Thread Four: Holding on to the end of the rope

[Pegsinarow]

Hello PoTs!

I am so very sorry to have been absent from the second half of thread three. I've been a overwhelmed by rl: some good, some bad and some a bit ugly!
I hope you are all doing as well as possible in the circumstances.

I saw thread three was on 998 posts and thought I had better start up thread four here!

I'll catch up in a bit but for now the previous threads were as follows:

Thread one here

Thread two here

Thread three here

Welcome back and feel free to vent here! And I'll try to stick around a bit more ... .

@Pegsinarow it's one day at a time with her, she is still friends with this group, the issue is they are not a particularly good influence and because she wants to fit in so much she has made some bad decisions in the past which has lead to her either getting into trouble or putting herself in risky situations, hence the constant worry when she is out. On the plus side, previously she would not keep her phone location on or let me know where she was who she was with, now she does and we have specific pick up times in the evenings. Part of the problem is her friends seem to have little or no boundaries regarding what they do and she can't understand that the rules that I have in place are there solely to keep her safe, it's so frustrating and stressful at times.

@JessCat75 good to hear things are getting better for you.
I get the same from my dd no one else has rules off where they hang out I'm sure they do. But our teenagers always we are trying to spoil their fun rather than protect them

@Andi2020 I know...it's such a difficult time when they just can't see you're only looking out for them and as you say to them we are just killjoys!

Just had a walk near in a little village about 10-12 miles from us in the countryside near a river (we haven’t visited this area in years) with dd15 1/2 more for her than me to get her out of the house for a little break, some fresh and exercise after being in her bedroom supposedly doing school work all day.
Anyway she seemed quite keen to come on what I hoped would be a nice walk spending quality time together maybe having a chat. But it turned into a disaster she wouldn’t engage in any conversation, was snappy, sarcastic, eye rolling, silent and playing on her phone. Anyway when we were nearly at the car a dog ran up to our dog out of nowhere barking really fiercely and ours has been attacked before. I was frightened and lost it screamed and shouted at the man to get his dog away. DD walked on ahead with our dog who was on the lead (the other dog was off the lead). I had grabbed her arm at one point (as I got a shock she is the same height as me). I said sorry after and explained that I was scared and she shook her head, rolled her eyes and said I was overreacting and an embarrassment. I said I’m sorry but if thats how you feel maybe you shouldn’t come out with me. She whispered about it to DH when we got back and she’s gone off upstairs now. I have a headache and feel like the worst mum in the world.

Splattherat Hope your headache is getting better and glad your dog is ok. Please ignore the eye-rolling, sarcasm and snappiness. You will probably find out later that your dd's bad mood was absolutely nothing to do with you and that you either caught her at a bad moment, or she has had a falling out with friends, or some difficulty with school work etc, so please don't take it personally.
Teens have a way of being totally down one minute and up the next and it is very hard to keep up with the change of mood. Ultimately, she will remember that you made the effort to go out for a walk with you. It might help if you step back a bit, and absorb yourself in your own projects and she will come and find you if she needs to talk etc. and that's what matters the most.

Jesscat75 it's such a difficult time when they just can't see you're only looking out for them and as you say to them we are just killjoys!
^^Totally this!

It sounds like you have a good balance there with being able to keep track of where your dd is and having set pick up times. I must admit that I don't believe half of what I am told about what other parents do!

gandalf456 I hope the rest of the week did improve. Glad to hear your dd was able to meet up with some friends and let off some steam (sorry your newly painted door frame took the brunt though) and that she could confide in your sister. Also, it's not a bad thing that your sister saw some snippiness because it shows it's not just you and also your sister can now support you both better.

Bless your dd, I hope you able to pin down what is worrying her about sixth form. Everything is particularly stressful for that age group right now and it is hard as it is, never mind without Covid-19 making everything more difficult!

Andi2020 how are your stress levels? I hope you are hanging in there ok I have no idea what is normal for 16yr/17 yr olds tbh; I think it is different for all teens depending on their personalities, but many are very attached to their friends at that age. And that's a very healthy thing. It's great that she is sticking to an 11pm curfew and she doesn't drink. To be fair to her, lockdown has probably exacerbated the need to go out and socialise! Is it the summer holidays yet where you are? It might be best to let her get it out of her system (within reason) while she and her friends can be outside and the sun is shining.

