Game of Thrones Season 7, Episode 7 discussion thread *SPOILERS*

[OlennasWimple]

CAUTION - HERE BE DRAGONS (PROBABLY) AND SPOILERS!

THIS THREAD IS FOR DISCUSSION OF SEASON 7, EPISODE 7 "THE DRAGON AND THE WOLF"

Come and discuss the very last episode in the penultimate series, airing August 27th at 2am UK time! Don't read the thread if you want to avoid finding out what happens in Season 7 but also Seasons 1-6.

Please avoid discussing leaks and production details for Seasons 7 and 8 but speculate away on what we have learnt from the new episodes and what it might mean for the rest of the Season and the ultimate winner(s) of the Game of Thrones.

I agree that the scene with Jon and Dany wasn't meant to be sexy.
It was very 'old boy'

Am dying to know the reason for Tyrion's sad face on the boat!

Me too Appu. Maybe we're simply meant to assume he has a thing for Dany and is jealous?

Peter Dinklage has said the reason for his character looking like that is because he knows love always goes awry, and changes people.

I think that's bollocks. Dinklage won't have been told the reasons, imo, I don't think he'll know all that much more about season 8 than the rest of us. Also, it seems like a weirdly long and significant reaction shot for something so mundane.

Either the writers were just trying to add to the sense of foreboding and 'wrongness' by having Tyrion react that way, somewhat senselessly, or there is a much bigger reason behind it, i.e. the deal with Cersei, whatever it was (and I'm going with my theory of Cersei wanting to marry off Jaime to Dany).

With regard to Littlefingers death and the scene feeling fake - I think it's important to remember that this is Littlefinger. He's king of the double bluff and wouldn't have entered that room if he thought for one second that he'd be remotely in danger. He was incredibly intelligent and I suspect the scene was mostly meant to be from his point of view - he was finally outwitted (by two fairly normally intelligent girls, not a master of deception like him) and as such it had to seem plausible to him that Arya was the one in trouble.

I guess it makes more sense if you think of the scene as being from Littlefinger's point of view, but in that case I'd have liked to have had it made more clear during the recounting of his crimes at what point Sansa caught on to him, when/how Bran told her about Littlefinger's past crimes etc.

Just watched thronecast was awesome, loved the sofa line up. Hannah Waddingham looked magnificent. Did she say the mountain was her boyfriend irl?

Ok so it might just be a soda stream advert lol confused

I think she was referring to the fact that in the end, Cersei had the Mountain locked up with Septa Unella and let him do unspeakable things to her.

Yeah I saw that there was some chat amongst the fans about that when I googled it. I was slightly sad as they would make a fantastic couple visually lol. Kinda along the lines of Brienne and Tormund having babies

The possibility of a nephew - aunt marriage is creeping me out. Someone on Westeros.org claimed that that has happened in the British royal family, although as far as I'm aware it hasn't . But I'm obviously aware that cousin marriages have occurred, and that while an occasional first cousin marriage will probably not be a major problem, repeated first and second cousin marriages can cause genetic issues. But uncle - niece marriages did occur in the Hapsburgs, and they were eventually seriously inbred with major problems. The Emperor Claudius also married his niece, but this would have appeared to have been controversial, even for the Romans. Brother sister marriages actually only happened in ancient Egypt and occasionally in non- European societies such as the Hawaiian Royal Family. But I suppose this is Westeros; maybe the Targs are partly magical, but do also show strong signs of being partly crazy.

twatty is that true about Lena & Jerome?

As far as I can see, Westeros has three main things that are really taboo:

• incest
• kinslaying
• breaking guest rights

The dragons seemed to 'get away' with practising brother-sister incest when it would have been frowned upon in other Houses, but they were largely able to back their rights up with very large fire-breathing dragons. When the dragons died out it took a long time for Westerosi nobility to catch onto the weaknesses in the Targaryan system of governance but it was inevitable that it was going to fail eventually (GRRM has said so in interviews).

Now we have the situation where there are two dragons, two contenders for the Iron Throne and the man with all the information is going to find out that one of them burnt his little brother to death with dragon fire. Go Sam....

The LF, Sansa and Arya story did play out quite predictably really it's true, it was just the thought that this is GoT - what if the twist is that there is no twist, that and the fact that at last LF gets what he deserves. It probably could have been done a bit better - hopefully we will see a better side to the sisters relationship in next season.

That is going to be interesting with Sam Aryaunderfoot, he will prob not be interested in protecting Dany will he.

Keep forgetting about the Sam situation, awkward. I presume Jon knows?

So presumably that's why Sansa walked off in the Brienne and Arya swordfighting scene, to give a proper gesture of mistrust for LF's benefit.

Jon wouldn't bother fighting for the Iron Throne though unless Dany went really insane, and I don't think there's time for that to happen?

I think it would make for a satisfying story if both died defeating the WW (possibly without ever finding out who Jon is). Arguably they are both dead already - Jon has literally died already and is only hanging around to save humanity, doesn't he even say at some point in the last few eps that he was ready to die? Dany "died" as a human princess and was reborn as a deity on Drogo's funeral pyre at the end of season 1, and ever since then she has had to be a larger than life goddess who never really feels human emotions - e.g. sending Dario away. When she has her vision at the House of the Undying it's to return to Drogo and their son in the Shadowlands, which is maybe what the human part of her really wants.

That way their son (?) will be the prince that was promised, not either of them.

Can I ask a question please. Not watched the series but I have read the books.

Has there been another book published since the original set? The series seems to have gone past A Dance with Dragons After the feast.

We're waiting for "the winds of winter" to be released, Ursula, which will be followed by "a dream of summer"

ADOS is apparently pretty much finished, but TWOW has taken a veeeeeery long time

TWOW will apparently be out before s8, but then a few years ago it was supposed to be out before s6 so I'm not holding my breath

Ursula there are no books beyond ADWD but there are lots of sample chapters from Winds of Winter that have been referenced in the show. For example, Arya's watching the Bloody Hand play in season 6 was based in part on her Mercy sample chapter. I think the cave scene may have drawn some inspiration from the cave paintings found by Elia Sand in the Arianne sample chapter.

What's the Sam situation? What did I miss or am I being dopey (most likely scenario!)?

unless Dany went really insane, and I don't think there's time for that to happen?

Dany has a bit of a track record for resorting to using her dragons to resolve conflict. It may work in conquering, but doesn't make for a good ruler. Her CV as a ruler is pretty dire.

Jon may not want the Iron Throne in much the same way that he didn't want to be LC of the Night's Watch. Unfortunately, what you want and what you get in this story are often the exact opposite of each other.

Sam situation: Dany burned his father and brother to death (when they refused to bend the knee after losing that battle)

Tizzy Dany burnt Randyll and Dickon Tarly alive with her dragons at the start of episode 5. Whilst Sam hated Randyll (with good reason) he loved his little brother.