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BartlettNet - The West Wing Appreciation Society - May Contain Spoilers!

442 replies

CaveMum · 19/05/2011 13:28

A thread for the discussion of West Wing - the best tv show ever made!

If you haven't seen all 7 Seasons be aware that this thread may contain spoilers!

OP posts:
Paschaelina · 27/05/2011 19:34

Wrt Josh and Donna, I always had the impression she was a bit of a drip who hung on his coattails at first, got more and more savvy as she got older til 8 years down the line shes now the emotionally more mature and in control. I think the episodes leading up to the lift scene show her being the one in charge, very much stronger now than Josh.

beachholiday · 27/05/2011 21:14

I dont find Richard Schiff "dumb" in the slightest Matsikula. He was asked to come up with an exit storyline for Toby. Then the writers came up with a very different one that he had difficulty beleiving as realistic for Toby. So he found a way to reconcile it in his head. I thought he played it extremely well. He obviously put a lot of thought and skill into it and did his best with what he was given, despite not liking the storyline himself.

changeforthebetter · 28/05/2011 10:16

What is this Toby/Josh thread of which you speak handsome? Grin

FWIW I find Donna's trajectory quite plausible and her first meeting with Josh where she manipulates the truth to land the job, points to her being smart if naive. She constantly challenges him from the outset. I know what everyone means about the will-they-won't-they, but actually if you do work long hours in tense environment where work is the be-all-and-end-all then heightened sexual tension does play a part in the general interaction although, the subsequent relationships can be very disadvantageous to the woman (often junior or perceived as such)

handsomeharry · 28/05/2011 11:28

Josh or Toby?

Where do you stand on this change?

Matsikula · 28/05/2011 16:27

I don't mean that Richard Schiff is actually stupid, I was being a bit flippant. But I don't think actors are the best judges of what makes the best entertainment (or art).

For me, the way the old team disintegrates, for various reasons, is one of the things that makes the last season gripping. There's actually a bit of darkness in there.

Alldownhillnow · 28/05/2011 20:28

OOOh, just found this thread. Me and my DH are starting to work our way through the WW Boxset having watched it originally on TV. We've become box-set devotees having completed The Wire and then The Sopranos... in a very short space of time Blush

The West Wing is just as good second time round, probably better now that our DCs are older and we don't have the same bedtime interruptions. Smile

We're just finishing Series One and looking forward to working our way through the others.

Hassled · 28/05/2011 20:33

Alldownhillnow - enjoy! Second (or even fourth) time around is always better - you spot stuff you hadn't noticed, you understand things that had baffled you.

I didn't find Donna's rise to political big-wigging surprising - yes, there was some naivety but she was always bright, and ambitious - even in Series 4 she's asking Josh for more to do.

OhmeoOhmyo · 28/05/2011 20:48

I thought the way Donna came across when she did join the Russell then Santos campaign was believable. Also how surprised Josh was that she was so savvy.
CJ mentions how Donna's outgrown the job as Josh's assistant when they have that lockdown and are discussing the CODEL. Which I only realised isn't Code L but Congressional Delegation.

Alldownhillnow · 28/05/2011 20:58

Its brilliant to be able to listen to the quick-fire dialogue again and watch the characters develop. I think that Aaron Sorkin wrote the first season and his script is a delight.

Hassled · 28/05/2011 21:06

Aaron Sorkin wrote the scripts up to the end of Series 4.
There is maybe the odd little dip after that but on the whole I think the standard of the writing was maintained well for 5, 6 and 7.

Alldownhillnow · 28/05/2011 21:14

Ah yes, I seemed to remember that he did not write up to the final series and yes, it remained one of the best programmes we've watched - through to the last episode.

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CaveMum · 28/05/2011 23:01

So glad this thread is still going! I'm currently halfway through season 2 in my mammoth rewatch-fest!

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hr100 · 28/05/2011 23:13

I heart WW!

Its my favourite programme of all time. Cant get enough of it.

I was always a huge Josh and Donna shipper so was happy they got together. Josh is my ideal man. I love the ep when he meets J Lucas for the first time, sat there in his vest. Oh and the time he finds the website about him.

