Lassies of Lallybroch in the Caribbean - The Outlander Discussion Thread - Spoilers Ahoy

[MoNigheanDonn]

New thread lassies for all things Jamie and Claire (and all things in between).

Only two episodes left! Hope everyone enjoyed episode 11.

Signed the petition- really shocked that we'd need to sign a petition to stop houses being built within such a short distance of a battlefield and essentially a graveyard to be honest.

Just to add to the comments about the brilliance of S1. Claire's choice/conflict about whether or not to return to 1948 and Frank was so well handled. I mean yes obviously Jamie was/is ridiculously hot and sensitive etc and we knew she would stay but her internal battle to let go of her own world and embrace Scotland/Jamie/lack of hot water etc was really well done and they showed a very gradual change. Obviously you can't replicate that will they/won't they in subsequent series but I miss it!

I went out last night, had one to many glasses of wine and tried to convert some friends in to watching Outlander. I may or may not have described the Wedding episode in great detail

I'm about to rewatch episode 1 but my personal thoughts on why series 1 was the best was firstly because of the setting and secondly because the storyline was a lot simpler than subsequent seasons.

I've just read somewhere that DG'S involvement in S4 might be a lot less than in previous seasons (fingers crossed) and also that they're hoping to involve Frank again through flashbacks which I'm not sure is necessary, but we'll see.

Oh, no. We have had enough frank.

Ok, I've watched episode 1 again and it just showed how much it's changed (and not for the better, unfortunately). I thought I might be a bit bored with all the Frank stuff and the slower pace but I wasn't at all. I can even live with Claire's voiceovers. They seem a lot more necessary here and her tone is different. In S3, even CB sounded bored stiff with them.

And aka was right - it is more humorous. And I really, really miss Dougal, Angus and Rupert 😭

I'm watching S1 E1 now.

God Frank and his endless wittering on about history. No wonder she decided to stay with Jamie. Anything would be better than that. Bless Tobias Menzies though, he manages to save Frank from being a total charmless bore.

S2 did have the humour missing which is understandable because it has to deal with PTSD and stillbirth. I definitely felt like we were getting the old playful Jamie back during S3 and I have high hopes for S4.

I thought the later books had flashbacks of Frank, but all the Boston stuff this season had put most of that in one place.

I think a lot of the issues with later books is that DG decides to separate her main characters for 20yrs. She sets up this wonderful atmosphere of the Scottish Highlands, a series of characters: Dougal, Rupert, Angus, Ned etc. and then casts them away for a very dramatic, emotional, sacrificial moment when Jamie sends Claire back through the stones. Some of the dialogue in S3 seemed to reflect the difficulty of that, both Jenny and Geillis questioning Claire leaving Jamie. It's a heart wrenching part of the story, but is hard to make it ring true, I think. I'm not sure I completely forgive DG for it, either.

I think a lot of the issues with later books is that DG decides to separate her main characters for 20yrs. She sets up this wonderful atmosphere of the Scottish Highlands.

Yes, yes! Agree. I still can't understand her decision to separate the main love story for 20 bloody years. Not only that, she then draws their twilight years out over five or six bloody books, yet they're still behaving as if they're in their twenties.

It doesn't help that I don't really have an interest in the American Revolution or pioneering era either (and I can't say DG has done anything to change that).

Absolutely Courtney.

June. Franks history lessons become relevant as the series goes on

Good point. Claire is only reasonably knowedgable about Culloden becuase of Frank and his research with the vicar.
If I had been her, I wouldn't have had a clue about the date, all I would know was being on the /scottish side was a BAD idea!

Franks history lessons become relevant as the series goes on

Well yes, I do realise that - I’ve watched the series through just once or twice ;) What I meant was imagine being married to a man who talked like a walking history textbook - watching it again I have more respect for CB’s acting skills, as she manages to look lovingly at him every time he comes out with yet another fascinating nugget ...

I have more respect for CB’s acting skills, as she manages to look lovingly at him every time he comes out with yet another fascinating nugget

Same. He's a bit of a bore is old Frank. Right from when they arrive in Inverness, he's mansplaining every little thing, from the blood on the door lintels to the origins of Halloween.

I think a lot of the issues with later books is that DG decides to separate her main characters for 20yrs. She sets up this wonderful atmosphere of the Scottish Highlands.

