The Handmaid's Tale Season 2 (UK Pace) - thread 3

[CruCru]

Hi all

Here is the next thread for those who are watching The Handmaid's Tale Season 2 on Channel 4. Please don't put any spoilers on this - the other thread (for those in other countries who are watching ahead of the UK) is:

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/telly_addicts/3239228-Handmaids-Tale-Season-2-SPOILERS-VIEWING-AHEAD-OF-UK-SREENING

Putnam def had more of an 'affair' with Janine - you remember her telling June that they were going to run away together and live as a family with Charlotte? So Mrs Putnam would def not have bonded with Janine's child, as it's a permanent reminder of his infidelity. And therefore the baby with 'fail to thrive' and could die of 'neglect' until Janine cuddles her and shows her love, as said by the Martha Dr.

I feel really uncomfortable with the suicide bomber - it's made me really think about suicide bombers in general. How they really think they have 'right' and God on their side, and jsut to kill as many bastards on the other side as possible. Even if there are innocent, civilian casualties. I watched the bombing and thought 'Good on yer girl' but then, as I say, it really made me think.

I hope Serena is now hating the Commander a lot. He doesn't sleep with her anyway, and doesn't seem to have any feelings for her, other than for her position as wife to make him look good. I hope his power is slipping.

Is the last episode next week?

I just made the mistake of googling to see how many episodes are left in the UK, and I still don't know but I've seen a massive and horrible spoiler I promise I won't share but

I think there are 13 episodes in total but I think next week is only number 9 in the UK.

Anybody else seeing a pattern?
Handmaids suicide bomb - we thought yay handmaids and mayday but more handmaids than commanders were killed.
June and Serena team up - we thought yay but then Fred comes back and starts throwing his weight around.
Janine cuddles the baby until it thrives in a really beautiful final scene ... I'm really worried about what could happen to Janine next week. And no it's not the last one yet.

F

Did anyone notice the colour change? When Serena and June were working together at the beginning the lighting was soft and warm. Then we see Fred step out of the car onto the iron grey pavement, with his black shoe & they carefully only show the grey sky and his black cloak and the grey stone steps and then the colours are back to being muted and grey sludge again. It was very cleverly done.

Margo I noticed the sheer blackness of Waterford’s coat. It was really black. It actually occurred to me whilst seeing it that no-one in gilead has pets (that coat wouldn’t stand a chance in my house! )

How interesting about the colours!

I don't think that was the first time Serena had received that punishment from Fred either. You could see on her face she knew exactly what was coming as soon as he moved the chair.

I hope she has seen her breaking point now that she has experienced having a bit of control back and doesn't revert back again.

I'm suprised that Nick was worried about Eden reading the letters because I assumed she wouldn't have been taught to read.

She has grown up in Gilead and obviously trained and brainwashed in how to do her duty and be a good wife. Surely girls are not taught how to read when it's against the law?

Interesting about the light i did notice when Serena takes fred into his office, she's standing by the window and she's bathed in golden light but he's grey and dark. Then as he shows her out of the room everything is grey and sludgy again.

I thought it was interesting that when Serena was in her underwear its obvious what a beautiful woman she is, but gilead doesnt care about that. Very stark contrast to our society where the most attractive women are the most highly prized. Lydia, who isn't physically attractive in any conventional sense, is the most powerful woman. Not sure what my point is, i just thought it was an interesting comparison.

GoldenWolfFleece if you make an unattractive woman powerful, there is less danger that she can seduce a man and get him to do what she wants.

Covering up women is all about keeping power in the hands of older, ruling men by giving younger men access to women only in legitimate ways.

Gilead hasn't been around long enough for Eden not to have learned to read. Say women have been banned from reading for 5 years, isn't Eden around 15?
I imagine her as having grown up in a fundamentalist home which will have taught her her role is to serve her husband, maybe even been home schooled, but preventing women reading has never been a feature of Christian fundamentalism AFAIK - if anything, female literacy was encouraged from early on so they could read their Bibles.

Yes, I thought Fred had beaten Serena before, as she said "No Fred" or something similar as soon as she saw him pull the chair forward. What a bastard. I know that as a Commander he has ordered horrific things to happen, but somehow the beating of his own wife is so relatable that it seems worse. Urgh, I am filled with loathing for him, that I have yet to feel quite so strongly for any other character to date.

There were lots of 'connections' not quite being made in this episode. June trying to connect with Serena and Fred being very obvious. But also, Mrs Warren having failed to connect with Angela. The male doctor trying to connect with the Neonatologist who he had clearly admired. Eden trying to connect with Nick and also with June.

