Are pre-teen and teenage boys always this crude?

[WoIsMe]

My 11-year-old DS got home from his first Scout camp this weekend, having been away for a week. His two older brothers always enjoyed Scout camps but DS came home very distressed. He enjoyed the activities during the day but was upset by the behaviour of the other boys during down time. He has previously complained about the boys in his year at school constantly swearing, talking about sex, and being obsessed with 69. I can see why this makes DS uncomfortable but it seemed like typical boys' joking around.

A few things he has said about Scout camp:

1. In their tent early on all the other boys took off their trousers and pants to look at each other's penises. DS refused to join in so they accused him of being transgender and not having a penis.
2. This later escalated to the boys hugging each other so their penises touched but only through their underwear.
3. On more than one occasion, he overheard boys talking about how much they hated gay people. When he said that was homophobic they said that was how they were brought up.

Tbh it all sounds to me like immature boys trying to impress each other by talking about things they don't really grasp and pushing social boundaries. I would like to know whether this is typical behaviour of teenage boys or if it really is as weird as DS found it. He starts high school in September and, if it's going to be like this, I think he's going to find it very difficult.

I think this should be communicated to the safeguarding lead of the camp.

I have a 12 year old boy and he is not like this. I would report this . A child was left feeling very uncomfortable abd was bullied for sexual reasons ???

This needs to go to an adult.

Erm no that’s not normal at all in my experience. Def needs reporting to the organisers.

I thought you were going to be talking about burping and farting.

I think a word with the safeguarding person is definitely in order. It's tricky to answer whether boys that age are always that crude as, as parents, we wouldn't see this. It's easy to say that our boys are not like that but they behave very differently when just with their peers.

Of course it's not normal at camp.
You should report the stripping, touching and homophobia to the scout safeguarding officer.

Absolutely not normal and a massive safeguarding concern!!!

Love how they hate gay people yet they rub thier dicks up against each other 😂

I'd report it, they sound like idiots

Huge safeguarding concerns, report to safeguarding lead and also to a contact within the Scouts to ensure that it goes higher up. I would take him out of the group so that he isn't with those children. Peer on peer sexual abuse is also abuse and there are lots of issues surrounding age of consent here.

learning.nspcc.org.uk/child-abuse-and-neglect/harmful-sexual-behaviour

This is what I thought 🤔🤣🤣🤣

If this happened on my lads scout camp I’d be raising hell. Of course you need to report it to the safeguarding lead

Boys that age can be very crude (they were when I was at school in the 1980s too) and they are at an age where they want to experiment and push boundaries. Obsession with sex, rude language, nudity and body functions is somewhat to be expected.

However, coercion and bullying of other children is never acceptable and it needs to be robustly challenged.

Looking back, I'm dismayed at the behaviour pre-teen and teen boys were allowed to get away with in those days. Exposing themselves, crude "banter", unwanted touching of other boys and girls. There was no "safeguarding" and it was all just dismissed as hijinks.

Ha! I remember this attitude from my schooldays as well. "Gay" to them just meant you had anal or oral sex with another male, or if you (french) kissed another boy. Lots of other experimentation happened between boys that I was aware of and it wasn't considered by them to be "gay".

Not much has changed from the looks of it. FWIW, the boys I knew who did this are married to women now.

I have a 13 year old DS and although him and his mates do undoubtedly have banter and I’ve heard first hand them talking about their bits, it’s not in a sexual nature as such and I’ve never ever heard them or been told they’ve seen each others privates (and DS would for sure tell me, he can’t hold his own water). I agree with above, safeguarding lead needs informing.

My ds recently had VERY similar issues like this recently at scout camp. He came home feeling really uncomfortable.

I decided to report it to the scout leaders and they took it really seriously. They contacted the safeguarding team at Scout HQ who called me for more information. It was then followed up with a call from social services to check on my ds’s well being. He was fine, just appalled really! The boy’s parents were also spoken to as there was a chance that one of the boys involved may have needed safeguarding.

Our Scout leaders are fab and I think it’s a really tricky age range to manage-from 10-14yrs. I’d like to think they’ll be putting something in place come next camp to ensure this type of thing isn’t seen as acceptable. There’s a fine line between boys being daft and things going too far.

Good to hear that they responded appropriately. It is so important that robust procedures exist to safeguard young people and their welfare.

Crude language is pretty standard from what I can tell, but everything you've mentioned is crossing a line op. As pp have said, the things they did can be considered peer on peer abuse and coercive as well as bullying behaviour. I'd take this pretty seriously and report it straight away if it was me. Your poor ds he must be feeling shaken

Thanks everyone, I've emailed the Scout Leader to see whether she noticed anything amiss.

@WoIsMe i think you’ve done the right thing. Will you let us know the outcome? I’d be interested to know if their response is similar to mine.

One of the main reasons I decided to take it further was for ds’s sake. I wanted him to know that ANY incident of that nature that he was uncomfortable with, I’d listen to him and take it seriously. The lady who called me from social services said ds obviously has a good sense of what is appropriate around private parts. I thought it incredibly important to support him.

It turned out that two other parents reported the incident too.

My Teen DS can swear and be a bit crude at times but he knows to reign it in around me and none of his friends would ever swear in front of someone elses Mum without a swift "sorry" immdeiately afterwards.
What you describe is very different and you ahve absolutely done the right thing in reporting it

Op what do you actually mean by this? Have you told the scouts leader what happened or have you just asked if they noticed anything. I hope you have told them everything.

You need to be direct, not passive.

I have just completed safeguarding refresher training for football coaching and this is off the scale, it needs dealing with.

It may be uncomfortable, but you need to report verbatim what your son has said.
In an educational setting this is a 'disclosure' and would be actioned immediately and taken v seriously. I understand that as his mother it is close to home and may feel like a difficult subject to broach, however it does need to be addressed seriously and with a full report of what your son has told you.

This is a safeguarding issue. The scout leader should take it very seriously and escalate to group / district leaders.

That's not normal for that age. Were all the boys 11 or were some older? My 11 year old and his friends are still little boys in most ways apart from now most of them have phones and they all call each other "bro". My 11 year old has started spending long periods talking on the phone with his best friends. My 13 year old is a lot more grown up in his behaviour and he is more interested in girls now but nothing like what you described.