find her parents and close everything behind her (to keep her little siblings safe) is she was motivated and had seen those things done by adults, I think.

Possibly, if a nearly 4 year old could reach the handle and open the door.

The doors were the type that only lock from inside. She wouldn't have needed to reach a handle. You just need to press your hand to he glass and slide.

But what would be the likelihood of her wandering out of the apartment and never being seen again, no sighting of a small girl in her pjs on her own from anyone, nothing at all.

If she came across the wrong person she could be gone in an instant. Like Etan Paz. Like Sarah Payne.

But surely the child would head to the source of noise and light which was the tapas bar not the dark, poorly lit street away from the hotel complex? And I'd imagine she'd walked from the apartment to the complex with her parents so would be vaguely familiar with the route?

My child is a wanderer, escape artist and dasher. She's 12 now but in her younger days she would dash towards exciting lights and noises not deserted streets.

@acciocat

I said I thought wandering off or abduction were possibilties and asked what the other possibilties that the McCann's are accused of ignoring were .

You said
There are various other possibilities... wandering out and abduction from outside the apartment, accident, or harm from someone in some way other than abduction from the bed.

wandering
abduction while wandering
harm from someone in some other way

the first and second are the same and I'd already referred to them .
harm in some other way is a another possibilty ???

so no ,you didn't point me to a few other possibilties

I still think it’s unlikely that not one single person saw her wandering alone.

You just need to press your hand to he glass and slide.

but no evidence of this from the figerprinting carried out

We used to have really heavy patio doors in our house. They required quite a lot of effort to open. But if they weren’t pushed fully into the frame, just a small gap, it was quite easy to push them across. My DC could do it by pushing themselves into the gap shoulder/arm first and wiggle/push. They slid quite easily and they were much easier to move once away from the frame. Ditto climbing over child safety gates if they couldn’t open the mechanism.

Can it be confirmed that the last person to do the room check did pull the patio doors fully shut? I guess they’ve ruled that out.

Agree Redhelen. I don’t know why some people find the idea of an accident so implausible.

For decades many people believed Ben Needham was abducted... there was a lot of talk about a blonde child being a target, there were ‘sightings’ over the years and I believe at least one case of an adult being DNA tested as possibly being Ben.

It’s now been concluded that he highly likely died being accidentally knocked down.

Considering the apartment was on a road and it was dark it’s certainly possible that a wandering child could meet with an accident

And presumably all the children’s fingerprints would have been on glass, doors and numerous places within the apartment !!

now that's a theory I could get behind detectivemyeyes !

I don't find it unlikely. I just understand why the parents prefer to stick to the abduction theory. And if she wandered off, why was the window open?

And presumably all the children’s fingerprints would have been on glass, doors and numerous places within the apartment !!

well yeah ,good point !
I wonder if they did find them but just dismissed them as what they'd expect to find ?