Dd 13 has shut down and won’t talk to us

[Justonecat]

Dd is so unhappy. She has no friends, she is at a school which is (mostly) demographically different from us, and she hasn’t made any real friendships.

Her academic performance has really deteriorated to the point where she is below average in every single subject (used to be in top sets in primary and had CATs of 133 just as a reference).

Up until recently she was involved in a sport which took up nearly all her spare time since about seven years, she was successful but we couldn’t really tell if she enjoyed it or if she resented spending so much time on it.

We have had something like 12 discussions with her, trying to understand why she is having these academic/social/motivational struggles, but she can’t really explain. She doesn’t say anything. We offered her to change schools, even home school, to keep her sport, to do more of the sport, or to quit, but she did not express a preference one way or another, so we were at a loss.

Something was clearly making her feel pressured and it was clear that her situation wasn’t working for her. She swears she isn’t being bullied, or harassed online or in person, or anything like that. There is some low level unfriendly behaviour towards her in school such as people not wanting to sit next to her in class and such, but nothing more than that.

We recently made the difficult decision to take her out of her sport. We hope this will give her more time to catch up on her studies without the time pressure, and to hopefully connect more with people at school. We have encouraged her to join a few after school clubs so she has something to do, and we are also hoping she will make friends this way. It’s hard, as this sport was a huge part of her life for so long, but school has to come first, so we didn’t feel we had any other options.

Did we make the right decision? What can we do to make her talk to us?

sorry, this probably doesn’t make much sense, but it just felt good to write it all down.

What did she say OP, when you told her about your decision about the sport? Did she express any feelings either way?

This. She sounds like I was at that age. Finally got a diagnosis at 43

I can understand why your DH thinks that this is the solution, but when she’s not telling you anything it means you’re operating blind and any changes you make are as likely to make things worse as improve things.

Maybe it’s a gender thing and that’s why your DH isn’t seeing it but exclusion is a very common form of bullying among girls. She’s isolated. Telling her to ‘Toughen up’ makes it sound like it’s a character flaw. Does she have friends at her sport? Does she socialise with those people? If she does, stopping that will isolate her further.

I’d ask her to go off on her own and write down how she feels about being in that school, how she feels about the school work and how she feels about her sporting commitments. Does it make her happy, sad, tired, bored etc. What are the good bits and the bad bits. When she’s done that, ask her if it’s ok for you to read it. Sometimes it can be hard to say things but easier to write them down.

Removing something from her life that she loves, is beneficial to her physical and mental and is part of her identity is wrong. Your dd does not sound happy but removing sport will not make her more social or happier. It will do the opposite. I'd chat to her, explain your reasoning and re-I state the sport.

With all due respect you seem very out of touch with your child.

I am not sure if you are from a culture where every ounce of energy is focused upon eduction but I can tell you that here you must step back because you are going to ruin your daughters educational experiences and attainment if you don’t change your approach and attitude.

This child seems so unhappy. You need to chat to the school asap

I am hoping she will enjoy being a ‘normal’ teen, with time to hang out a bit after school and not constantly being rushed off for training. I really hope she will embrace it but I am worried we are wrong.

My husband is insensitive when it comes to dd and her school situation, it does annoy me but I can’t change his mind on this. He seems to think that as long as you don’t get your head flushed in the loo, it’s not bullying, and you need to just get on with things.

Dd has actually been assessed by both a psychologist and a psychiatrist, it was a while ago, she was diagnosed with (mild) adhd, and she is receiving support (meds & classroom adjustments) for this. No ASD came up

By the way a massive thank you to everyone who has responded. It’s SO helpful to get an outside perspective.

Can she still do the sport recreationally now instead of intense training as a compromise?

Also have you considered something like Guides as a way to get her involved socially in something outside of school if school friendships are tricky.

Girl social groups at this age are a minefield. If she is still very unhappy consider moving school. I said no to my mum about moving school, but in retrospect it would have been better for me to have a clean start somewhere than deal with the thousand cuts low level bullying I experienced and the subsequent impact to my confidence.

She absolutely sounds like she could be autistic. The wheels often fall off when they start secondary school, especially girls. Please look into this as it could be a possibility. Good luck and I hope you manage to work it out!

Nope, not from one of those cultures you describe, continental Europe… not from a background of high achievers or anything like that. I explained a little further up that this latest school report was more of a red flag to us that something isn’t right in her life right now, as she has slipped in every single subject, it’s the root cause we want to sort out, not the academics as such

Does the school provide any counselling/ pastoral support?

Sometimes at that age it is difficult to talk to your parents but she might talk to another adult who is used to working with teenagers.

I think the 'people not wanting to sit with her' might be the tip of the iceberg. Some kids who are being bullied will really underplay it to parents as they don't want a fuss, so I would be concerned about that.

We did have a chat with the school in September, on how to combine school and her sport, and also the social situation at school. We also had a meeting in year 7, to discuss the social side, my daughter attended both meetings. The school has not picked up on anything which would cause any concern. They have quite a few troublemakers in this school, and also a few girls with mental health concerns which have manifested in school, so I imagine they have their hands full of more urgent business.