Absolutely! Their separation made sense in the context of Culloden and is what makes their story so beautiful in many ways - their loss and reconnection through time and space. But 20 years! that's just insane.

It could have so easily gone like this...

Frank cops out early (either kicks the bucket or decides he cannot do it anymore). Bree, who's maybe, idk, 10? is revealed through some convenient bonkers plotting to be able to time travel. Claire decides to risk it all and take her back through the stones. She arrives when Jamie is still at Aardsmuir, but somehow she manages to visit him and they have a deeply emotional reunion. We all cry buckets. Then - since I'm assuming DG really wants them in America - Jamie gets transported to the colonies and, be still my broken heart, they are separated AGAIN!

End of Book 3.

Claire remains in Scotland where she builds a reputation as a fearsome healer and it's a hard life but thanks to Jennie's love and companionship she makes a good life there for herself, Bree and Fergus (lets not forget Fergus, who's now a strapping lad of about 20, chomping at the bit in the provincial confines of rural scotland. he has the hots for lovely UNRELATED Marsali who's 15 but there's nothing dodgy going on there because he's 20 and not 30 and also they're not stepsiblings ).

After, let's say, 2 years of hard labour where he nonetheless has ample opportunities to demonstrate his superior leadership skills, Jamie gets released early because HELLO JAMMF!!! and Claire, Bree, Fergus and Marsali make a civilised trip to the New World where they do not encounter pirates or mutinies (I would allow a bit of typhoid which Claire saves them all from).

From then on, Fraser's Ridge and pioneering galore. Claire and Jamie have another bairn (whom they name Hope, in honour of Faith and their new beginnings) which is totally realistic because Claire is only 40.

In time, wee Ian joins them of his own free will and we can pick up from there. Bree grows up and doesn't become annoying, she meets a lovely ancestor of Roger MacKenzie and they live happily ever after.

End of Book Four and end of Saga.

Not that I've spent anytime considering this bit of fan fiction, you understand. None at all.

Oh my the last few books of dragging them around America from battle I don't care about to battle I don't care about whilst Claire mends everyone and everyone loves Jamie except everyone that's trying to kill him and everyone bumps into each other all the time. And then off they go somewhere else again.

(I can’t believe I shared with you the contents of my little sad obsessed brain!!!)

I prefer your version AKA !

Oh my the last few books of dragging them around America from battle I don't care about to battle I don't care about whilst Claire mends everyone and everyone loves Jamie except everyone that's trying to kill him and everyone bumps into each other all the time. And then off they go somewhere else again

Won't bother re-reading the America set books. I think that's an almost perfect synopsis.

And yes to aka's version. I say we crowdfund to get this published

Isn’t fanfictiOn, in DG’s delightful words, like selling children into white slavery...

Love it, aka. The only drawback would be that we don't really get older Jamie so no fuel for the fantasies of menopausal women.

Can you also include Jamie leaving a note for Claire to find in the future because it really annoys me that neither of them thought to plan for the eventuality that Jamie might survive...

He was determined to kill himself in Culloden though. They knew it was going to be a massacre and in the unlikely event that he survived, he would have been hanged as a traitor.

Oh my the last few books of dragging them around America from battle I don't care about to battle I don't care about whilst Claire mends everyone and everyone loves Jamie except everyone that's trying to kill him and everyone bumps into each other all the time. And then off they go somewhere else again.

My thoughts on S01E01

• I love the opening bit in the car where everything is in sepia tones, before JAMMF arrives and lights up the world
• Claire/ Caitriona seems to be about 2 feet taller than everyone else and at least twice the height of Mrs Graham
• Frank had at least six affairs and ten girlfriends during the war

It's amazing how much of that episode is lifted straight from the books, practically word for word!

He was determined to kill himself in Culloden though.

Yup. But he didn't... so covering all eventualities they should have arranged for Jamie to leave a letter somewhere. No letter = closure for Claire. Letter = we could have had them back together a lot sooner. Maybe.

But it's written how it's written, I guess.

Or maybe in true Gabaldon fashion, letter = stolen by bandits and used as a talisman to bring forth some evil through the stones which means another misunderstanding whereby Jamie gets captured by the redcoats (again) and they're separated for another 20 years.

To play devil's advocate, Jamie was supposed to be quite prominent in the uprising, so was expecting his death (either on the battlefield or via execution) to be noted?