Leaving Neverland: Michael Jackson and Me

[SachaStark]

Anybody else planning to watch tonight? Part 1 of 2, 9pm, Channel 4.

I'm very intrigued to watch. I remember the Martin Bashir documentary being aired years ago, and the various backlashes/criticisms that happened afterwards.

It’s not unusual for a family to be groomed to gain access to a child.

A wedding ring

The detailed description of the abuse is shocking.

Also the way they are talking, unemotional, disassociated, almost as if it didn’t hapoen to them. Very common.

Totally believable I think. That jewellery - amazing he has kept it...

I wonder if those jewellers were ever contacted, they must remember the day Mj and a child came in.
Their stories really back each other’s up, I wonder how many others there are out there

Why do others think he kept the jewellery? I'd have thought he would want rid of anything that vile creature ever bought him for obvious reasons.

I'm a jeweller.

Jewellery isn't bought by men for children.

I don't know why anyone is still defending Michael Jackson. Regardless of the details of the abuse, something that is almost impossible to know for sure now, his behavior was always inappropriate with these children he had around Neverland ranch. Even as a kid myself in the early 90s I found him creepy, and not just because his face was falling apart by then. Spending time with these kids, encouraging them to trust an adult they don't really know and bribing them with money and treats is abusive in itself as it crosses boundaries for normal childhood and sets them up to be abused by other adults, even if Jackson himself never abused them (and to be fair, it seems like he did).

Why do others think he kept the jewellery

I get a touch of stockholm syndrome from him. I don't think the relationship between abuser and abused is straight forward. It's very hard making sense in your head of someone you love during the day and fear at night.

WHat upsets me too is that the children didn't feel like it was wrong, and weren't scared

Children are so vulnerable

He may have mixed feelings about the jewellery after all they're still likely still processing the abuse. They'll probably spend the rest of their lives doing so. As I mentioned earlier even though my friend now knows that she was the victim of horrific abuse and is traumatised by it now, but, she also still has some fond memories of her abuser and the 'kindness' that he showed her.

He showed explicit porn to a 7 year old? Just no.

pickled that's what I meant too. You put it better than me.

I will share Wade with you
And people wonder why the parents are being criticised

Watching the programme now, it's very disturbing, i'm sorry but the parent's are just as much to blame how could they let there children stay in a bedroom with a grown man? One parent said she couldn't believe MJ was paying so much attention to her son, alarm bell's should have been ringing they certainly would have been for me!! Makes you wonder what the parent's were gaining, l hope there bloody ashamed of themselves.

Don’t worry the parents will be vilified and probably hounded for life. MJ escapes justice or paid off other children. I wonder if those of you throwing such vitriol at the mothers will still listen to MJ?

My friend also still struggles with anyone else criticising her abuser because he gave her some of the most positive memories she has of her childhood. No other adult made her feel as though she mattered, as though she was special and deserved happiness. He did all of that and also abused her. It's no wonder that they're so conflicted and confused.

People just DO NOT GET grooming.

The WHOLE family was groomed.

Wade's mother especially seemed like she was just so enamoured with being close to celebrity.

Pickled it's that message that I think why this is so crucial to understand the victims..

Sinister we all know exactly who is responsible.
We know he groomed the families.
But if this was just a bloke who lived down the street he would have been sent to prison, and questions would be asked of why the parents let them stay with him.

I have said on the other thread that neither mother comes across well. Stage mothers rarely do.
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/3518728-why-are-people-still-deluding-themselves-about-michael-jackson?watched=1&msgid=85400654#85400654
Part of that will be in the editing - both mothers are being very honest about the process of grooming. One of them has avoided hearing what happened to their son as they cannot face it, knowing they enabled it. One son was NC for a while.

I remember so clearly that Black and White video being released. It was a big event.