Has she made no friends because she is not accepted as being the same culturally by the other girls?

If it was the report that flagged it up, I would seek a chat with the teachers and tutor.
I often find they are only happy to help in any way they can.
Friendships are a huge drama in y7 and y8.
Things do settle down by y9 usually.
Maybe present a list of options to DD and see if she prefers any.
Maybe home schooling sounded very drastic to her.
As I said, they want to be helped but don't know what they want and how to be helped.
Not easy OP but try a few things is all I would say.

I think pulling her out of a sport is a huge mistake, sorry. I don't know what sport this was but if it's something like swimming or gymnastics you could ask for less hours etc.
It's so depressing how girls are pulled out of sport at a time they need it the most. I wonder if your DH would've been so keen to do this if this was a son.
What does he imagine she's going to be doing after school if she's miserable in school?
I think you'll really, really regret making her stop the sport.

Apologies. I see you have spoken to school

Second this. Sounds exactly like my dd. She is now diagnosed with ASD and ADHD. Would never have guessed.

Currently things are worse. School attendance is 65 percent and she is on sertraline.

It's awful op.

You have made a momentous decision about your 13 year olds life and sense of self without seeming to even understand how she feels about it.
Is your DD on social media?
Has she recently started her periods?
If my child was desperately unhappy I would keep her off school with me everyday if I was at home until we worked out together what was the matter.
This whole false after school club positivity and just getting on with it sounds like a load of bullshit.
Your husband sounds like an arsehole.

So the school don't have any concerns but you are not happy with her report ?

I think it’s a very high risk decision. Your DD has been doing sport at a serious level from the sounds of it. She’s stopped suddenly. She’s lost a huge physical outlet for stress and a big serotonin boost. She’s gained a lot of sitting around time. Dropping a lot of exercise means her body will change and she’s the age for all sorts of obsessing over body image.

Given that she has ‘mild’ ADHD, I would have thought that the obvious step (after checking her hearing and eyesight) would be to see if it’s her concentration levels that are the problem as it’s obviously something that’s impacting her across all subjects. Girls are under diagnosed and with the amount of exercise she was getting it’s very possible that she now needs help to focus on academic work.

Yes she could definitely go back to her sport on a recreational level. I hope she will, or that she finds a new hobby.

I agree with you re changing schools but dd is not keen and I worry that she would bring her troubles with her, and that nothing would change. I’d like for her to get some of her self esteem and happiness back before we change schools - if that doesn’t happen we will have to revisit.

It's so hard to make these decisions on her behalf, when she isn’t speaking up for herself or expressing any preference!

What was her reaction when you said about quitting the sport? A lot of people are criticising you for that but I think how she feels about it is key.

If she's upset then you probably didn't do the right thing.
If she's not bothered then perhaps you might be right and it was a bit too much for her and she's secretly relieved you made the decision for her.

Did she have friends through the sport?

I think what you replace the sport with is key. Just hoping she will magically get friends from attending an after school club for an hour with the people she's already in school with and hasn't bonded with seems unlikely to happen. I'd recommend trying a few things with a completely different crowd - a different sport that isn't so intense, or something like army/sea cadets, youth orchestra or theatre..somewhere she can start again with completely new people. If that goes well it might encourage her to think about changing schools but I agree that changing if she doesn't want to probably isn't the way to go.

Can you talk to the school? Her form tutor or head of year might have an idea about some nice kids that would be happy to befriend her, or suggest something like swapping her form class if there's someone she gets on okay with in another one..

The chats in the car and the bustle of a big family mean that she doesn’t have time one to one to talk to you. Your DD won’t open up according to a schedule you need to spend some real one to one time with her.

Sorry, needs more help. Hormones impact everything and what was working for her at 11 might need adjusting now.

I’m really sorry that your daughter is going through this.

How has your dd expressed her unhappiness to you? What adhd meds is she on? Is it stimulants?

Teens do have ups and downs. My dd certainly has had periods where she’s felt really low. As a parent, it’s easy to feel like this is something you need to fix, but sometimes it’s better just to be a safe place for her. To accept and love her unconditionally. When dd was really struggling, it would flare up her chronic eczema. I found that the thing that really helped was plonking on the sofa with fee and binge watching her favourite tv. Talking didn’t help - I would see her eczema flare up before my eyes. So I just supported her in the distraction techniques that worked for her.

With regard to the report - children are going to have ups and downs throughout secondary. It’s really normal. Years 8 and 9 are often the most difficult for this, they can feel like slightly lost years. It sounds like your dd is in a selective school? I’m guessing that she worked hard for for entrance exams, the important and immediacy of those exams will have really kept her pointing in a direction. With adhd, the next academic goal - GCSEs - is going to feel like a huge way off. She may not recover her motivation properly til year 10. But it sounds like she has the ability and drive to really thrive then.

I would 100% get her back into the sport. That goes without saying.

And I would stop trying to talk to her, and just make her know you’re always there and create opportunities for her to come to you. These conversations you would like to have with her are clearly not working. It might help if you modelled the type of talking that you would like her to do? So maybe after a tough day at work, you could whitter away about it, with reference to how things made you feel. All light hearted, bit giving her a model for your own emotional processing process.