swearing and shouting wanting no boundaries,i can't see a way forward

[thebestofit]

our dd is angry about staying out and having her own way without permission
when i picked her uplast night and said she had to come home not stay at friends house she went mad screaming and shouting at me in the street and car i was actually a bit scared.
I had been keeping the peace letting her do more or less as she pleased within reason but her dad said to be firmer so i grounded her for going out without permission but she won't stick to the grounding just stays out.When i went to get her she became totally out of contrl f*ing and blinding,calling me a fing b*ch and said she would run off.
I feel very worried and don't know whether to call parentline[if she is out] or actually wish i myself could just leave as her dad is inconsistent and not helping and i can't take any more.
she is 16 in the summer and if this carries on she'll have to move out i don't know if that involves a social worker or not.
Any genuine advice please but don't be too ott in what you say as this is becoming very worrying and fragile

i would say dont remove everything though as then she may feel ive lost everything so it dont matter any more. I would also keep the consequences quite short ie week not weeks or months. I would also say to be consistent say if they are grounded for the week stick to it even if she is good still stick with it.

teenagers are incredible amount of hard work.

oh and above all if she swears at you or shouts do not shout or swear back no matter how hard it is just walk away and say you will not listen while she speaks like that.

Does DH think this is accetable language for his younger child t be exposed to?
hes being really unfair

if needed plase employ this seconf step. get all her friends addresses and go round and speak to their parents and tell them that you would appreciate it if they didn't allow your daughter to stay round at their house.

tell your daughter you have done this

tell her kerfew is 10pm.

tell her dors are locked a 10pm

lock the bloody doors at 10pm and leave a quilt in the garden

hmmm not sure if i would agree with leaving her outside for the night

seriously remove the stuff - its alpha female shit in your house - your are scared of her and thinking about involving social services ( who won't do anything becuase i tried to do the same thing many years ago)

and you are going to show her you are alpha female by crying when she comes downstairs and emotional drama.

i can guarentee you where it hurts is mobile phone, msn and make up.

its chest beating time - its you r house, your rules.

i am sure you have tried every other way to placate and accomodate her before you got to this point.

You poor thing. I've no experience of having teenagers, just teaching them and being one. What I might do:
Sit down with her and have a very adult conversation - she needs to be treated as an adult now really.
Explain why you need boundaries - you love her and care for her and need to know she is safe. She may think she can look after herself as well she might, but it's important to have someone know where you are in case something happens - I'm 32, but still call my Mum if I'm leaving the country and leave my DP notes if I go somewhere unusual.
Discuss with her what boundaries will be acceptable for both. Treat what she says seriously even if she says "I just want to do what I want" so ask her what does she want? Reiterate that you must know where she is for her safety so saying she is "going out" is not OK, but saying she is going to the park to hang out or to a friends is fine, but she needs to let you know what time to expect her back as you'll worry otherwise.
Speak to her about the way she made you feel by swearing at you last night. Appeal to her better side, surely she doesn't really want you to be afraid of her?
Speak to her at another time seriously about moving out. Discuss what she'll do for money, how she'll decorate her flat etc. Show her you're on her side, but point out the difficulties without saying "let's just see how you manage then with no money etc".
Make it clear you love her no matter what, but you need to work things out in an adult way. Bite your tongue and be as diplomatic as you can without bending over backwards and OKing things that you aren't OK with.
Does she have a mobile? Can she call you when out? Can you offer her a mobile or paying for her credit (to a limit!) as a carrot?
Once you can open up a dialogue hopefully you can work it out - but how to actually get that chat?!?

kentmumtj - i agree with maing the punishments short - but the op can't keep to the punishemnt of grounding because the kid just walks out. - what other solutions would you employ ( oher than saying you don't agree with mine that is)

i think it would be mor beneficial to the op to have a range of ways .

she has mine

whats yours ?

Not that my DD is a teen yet, but I do not think that calmly discussing boundaries with someone who calls you an effing bitch is really going to cut the mustard.

What will she say, "oh yes mummy, I'm sorry I crossed the boudries."

I'm guessing here, but surely a 15 yr old realises that this is unacceptable.

I think too much apeasing has gone on and it is time for shock tactics.

