making 16 years old to move out

[Ramiona]

Hi, so according to the law, 16 years can live independently but parents are responsible for them. How does it work? I have an almost 16 years old daughter who is highly abusive. I want her out, there is nothing I can do anymore with her behaviour. I am not able to control her. She has also OCD, and anxiety. She was challenging since I remember I was asking for mental help schools but they failed to provide anything. She can hit me and kick the door walls. The current situation is not good for my younger child and I am afraid I will finish with a stroke if I live longer under the same roof as my older daughter. I need to somehow move her out, there are no other family members to take her, and her father has rights taken away by the court. I do not want to involve the police as I lied to them already when she run away for half a day saying she will hit herself (they asked if she ever hit me and I said no even thou I have pictures proving otherwise but I didn't wanted put her in trouble). I don't want to cause her trouble I just want her out.

Thanks. But I wanted to clarify what I was referring too. As this is really important for any parent going through child to parent violence. I am a social worker and my area is adolescent safeguarding. I m currently the team manager of an adolescent homelessness /leaving care unit.

After a child is arrested for violence in the home, they're taken to police station and questioned
Usually no charges are bought as it is a cinsidered to be "family dysfunction" and the police will make a referral to social care to look at supporting the family to stabilise home life. We all know from this thread that unless a child's circumstances are clearly understood they're not usually ready to engage in all this
Despite the massive efforts of the parents. If you take that call from the police and refuse to have the child home and cannot provide an alternative place for the child to stay (even temporarily) then the police will take the child into police protection
This lasts up to 72 hours
In that 72 hours the social work team (like mine) will then have to explore networks around the child to see where they can go
If this is exhausted then we have no option left but to accommodate them
IF they're 16 they can sign themselves into a section 20 voluntary agreement. If not parents need to sign this.

During the period of a accommodation we have about a month to complete a Southwark judgment assessment which will look at whether a child is now homeless. One of the criteria of this is parental abandonment
If the criteria of the SJA is met then then child will remain in accommodation till their 18th birthday and be subject to leaving care services.

They can also be assessed as being independent enough to live by themselves in some situations and the local housing depth will.house. they remain a child in need but when they turn 18 they are not in leaving care.

I really feel for the parents of children going through this
.it's so hard and I cannot imagine how difficult it is to say they cannot be at home anymore. But I do believe that some space between the child and family is needed at some points to calm the situation down.

Good luck.

Evening. A further point as I was rushing with getting to work when I posted earlier. A child under 16 cannot be subject to a Southwark Judgment assessment, that's only for kids 16/17. So if your child is under 16 and you refuse to have them home due to violence, the safeguarding of younger children etc, then they will be section 20. Then if they can't return home for whatever reason the Local Authority social work team will usually start proceedings to seek PR of the child. As that makes it easier for decision making for the child.

That's helpful. Can you clarify something for me - I have a 16.5 old son. He is violent and abusive to us (his family). We have called the police numerous times, never pressed charges, always have him back. This time though he decided he wanted to voluntary sign a section 20 without our approval. We had said to the local social services that he is not homeless. We have offered him accomodation back with us, and also his older sister in another city. He has refused those offers and wants to live 'independently' (i.e., he wants to sign a section 20). We have argued he is not applicable for supported housing as he is not homeless. It is going to the senior managment team - in your experience, will they give him housing as he's voluntary signing the section 20 himself (even though we have offered housing options)?

sorry - just to add. He is stating that he doesn't 'feel safe to return to our house as he is putting us in danger' (I assume not only with his violence, but also some of the people he associates with who have come to our house). We do not want him to go into supported housing but we don't seem to be able to stop him signing the section 20 and are currently arguing with SS about whether he is applicable for accomodation when we wish to house him

It depends on what they are offering him? At his age if he had poor skills to look after himself they should put him in foster care. This should all be explored in the SJA. You need to ask to see a copy of this.

Yes he can sign himself into Sec 20 , but it is very unusual in my experience for a team manager to agree this if a family is agreeing to accommodate the young person themselves. Trying to get approval for accommodation is literally like pulling teeth.

I think they have more information he has told them. Is he being exploited by gangs/cse? Is he going missing for long periods of time. What has he told about the risks to your family? You should have all this information to be able to safeguard yourselves.

Just to add a 16/17 year old can live in a supported housing scheme under section 20 also. It doesn’t have to be a foster care placement.

Being section 20 for 13 weeks before 18th birthday actually gives them more support post 18 rather than limited support. Also care leavers ( of any time in care) gives them priority need status if they have to make a homelessness application in the future ( automatically up to age 21) which means they will get Emergency accommodation if necessary.

Section 20 can be a positive thing.

He is currently on a placement because he was released into the care of the local authority on remand after attacking us and his social worker. He has now been sentenced (YOT) for 12-months supervision but now wants to stay on the placement even though we want him home. He is at risk of exploitation but we feel we can protect him better than the local authority.

