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Crimson Petal

266 replies

Frimblypoo · 06/04/2011 21:37

Chris O'Dowd's todger! I can't watch the IT crowd in the same way again!

OP posts:
Bue · 28/04/2011 11:59

Thanks confuddled. I presume that's all in the book? Maybe I missed something but I had a hard time figuring out Agnes's illness in the TV program - I didn't know if she was ill before the birth or if some sort of trauma from the birth set off her illness.

ZillahWhoDrankTooMuchGin · 28/04/2011 12:31

Loved all 4 episodes and have no desire to read the book oddly (and i am a bookey) - just leaving it as it is is good for me. I must admit the thought that she might go back to prostitution with Sophie occured to me but i was roundly chastised by DH (who is far more of a romantic than me). But admittedly that doesn't chime with the 'soft bed' bit which is the antithesis of her own mother who would whip the covers off.

Had Sophie stayed she would have been rich and privileged yes, but at what cost...maybe to go the way of her mother...

also........i know this is petty but the 'second wife' was far too old to be considered surely - unless she was absolutely loaded. There's a big chance she couldn't give him the son he desired - wouldn't he be after a younger brood mare?

SilkStalkings · 28/04/2011 13:57

Bue Agnes rejected her baby because she didn't know she was pg, she didn't know that babies grew inside women. She thought it was a demon (her being so unclean and not being a proper catholic etc) that eventually gave her a v traumatic experience and if it looked like a baby she knew better and wasn't going to have anything to do with it. Am I right that Dr Curlew gave her a hysterectomy immediately after or did I mishear that? Millions of women today struggle with post natal post traumatic stress disorder but the difference is they have to deal with perhaps not bonding/feeling how they think they should, Agnes was totally indulged and nobody explained anything to her.

RoyalFucker · 28/04/2011 14:42

I think whether you think it is a happy ending or a sinister one is a measure of your own character Wink

< was first to say that Sugar was taking Sophie to a bawdy house >

< ahem >

SueSylvesterforPM · 28/04/2011 15:03

Does sugar try and kill the baby?? I sa her mix a potion on a floor and stopped it couldnt bear to watch longer , too squeamish Blush

RoyalFucker · 28/04/2011 15:32

sue, she managed to make herself lose the baby Sad

SueSylvesterforPM · 28/04/2011 15:38

How so?

ZillahWhoDrankTooMuchGin · 28/04/2011 15:45

She poured poison up herself (an early sort of pessary)....she spoke to the other prostitute about how much it stings / burns....so i'm guessing it's pretty common practice. Then she threw herself down the stairs but that didn't work. The assumption ia she continued to poison herself until it happened (in the loo at his factory - it was not nice).

RoyalFucker · 28/04/2011 15:46

she repeatedly inserted something toxic (borax and something else, can't remmeber) vaginally and threw herself down the stairs

it then showed her bleeding heavily a few days later

SueSylvesterforPM · 28/04/2011 15:55

Oh god I can't watch anything like that

RoyalFucker · 28/04/2011 15:58

I know, it was rather upsetting (especially for anyone who has experienced something similar)

EricNorthmansMistress · 28/04/2011 16:19

Zinc and borax. It was so sad, she obviously didn't want to, I think she had wanted to keep the baby and hoped William would acknowledge it or marry her. When it became clear he wouldn't she realised she had to get rid :(

ZillahWhoDrankTooMuchGin · 28/04/2011 16:23

Yes the 'oh you stupid girl' bit with the photo was very sad...

ChickensHaveNoEyebrows · 28/04/2011 16:25

The baby issue really brought it home to me how lucky I am to live in a time where contraception is available and women have options. William's utter disdain for her when the doctor grassed her up was chilling. Babies were obviously a woman's problem Hmm

EricNorthmansMistress · 28/04/2011 16:35

And her letter - so clearly telling him she had been pregnant but had got rid of it, and would never let it happen again, and he still cast her out :(

It really hit me too, what a battle women faced, all the time.

loveruthwatson · 28/04/2011 16:56

Yes. 'Four Months, Three Weeks and Two Days' (film about illegal abortion in 80s Romania), was on filmfour last night and DH and I had a long conversation about it all. He was really shocked at the lengths women go to (and have gone to since time immemorial), not to be pregnant - it's not something he's ever had to consider.

