15 year old has been suspended. Where do we go from here? Terrible behaviour

[Upset03829]

My son hates school. I cant express how much he hates it. But he also doesnt want to be homeschooling. He doesnt want to do any kind of academic learning.

We have had problems with behavior since he was 4 years old. Hes 15 now about to go into year 11. Its been a long hard slog.
He is desperate for validation, for people to like him , to be popular etc. At all costs. He has always been the class clown. Not making excuses for him but his teachers have always liked him despite this because he has a great personality. A cheeky chap.
That was until 2 years ago. I dont know if its hormones or what but he has changed beyond all recognition. That cheeky chap has gone. And has been replaced with someone full of anger, aggression and ideas that no rules apply to him.
School has been getting worse and worse. Not helped as its 80% boys, ive been told by his head of year that his year is a particularly bad year. There are 10 boys who are all similar, including my son. They bounce and feed off each other, egg each other on etc
Its at the point now where son is not learning anything, is spending large amounts of time outside of the classroom, and has become rude and argumentative with the staff.
Hes also started to become physical with other students
He has been suspended for persistent disruption and behaviour. Its been coming and im not surprised.
Thing is we just dont know what to do, neither do staff. We have put so many things in place to help him, even monetary rewards. He gets special treatment from them and still behaves this way.
I have to attend a reintegration meeting on Monday. All I see for year 11 is more of the same . I am empty, drained, have nothing left in me. Nothing works with him
Its devastating to watch and so sad because outside of school he is ok and when he leaves I think he will be ok. How do we cope with this?

Is there any single member of staff that he gets on with?
Sometimes a good relationship with someone who doesn't teach them can help. I've got a few students who check in with me every day just got a five minute chat - very low demand stuff - but they know where I'll be and they tend to pop their heads in whilst I'm teaching to say hi. It's a good mechanism for them to regulate.

These are my immediate thoughts!

I would definitely look at alternative provision in your area: small groups, targeted learning opportunities to appeal to his interests.

No hes not taking anything as far as I know. I know all of his friends. This aggression started 1 to 2 years ago, the gym is only a recent thing.

The staff who "had his back" are the ones who have suspended him so he hates them now too.

He has no intention of even trying to improve . I feel like there's no point in continuing.
Ive spoken to all of our colleges , none offer 14 to 16 courses.
He doesnt want to go to college or even an apprenticeship if it involves any kind of written work , studying or tests because thats what he hates.
Feel he is very limited until he is 18

When you say he has been referred for an ADHD assessment multiple times, who referred him and how far did you get? I was at your stage this time last year with my then year 10 DS.

I knew the NHS waiting list would be too long and we wouldn’t get anywhere before year 11. I was absolutely dreading year 11 .. suspensions, lack of caring about his GCSEs, meetings at school and our home life.

I couldn’t afford a private assessment myself so I borrowed the money and got him assessed. I don’t know if he would have got one through the NHS as like your DS he’s very well liked, can hold a great conversation and masks a lot.

Its been nothing short of a complete turnaround the last 12 months. He went on medication and almost overnight the detentions stopped.

He started caring about GCSEs, he’s calmer. We can now have lovely and normal conversations.

School were adamant he did not have ADHD - they said the same about DD too and she was then diagnosed by the NHS as autistic and ADHD.

None if us can know for sure re your DS of course and I was similar - but if you are / he is really struggling and you are dreading the road ahead then I definitely think it’s worth considering.

This. Pull him out for a fresh start. Even an online school like Kings Interhigh will be a change of environment and give him a chance to start over. He only needs Maths and English GCSEs so he can just do those and then either get a job or go to college.

How about getting a job as a Lifeguard or Personal Trainer or Football Referee? Maybe he'd enjoy those? I think neither qualifications involve any written work. A friend of my daughter's who failed her GCSEs did an equine care course at college - I think it was all mostly practical rather than any written work.

You say you think he'll do ok once school has finished. What is he going to do? What are his plans for the future?

Sometimes less is more.
He knows the routine. The chats, the why questions, the discussions.
What is needed is personal responsibility for his behaviour. Stop the discussions. If he has a mock paper and fails, get his teachers to say just state on the basis of the result he will fail. And leave it at that. And repeat it if he answers back.
I wonder if he might be a bit shocked and it would make him realise that soon not everyone will be running around after him asking him why etc.
He has to make it happen.

My daughter was suspended multiple times in Y9. Internal and external.

they claimed no sign adhd, her dad was diagnosed and then I paid privately for her. The turnaround since being on mediation is amazing. If she hadnt been diagnosed last summer she would be in a PRU by now I am pretty sure. She still doesn’t like school and it doesn’t go 100% smoothly but from where we were a year ago it’s amazing.

the problem is the more lessons they miss the harder they find them and it’s a vicious circle

Sign him up for the army. He’ll soon learn how to behave and what respect means. It sounds like his teachers have done him no favours making allowances for his behaviour.

