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Game of Thrones Season 7, Episode 7 discussion thread *SPOILERS*

595 replies

OlennasWimple · 27/08/2017 12:04

CAUTION - HERE BE DRAGONS (PROBABLY) AND SPOILERS!

THIS THREAD IS FOR DISCUSSION OF SEASON 7, EPISODE 7 "THE DRAGON AND THE WOLF"

Come and discuss the very last episode in the penultimate series, airing August 27th at 2am UK time! Don't read the thread if you want to avoid finding out what happens in Season 7 but also Seasons 1-6.

Please avoid discussing leaks and production details for Seasons 7 and 8 but speculate away on what we have learnt from the new episodes and what it might mean for the rest of the Season and the ultimate winner(s) of the Game of Thrones.

OP posts:
MargotLovedTom1 · 28/08/2017 18:47

I thought it was actually the same actor (Harry Lloyd) although have seen a still which suggests not. Programme makers recycled Martyn Lannister into Tommen so they have form.

Trills · 28/08/2017 18:49

Targaryens are keen on reusing the same few names, maybe Lyanna called her baby Aegon to try to say "this is a proper legitimate Targaryen, got it?"

McTufty · 28/08/2017 18:49

It is a different actor who plays Rhaegar

AdalindSchade · 28/08/2017 18:54

I think the idea with theon was that he was capable of withstanding pain thereby gaining the respect of the men. Not that his genitals are devoid of nerves.

CeeBeeBee · 28/08/2017 18:56

Yes Trills. I admit, I was a little disappointed when I saw Rhaegar as I had imagined him to have an ethereal type of beauty. Tall with long, flowing, silver hair as described in the books. I imagined he would look like an elf from the film version of Lord of the Rings. Instead, they simply put
a different, slight looking actor in Viserys' wig!

Loved Bran and Sam together. Especially when Bran said that Jon was actually a Sand rather than a Snow and then sat bolt upright when Sam revealed that he was legitimate. Come on, calls himself
the three eyed raven and he completely bypasses this bit of information?

Loved The Hound's lines as always especially telling Ser Robert Strong/ Gregor that he was even uglier than him. Perhaps he will turn into a wight and the Hound will overcome his fear of fire and kill him with it? It would be a retributive end for him.

HaveToBeSure · 28/08/2017 18:57

Ok, I think it's perfectly plausible that Jon is called Aegon AND his deceased older brother also having that name.

In the House of the undying in the books Dany sees a vision in which two people - one heavily implied to be Rhaegar and the other easily presumed to be Elia - are with a newborn baby. Rhaegar says he should be called Aegon and that he is the prince who was promise and the son of ice and fire.

Jon is clearly the song of ice and fire so this baby must be him. The woman is given no description and as Rhaegar has a known son called Aegon many assume he is talking to Elia. I think the woman is actually Lyanna. Obviously she gave birth without him but the visions aren't literal - it's easy to see that it could be a representation of a conversation between Lyanna and Rhaegar about their future children. I'm sure there were other parts of the book that said Rhaegar was convinced he would have a son called Aegon who would be the prince who was promised so maybe he was hedging his bets and calling both his sons Aegon? Maybe, on meeting Lyanna he thought 'shit, I called my kid by Elia the special name - I jumped the gun!' But whatever reason I do believe Jon's name being Aegon will be revealed as canon in the books.

Also a lot of people on Twitter have been joking that D&D were saving money by using Viserys' wig for Rhaegar's hair but the exact book passage I mentioned above actually says the man in the vision (Rhaegar) had her brother's hair...

HaveToBeSure · 28/08/2017 18:58

Cross post with CeeBeeBee!

HaveToBeSure · 28/08/2017 18:59

Cross posted with everyone!

HaveToBeSure · 28/08/2017 19:03

*song of ice and fire, not son. Fuck, my post was a train wreck!

Trills · 28/08/2017 19:11

"Her brother's hair" just meant "silver hair, like nobody I've ever seen except my brother" when I read it. Not the same haircut necessarily.

yumyumpoppycat · 28/08/2017 19:11

Really liked it - I did fall for it slightly and think oh no cersei is acting like a human being and Sansa is going to screw it all up - but as soon as it was time for her to present the charges it was pretty clear who they would be against and I did a little Yes and fist raise thing.