SueSylvesterforPM · 28/04/2011 19:07

Yes. 'Four Months, Three Weeks and Two Days' (film about illegal abortion in 80s Romania), was on filmfour last night and DH and I had a long

I bet that film was bleak, sounds interesting though

WildhoodChunder · 28/04/2011 20:08

Does the book explain what happened to Christopher? There was a shot of a boy in a gutter when William was looking for Sugar in the old brothel area, I wasn't sure if that was supposed to be him or not...? I was expecting Sugar to go back for him as she promised. I suppose it would have been hard for her to do anything about his situation, but she could have slipped him a bit of her savings to make his life a little better - she seemed to just abandon him once she got herself out of Mrs Castaways.

AvonCallingBarksdale · 28/04/2011 21:26

I second RoyalFucker's recommendation for Under The Skin, Michel Faber's other book. It's one of the best, most unsettling, oddest books I've ever read. The only other thing I've read that was similarly odd was Isiguru's (sp) Never Let Me Go, although IMO Under The Skin is much, much better. I'm voting for Sugar and Sophie finding Agnes, who will be better, and then the three will live happily together forever.

SilkStalkings · 28/04/2011 21:55

She had Pennyroyal in her handbag which is the most famous abortion herb. The zinc and borax douche hadn't worked.

I too wondered if that boy at the end was supposed to be Christopher.

Anyway, my copy of the book arrived today, join me in the Reading Room in a couple of weeks anyone? (avid knitter=slow readerGrin)

WillowFae · 28/04/2011 22:07

In the book you never really know if it was Agnes in the Thames. There is nothing about her cutting her hair so that was something added by the screenplay writer to give a more definite answer.

CArolCArol · 28/04/2011 23:15

What on earth are we all going to talk about now that it's over?!

Jajas · 28/04/2011 23:41

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

haggis01 · 29/04/2011 16:17

So sad this has ended thought the BBC did a fantastic job - but would have loved more episodes.If you liked it - then please read the book you will not be disappointed -so much more detail about Sugar's life, childhood flashbacks, helping William and the whole Mrs Fox and Henry story which is so much more substantial and amusing.Also the Agnes story is much more complex too.

Spoilers if you want to read the book - but to answer some questions that have been raised

In the book - Sugar has plenty of money that she has saved from when she lived in Priory Close with William and his lawyers sent her an allowance. She reckons she has enough to take her "to the ends of the world" and stuffs it all in her coat when leaving. She only gives Agnes £5 to get the train (not all her money - like it seems in the TV adaptation) as even such a note would be suspicious for a "poor" woman as Agnes is dressed when she escapes to have.

Christopher and his mum leave Mrs CAstaways when Jane Pierce takes over - Jane tells Sugar she does not know which house they have gone to. Sugar feels guilty she didn't take him to Priory Close as her servant.

Lady Constance Bridgelow is a widow in the book with a son and is only 30 years old (older than Agnes 23/25 and Sugar 19)so could still provide an heir for William (her husband made bad investments so she has come down in the world by living in Notting Hill). I think the TV series needed to make it clearer that William wanted to move on with Lady Bridgelow and so he wanted to ditch Sugar and have a normal life, also a case of poor casting with a much older actress.

Agnes does not cut her hair in the book but does get on the train to Lostwithiel (the carriage is described) and is rescued although Sugar does not know this - I suppose the haircut allowed the audience to clearly see the dead body was not Agnes and then Sugar knows it wasn't Agnes when Cheeseman remarks on the dead body's hair.

SilkStalkings · 29/04/2011 17:14

Aaah, wondered what placename would have appealed to Agnes - Angel IslingtonGrin, Peacehaven, Co(n)ventry etc. Lostwithiel has its charm I suppose.