Sounds really hard. What would he like to happen?

I can’t honestly understand how so many people think punishment is the answer to severe behavioural issues. That would absolutely only make things worse.

You’d said a lot about what he doesn’t want to do.

can he verbalise what he does want to do/ how he sees the next 5 years playing out?

It sounds like a very difficult situation for you. You have moved school once, so moving again even if you could find one to take him is unlikely to be helpful.

Academically is there a chance he would pass English or Maths if he engaged? What are his targets?
If you ask him what do you want to happen what does he say? Does he want you to deregister him?
Does he have any thoughts on what he will do to earn money? Any interest in any trades?
Would he condider a practical.college course at 16? An apprenticeship?
If he has some goal it might motivate some level.of engagement in Y11. He can leave in May nxt year. I would try and talk to him about these things and make a decision from there. From what you have said the options seem to be deregistering or continuing with his current school. I would stop with the bribes - they arent working & suggest to him that acceptable behaviour deserves an extrinsic reward. All you can do is communicate your expectations and discuss the implications of his choices. You cant make him comply.

At school leaving age you wont be chased if he doesnt attend college and gets a job or just stays at home. Education to 18 isnt directly enforced.
I dont mean this nastily, but i wouldnt assume everything will be ok when he leaves school. If he has no qualifications or skills he is going to struggle to get a job or apprenticeship. It is really tough.

What about Military Preparation College? They take them at 16 with no formal qualifications.

this is tough but I’ll say it anyway OP. You need to get

Is he hiding dyslexia? Lots of 14-16 years olds don’t like writing but his seems a bit more than that.

I don’t agree with the army suggestion - if he is struggling with authority then it won’t suit him. It might when he is older but the poor behaviour needs fixing.

Can you afford to get a private ADHD assessment? There’s no way on earth my dd would have got approved through the NHS. The school didn’t spot a thing as she masks so heavily so we paid for much needed assessments.

Posted too soon… I‘d suggest to seek out specialist help. And I hate to say but for your DSs sake I’d toughen up. This means stopping to buy into the long list of understanding, explaining and excuses:

• He hates school.
• He doesn't want homeschooling either.
• He doesn't want academic learning.
• Behaviour problems since age 4.
• Desperate for validation.
• Wants people to like him.
• Wants to be popular.
• Has always been the class clown.
• Teachers liked him because of his personality.
• "Not making excuses for him..."
• Something changed two years ago.
• Might be hormones.
• School is 80% boys.
• His year group is particularly bad.
• There are 10 boys like him.
• They bounce off each other.
• They egg each other on.
• He's not learning anything.
• He's spending time outside classrooms.
• Staff don't know what to do.
• They've tried lots of interventions.
• He gets special treatment.
• Outside school he is okay.

And: ‚When he leaves school he will probably be okay.‘ …are you sure?

Every suggested on here you have dismissed. It feels a bit like you have given up on him.

Good point. My dd was diagnosed with something called stealth dyslexia. It’s where if you’re quite bright, you compensate enough to hide this LD, therefore no one suspected dd had it. I always thought there was something strange with her spelling, as she spells some really simple words incorrectly, but has learned the spelling for more complex ones.

This is my 9 year old son to a tee (diagnosed adhd) and I often worry he will crumble around GCSEs with more expectation and less scaffolding. He also presents differently in different situations, calm at home where there are no academic expectations, hunger is addressed immediately, his own big bedroom and no kids pushing his buttons. Acts the clown, funny and extrovert until he feels out of control and being asked to do something he feels unable to do or won't be very good at. Usually writing, music, art.

It sounds to me like he is feeling a lack of control in his life, hence the gym and the health anxiety. Does he treat men and women in authority the same?

This reminds me a lot of my son, intelligent but constantly getting into trouble at school. His younger brother had textbook inattentive type ADHD, he was complete opposite - alert, aware. So I never even considered ADHD until he started really struggling with A Levels too (as I had at his age).

He was diagnosed when he was 17, and medication has hugely improved his studies - he had to drop an A Level before this point. He's more impulsive rather than hyperactive and not typically inattentive. Although he did repeatedly burn pizzas, miss trains, get to lessons late.

So if can be hard to identify however if your son has struggled since starting school this suggests even more the there is something making it hard for him to learn in the school environment.

I mean this kindly, but I can’t see anywhere in your responses that anyone has asked him what is going on for him.
School just isn’t right for some children (not just neurodivergent). Dr Naomi Fisher has some fab resources. Sending support