Thanks so much for your reply

The placement is supported accomodation with 3 LAC...when I speak to the placement they say he is happy

So he was remanded to the care of the local authority. That's why the LA has accommodated him as its court ordered. Ordinarily no LA would agree to have a child accommodated if the family have somewhere for the child to live. Now he's on a Supervision Order, his remand to the LA should end. Remand to the Care of the local authority is an alternative to remand to custody.

Is he on a Supervison Order as part of child care proceedings or on a supervisor Order via the youth criminal courts? I am assuming youth court? As he would have been on an interim care Order otherwise? In child acre proceedings a Supervision Order is usually granted as part of a final court order when a child is safe enough to go home.

I understand what you are going through. You must be at the end of your tether. You have other members of your family to protect and bting up but you are probably giving all your attention to the abusive older child. Social services (ss) are not very helpful as they admit themselves that they do not have the resources to be able to filly help. In my case I am sure that they only jolly you along until the 'child' is out of thier remit due to age.My partner of 3 years 16 year old (in 4 weeks) hasn't been to school for 2 years. He is verbally abusive to his Mum and on one occasion punched her in the stomach when she tried to wake him to attend a meeting with social services (ss). This is particularly bad as she has stomach issues and has a stoma. He played on his computer all night and slept through the day. When he attends meetings with ss he clams up and won't answer questions except for calling his Mum a liar and a 'dickhead' in the last meeting yesterday. The Internet goes off at between 9 and 10pm so he cannot use it however this action effects the whole household. They live in a small 2 bedroom flat in which he has his own room. His younger 10 year old brother (which the older child hates and has threatened to kill him), has to share a bedroom with his mother which is actually the living room divided by furniture into two rooms. I have my own place but moved in to hers to support both him and her but he refuses to talk to me regarding getting his sleep routine back to normal. He refused to let me in with yesterday's meeting with a psychologist. I believe he sees me as a threat to his comfortable life treating his Mum as a domestic slave. I have only gently offered my help to him but he is not interested. I could go on but you probably know how things are. I was looking on here just like you to find out what she can do but I am writing this just so you know that there are many others in this situation and if we keep talking then an answer for us may come to light. Stay safe.

Can you give an update on what has happened to you and your daughter since this post please? I’m in similar circumstances.

Do you even like your daughter?

Because you seem to see her as an inconvenience you can't wait to get rid of...

What treatment has she been receiving? what help have you sought for her?
is she taking any medication?

You really need to start engaging with services and get some external help for her sake.

Having things like WiFi ,tv, gaming she thinks is her right. Yes she’s is your daughter but she is not grateful whatsoever. My16 year old son is the same. He has everything he wants, but he is not at all grateful and behaves aggressively to me, breaks things in anger. Is disrespectful and calls me names a lot. Gives me orders or else he will smash the place up. I’ve told him how ungrateful he is and he just verbally abused me.I’m trying to not buy him stuff that he wants as much now. They have to realise that without us they wouldn’t have anything. We are their parent and they should respect us and appreciate what we do for them.
We have the social services involved now. It’s got to the point where he’s on the verge of being put into local Authority Care. It’s so heart breaking and shameful. This only happens to other families that are classed as ‘problem families’. I never imagined it would come to this.
I have depression and on meds. My son has low functioning Autism. He also has anxiety and I think depression. He needs meds as well as psychological help. I am going to call our Gp on Monday. All he was offered before was counselling which hasn’t helped much. I also need him to go away. I’m at the end of my tether. I was sleeping in my car last night to get away from him. Someone in my street noticed me lying down and looked through the window. I felt so embarrassed.

I find the judgement on here so utterly disappointing.
i don’t know if any of you who are suggesting accessing mental health support actually watch the news? If so you will realise that this support is virtually non existent.
This poor woman is clearly at the end of her tether.
How any of you think your sanctimonious pearls of wisdom will in any way help her is beyond me.
If you cannot offer realistic helpful advice, why try to make her feel worse?
Hope your lives continue to remain perfect.

Honestly when your life is this out of control I do not care what ignorant people say or think - they simply have no idea, not a clue about what others on here have to go through. Let them judge...let them be the judgmental idiots they are - they are just clueless so they are talking rubbish. Anyone who says 'your child needs mental health support' is just ignorant - they have no idea of how many times we have asked for support, How there is no support. Maybe when they next need an ambulance they will suddenly realise that there is no health care anymore - and mental health care is even further down the list than physical healthcare.
@Chezer11 : you need respite, You need to get a section 20. You need a break. No-one can take it for long periods of time. My stress levels were so high that if I heard a door shut loudly I would go into a shock response - heart rate high, full of fear - is that him just about to kick off? You have to have a break - you have to get a section 20. It is not permanent. But you have to get your stress levels back down because it is untennable to sleep in your car

I just wanted to say to anyone going through child to parent abuse there is a really really nice support group on facebook called PEGS - noone is judging you there. Everyone is going through this and everyone helps each other