So Bran is an unreliable source of information?

Trills · 28/08/2017 19:12

I agreed with the idea of him with very long hair like the elves - I get a feeling that anyone with Targaryen hair who was not on the run or in disguise would be swishing it about going "oooh, look at my super special hair" at any opportunity.

Trills · 28/08/2017 19:14

Bran is not unreliable, in terms of seeing things that are untrue, but he only sees what he sees.

If he observes people having an ambiguous conversation, he may come to the wrong conclusion.

He does not appear to be very interested in piecing things together and following chains of evidence, or gathering additional background to the things he "knows".

That lack of curiosity and thoroughness could be dangerous.

HaveToBeSure · 28/08/2017 19:25

Trills, you say yourself that's just your interpretation - and it could be read as that. Or it could be read to support what I just said. It just says he had her brother's hair. Not 'hair colour' or 'hair style.' It's open to numerous nuanced interpretations.

AryaUnderfoot · 28/08/2017 19:28

HaveToBeSure but didn't Dany's vision that was assumed to be Rhaegar/Elia also have Rhaegar saying "There must be one more, the dragon must have three heads". It's possible that Rhaegar thought Aegon was the Song of Ice and Fire but then went on to have another child with Lyanna as Elia would not have been able to carry another child.

yumyumpoppycat · 28/08/2017 19:30

Trills, that's true. The three eyed raven did say Bran wasn't ready, I suppose the lack of maturity is why he may misinterpret information or lack thoroughness.

HaveToBeSure · 28/08/2017 19:41

Absolutely Arya, and that is what makes it intriguing. How could Aegon no 1 be the song of ice and fire if he waa the son of fire and fire? How literal is this vision? what if he meant the three heads of the dragon all had to be called Aegon, and he had two now (ok, not really!)

I think the 3 heads part does point to the baby being Aegon no 1 but that the rest could strongly suggest in was Jon aka Aegon no 2. And if he thought the ptwp needed to be called Aegon (I can't tell why I think this, I'm sure there was a reference!) then even if the baby in the vision is Aegon 1 it still means Aegon also a plausible name for Job.

HaveToBeSure · 28/08/2017 19:43

*Jon. Fuck me I'm sunstroked!

Trills · 28/08/2017 19:47

Absolutely HaveToBe, just offering up how I felt and what I thought, not at all saying that other interpretations are wrong :)

Trills · 28/08/2017 19:49

Wasn't deliberately copying the word "absolutely " there :o

AryaUnderfoot · 28/08/2017 19:49

HaveToBeSure I think a lot of this relates back to the Ghost of High Heart telling Jenny of Oldstones that the Prince that was Promised would be born of the line of Aerys. I've forgotten all the stuff about Summerhall, but I think it has to do with the birth of Rhaegar.

I think there are misleading bits of all the prophesies and visions, but I still find it icky that Lyanna would name her son Aegon when Rhaegar already has a son by that name. It doesn't seem a very 'Stark-like' thing to do - especially for someone who supposedly has a similar personality to Arya.

Either way, I'm waiting (in hope) for GRRM to solve the mystery as I'm not sure we can trust D&D's interpretation. They couldn't even remember that Sam was a POV character FFS!

HaveToBeSure · 28/08/2017 19:50

Sorry Trills, I may have read that at first glance as you Being more forceful about your view being the only way to read it than you actually were.

Original poster
OlennasWimple · 28/08/2017 19:50

MN Baby Names post:

My second wife is pregnant and expecting a little boy. We are thinking of giving him a strong family name, so that everyone recognises his rightful place in the world. My first son already has this name and I have only just divorced my first wife, but that's alright isn't it? I don't think that my children will spend much time together, so it won't be too confusing

OP posts:
FindingNemoandDory · 28/08/2017 19:51

Once Jon and Daenerys hopefully hear via Jaime of Cersei's plans, maybe they should take all of their people and hide out overseas somewhere for a while and let Cersei's whatsit army with the elephants deal with the undead problem and then come back!

Only kidding but would love to see Cersei left to deal herself!

AryaUnderfoot · 28/08/2017 19:55

Olenna YABU. There are plenty of other names to choose from. How about Baelor or Daeron or Daemon or Aemon or Maekor?

What about Duncan - that's a good honourable name for a Targaryan?