2 cathedrals still makes me cry now, my bf at the time said I ruined that ep as I cried so loudly for most of the episode.

changeforthebetter · 29/05/2011 10:39

handsome I would like Josh and Toby as mates - I would struggle to keep up with quick fire banter (I know it isn't real life Grin). Sam is a probable (even though Rob Lowe is reputed to be a berk IRL). But I am a Santos-ista and always will be (though I find the malevolent Hoynes appealing too Blush even though he is a cad and a bounder Grin)

Scarletbanner · 29/05/2011 10:53

The best TV series EVER, no question! I wasn't sure about the endings either. Too many loose ends conveniently tied up. And Josh and Donna wouldn't have happened. Bradley Whitford said he thought it would have been more appropriate for Josh to end up with Amy, but the audience wanted it to be Donna ...

When I grow up, I want to be CJ.

handsomeharry · 29/05/2011 13:16

How weird change I find Hoynes very appealing too. I think like all philanderers he has an air of vulnerability that many women can't resist - which makes him so successful.

Matt Santos is dazzling. Grin

After his briefcase was taken one of the characters said 'there have been rumours about Santos for years'.

What does anyone think that meant?

I (naively) thought of Matt Santos as totally devoted to his wife and family and believed the story about his brother 100%.

changeforthebetter · 29/05/2011 21:01

Harry - nah I sadly concluded that Santos was a Play-uh but that his wife, a good Catholic, had gone along with it for the sake of the fam-ilee and because he is hot. I don't buy the brother argument. He fathered another child while is wife was preggers or newly delivered of firstborn. In any other circumstances, that would make him a prize twunt - but hey, he is Matt Santos...........

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CaveMum · 29/05/2011 21:23

t'would probably go over their heads change Wink

OP posts:
Fuzzywood · 29/05/2011 21:33

Just watched the episode where Josh sends out those 2 supporters dressed as chickens to try to get Santos in the debates. CJ asking Josh why he never told Donna not to engage with a human chicken on TV makes mediums everytime.
I completely believed the Santos' brother story....

tribpot · 29/05/2011 21:33

No way is Santos a player. It is - scuse the pun - inconceivable. Obviously if you are as fabulously good looking as he is there are always going to be rumours but no right-thinking man would cheat on the fabulous Helen Santos. I believe in Brother Santos!

Which reminds me, why on earth was CJ co-opted to introduce Mrs Santos to her domestic staff? She's the President's chief of staff for god's sake. Could Margaret not have done the introductions in the absence of whoever-it-was was meant to do it?

Now talking of players, I really hated Doug Westin (the President's son-in-law). Always did, even before he turned out to be an adulterous shitbag. Really hope Liz booted him and lived up to the fabulousness inherent in all Bartlet ladies.

Fuzzywood · 29/05/2011 21:34

That was supposed to say makes me laugh everytime Blush

NormanTebbit · 29/05/2011 22:15

If Santos was a 'playa' doesn't it make sense then that be' made Vinick secretary of state? Obviously Vinick coulda won the election if Santos was really a shagger, but he decided to be honourable instead thus compelling Santos to endure Vinick was 'in the tent pissing out.'

tribpot · 29/05/2011 22:17

Norman, I can't quite follow your post, are you typing on a phone?

I did like the 'playa' pun though - Spanish for beach.

handsomeharry · 29/05/2011 22:59

Divided opinions then. I think I will stick to my original opinion. I want Santos to be faithful to his wife and I do actually think I could be right.

I also wondered why CJ was making so many phone calls to the journalist who broke the story about the military space shuttle. Were they having an affair? If not, why so many phone calls?

I just remember Margaret being questioned and couldn't quite work it out.

BTW, thank God I found this thread. I don't know anyone in RL who watches WW. Shock

OhmeoOhmyo · 30/05/2011 07:11

I don't think Santos was lying about his brother. I think the way both he and Vinick were portrayed, if Santos had been the father he would have admitted it in that briefcase scene and Vinick would have kept it to himself.

CJ and Greg Brock - the many calls. I wondered about that and think it was a case of their getting on from her time as Press Secretary and him trying to get information out of her as CoS and both of them enjoying the game.

Maybe I'm naive Grin

I watched the 3rd State of the Union episode last night when there's a power cut during the polling and Josh is freaking out. Joey Lucas is late because her plane had mechanical difficulties and she says something like, "As a child I didn't pay attention in aircraft maintenance class." She's great. "Joshua Lyman you have the cutest ass in professional politics." "Said" by Kenny. He was great too.

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