Great quote from Atwood about men being afraid women will laugh at them and women being afraid men will kill them. Fear determining our actions & in many ways it was fear preventing all those connections being made!!!!!!!!

Anybody else absolutely hate Joseph Fiennes ? I know it's only a character but he is doing SO WELL. I used to fancy him a bit but every time I see him now he gives me the creeps.

So glad i found this thread - I wasn't enjoying the beginning of the series but the past 3/4 episodes have hooked me back. I cried when the Handmaids were telling each other their names and I cried last night seeing the Martha in her scrubs and Janine singing. I'm really hoping they do a back story episode for Aunt Lydia.

I was convinced it was going to be shaken baby syndrome. -Nice to be wrong about it! I love the dynamics, the fact that Serena's pride wouldn't let her acept comfort that June didn't maybe really want to give. Shades of grey (and not meaning that dreadful attempt at erotic fiction...)

I think June did want to give serena comfort but Serena couldn't bear June knowing how low she is and how completely any power serena thought she had has been taken away, by a weak and vindictive man. Now they both know that they're at the mercy of fred. June might not have been aware of the power imbalance between Serena/fred to date, but now she knows serena, inside the household at least, is almost as lowly as she is. I dont think June has ever witnessed any important communications between Fred and Serena before so wouldn't have been aware.

I wonder what june's motivation is for going to talk to fred.

It's great seeing how conflicted Serena now is and her realisation that she is so restricted by the Gilead she helped create. But she still trots out the Gilead rubbish regarding a woman's role etc.

I think Serena isn't ready to admit to herself that she has been screwed over in this new world order so she is going to revert back to type and my feeling is she is going to be quite horrid to June as a result.

The Janine baby episode will serve to harden Serena against June. Serena really wants a baby but Janine's baby is unwanted by Naomi Putnam, so I think Serena will see June's baby as her own (she already does I think after the tummy rubbing scene a few episodes back). So I think she will be keen to get rid of June at the earliest possible moment.

When the Margaret Atwood quote was spoken, I said 'that's so true' DH was utterly surprised and asked if that how women truly feel. I said 'yes, for the most part, either murder or rape'. He was truly surprised. We had a long discussion about in most of the world women are oppressed and suppressed to bend to the will of men, and if they don't comply, men use their physical strength against women to get what they want. He was utterly surprised.

He was also utterly disgusted with Fred, and moved when Angela made her recovery, and I'm pleased to say, stated that the recovery was because she was being held and loved. He's learning.

And that's what I'm enjoying about THMT, despite the fact that it's really tough viewing, it's opening a conversation between me and DH that we would never have had before. That's a good thing, surely?

@GuntyMcGee yes it's good it got you talking.

Maybe show him this. It's not just that women are afraid it might happen, it has happened.

It's good that the show is making people recognise things they might not have thought about before, and definitely good the have them talking about it.

so she is going to revert back to type and my feeling is she is going to be quite horrid to June as a result

Totally agree with this about Serena. I think this bonding between June and Serena was always going to be short lived, it was possible because Fred wasn't there, and now I think Serena is going to turn into even more of a monster. June has seen her at her weakest and that is not good. Look how she answered through the door to June.. 'NO. Go back to your room' in a strong voice even though she was beside herself upset and in tears.

This uneasy alliance was never going to work. I'd like to be wrong but I just think it has weakened June

Just watched this episode and I cried the whole way through and I never do that (except when pregnant). It was such a hard watch. I almost felt sorry for serena, having no power is one thing but now the household know, you are no better than them really. I think Serena will turn on June.

Fred is an evil bastard, who is also weak. He is prepared to bend the rules when it suits him but has no compassion. It was interesting to see these men being bettered by women and how they react. The dr and fred.

For fred, having the power over half of society is more important than bringing on a new generation - saving the baby.

I think there will be a crack down, handmaids talking, wives helping and women doing mens work. The men will need to reassert themselves, at the womens expense.

I am intrigued to see what effect Janine and the baby will have on Aunt Lydia. Mothers love and all that.

Sitting on my hands so I dont google the next episodes (all of them).

If it had been a scenario whereby Fred was seriously ill but conscious and it transpired that the best expert in the medical field for his illness was a Martha.... betcha he would've said yes, send her along.

I was surprised how much empathy Lydia showed this week. Also at how much talking the handmaids were allowed to get away with in the shop compared to series 1!

Lydia's always cared about Janine though, even if she has an odd way of showing it. She was angry with June for stopping the stoning because she thought Janine would be better off being killed by her friends than sent to the colonies.

I think all the handmaids talking is building up to a crackdown.

Totally Fred would get a woman doctor for himself. And refuse to for Serena. He's always been the most awful hypocrite, right back to series one, Scrabble and Jezebels.