Sorry, Custardo, didn't read your post.
If my Mum did that to me it would be all out war from then on. I utterly agree that there have to be consequences, but standing on the mobile is crazy! It'll hurt, but it won't keep the girl safe at night before her 10pm curfew, nor will it allow her to contact Mum and give a reasonable excuse for lateness or tell her she's in trouble.

i agree with removing some of her stuff but i think bit by bit rather than everything in one fail swoop. I have found mobiles, internet and hair straightners are good you can also remove things like TV (if she has one in her room)

I dont agree with destroying her make up or phone, i dont see what that would be teaching her.

I think limiting her money is something that should already be happening and making her earn it rather than her thinking its her god given right to just get it should apply immediatly.

i dont agree with locking her out for the night at the age of 15 and this is advice i would not recommend. Unless you know she has somewhere safe to go for the night.

I had a really tough time with ds1 between the ages of 13 and 17.

You have to take control.

Everything you do or provide for them has to be earned.

You remove everything but the very basics.

Your dd should be contributing as much as she is being given. In particular, she should be doing all her own cleaning and laundry.

Phone, tv, computer, spending/travel money has to be EARNED.

I honestly thought DS1 would end up in prison at one point. He is now at university and doing well.

It IS possible to turn this situation around.

I took away everything, you really HAVE to get tough. However, the most important thing is the absolute support of the other parent.

i agree you cant do this on your own you really need your dh support its vital.you dont want to create a scenario where she is playing you off against each other

i agree wil phoning friends mums but you do have to be prepared for some parents to tell you they dont agree with you and your dd can stay there when ever they want to.......and this does happen

she has gone out to rehearsal with bus money

she says i owe her an apology for ringing up other peoples mums and phoning her too much when it was perfectly ok to be out

that her grounding was not justified that is why she did not observe it,that everyone she told said they would leave home if they're parents did that

that she hates me and wants to move out that i am mean to her and she has told everyone that

part of this is total confusion when dad gets involved~he either goes over the top about revision or over indulges when i've said no.that won't change hes hopeless and i'm left to either follow what hes said or enforce rules he doesn't follow.This all kicked off cos he got involved last week and said she wasn't allowed out when i was ok with it ~he insisted she was elsewhere and i phoned her etc.But its me thats in the firing line
I have generally found she is better if i leave her to her own devices and don't phone but trust her.

She has just shouted in front of her little bro who started to cry she seriously wants to move out,that we haven't got on in years and to stop persecuting her and she hates me

i can't think clearly my first response is i should move out and she can stay with her dad.

i don't understand why she hates me so much~and she loves to tell everyone so

What a mess .Herdad only gets involved once in a blue moon and thats to undermine me he said today "the problem is between you and her,not me"

i asked her to sit down and put down basic groundrules,the three of us she said if she has what she wants on there~probably staying at boyfs house

i've been thru a lot in my life but today i want to be dead or move out i can't resolve this and she hates me anyway

The past is the past, she needs a way to move forward. She is acting like a child so she has to learn a way of acting as an adult. If she can't understand why boundaries are needed then you can start employing the "act as a child, be treated as one" routine. But surely it's best to give her a chance to act the grown up first?

Look if she hates you anyway, which I'm sure she doesn't, you have nothing to loose with the tough love option.

firstly you dont owe her an apology for ringing her or her friends mums you were acting as any parent who is concernded about their child would.

lets be honest no young person would agree that any grounding was wrong especially when tensions are running so high which i sense from your last post.

sh can not be allowed to stay at B/F she is under age for starters.

Many teenagers tell their parents hurtful things this is normal esp when things arent going so great at home.

I do agree however that her behaviour is totally unacceptable esp upsetting her younger sibling.

Do you have any organisations in your area that you could self refer yourself to. Something which may offer family therapy and individual counselling?

what rehearsal - whwere did she get the bus money?

Sounds like your biggest problem is her dad. It sounds as if he is making everything much worse.

With regard to "everyone she has told" Remember they will be getting her version, not yours.

I would confide in the other parents - IME most parents have problems with teenagers, and hopefully will want to be supportive.

I have given temporary houseroom to teenagers whose parents had thrown them out, but I made sure I talked to the parents to get their POV, and let them know their child was safe.

IME teenagers are often very well behaved with other people's parents......

I agree re the bus fare.

Don't give her money.

unless the rehearsals form part of her drama gsce's or something like that?

its totally like the name of that teenage parenting book

something like - i hate you - but will you give me a lift to kevins