I wish my teen would go out more tbh! We were hoping that her friends would be around more this summer what with travel restrictions but they all seem to have gone to their grandparents' houses in different countries as normal.. . She seems (touches wood) ok atm though. She made us a Japanese curry at the weekend and is starting to walk the dogs a bit more and is doing more to help in the house. No major arguments since the last meltdown! Can't help being on tenterhooks because they seem to come out of nowhere so still not entirely relaxed ... but getting there... .

Take care everybody. Hang in there. And good luck for week ahead!

Thanks @Pegsinarow if only that would happen (she never talks to us these days). She’s quiet and had bottled everything up throughout lockdown. We live in England and she has met up with only one friend (the same friend) three times for a socially distant walk and thats it. She hardly spends any time downstairs or outside and the test of the time she is in her filthy bedroom usually in bed with the blinds permanently down. We have a parents evening chat tomorrow and suspect she is very behind with her school work whenever we mention anything about it she kicks off. She slammed a door so hard this morning that the clock fell off the wall and broke.

Sorry that sounds really hard Splatherat. Could the school offer you some support? I'm no expert but I remember reading somewhere that depression in teen girls can manifest itself as anger. (It doesn't always have the same symptoms as adult depression anyway.) If no luck at parents evening, maybe a visit to the gp? Hope the school can help anyway.

Thanks school finishes this week. Its a very large comp and because she behaves well at school (so as not to draw attention to herself) she slips under the radar. They have been next to useless I emailed saying it was in confidence and that I was worried she was overwhelmed with homework but then the teachers made reference to my getting in touch to her which she was mortified about. I am sure some sort of counselling would really help her but she is tall,not confident and hates any fuss or attention. I have tried to persuade her to visit the GP or tried to arrange private counselling which is on line during lockdown but the private counsellor has no spaces until the autumn and the doctor would just send links relevant to DD (which she won’t engage with) but she went mad about it and knowing her the answer to every question will just be closed fine, ok, no or if she feels backed into a corner we get their is nothing wrong with me its all because of you.

That sounds incredibly hard Splat I dont know what a parent is supposed to do when a teen won't engage. It is incredibly frustrating. It was also incredibly unhelpful that the teacher betrayed your confidence like that too.

I had a look and this (Australian) article may have some pointers:
here.

The fact that there are articles about it on line demonstrates that it is not uncommon, so it's definitely not "all because of you". She is off-loading the emotions that she can't handle atm on to you though; unfortunately (or fortunately for her in a way, depending on how you look at it) you are a handy receptacle for all of her worries and stress. So, strange though it sounds, being the "object" of her angst does fulfill a purpose for her and it does help, even though we feel as though we are not helping ifyswim

And remember that taking themselves off to their rooms is the first (safe and familar) step in the process of separating themselves off from us.

Fwiw I got incredibly low last year in response to dd lashing out (verbally) at me and I took it all incredibly personally which was not good because, despite often saying how much she "hates" me , dd nonetheless observes my behaviour and takes on board how I handle difficult situations. So when I got low and depressed in response to all the stress - she got more stressed in turn - and her invective got worse - and so on - and it all spiralled down worse and worse. What helped was doing what Billybagpuss and others said right at the beginning of thread one- which (v rough summary) was: step back, focus on your own projects, take steps to manage your own stress and mh, listen, support , tell them you love them a lot (teens default position is to assume everyone hates them) and you are always there if they need you, be there in the background and basically help them to navigate this tricky course themselves from a position at the back of the field so to speak.

I think I would also take the booking for autumn counselling for your dd (if you haven't already) and use the summer to shake things up a bit (difficult with current restrictions - three day bike ride or something??? ) and to slowly and in a gentle side wise manner, introduce the idea of private counselling as a safe, confidential space for her to utilise exactly how she wants in order to help herself, which may go down better than when it is framed as something imposed from above as it were.

As is v evident (!) these are just rather rambling jumbled thoughts and what helped us, so apologies for essay. You obviously will know what will, and what wont, fly with your teen. Good luck with the meeting tonight.

Sorry, not expressing this well, in other words, dont (like me) follow your dd
too far down the rabbit hole of anxiety/ depression, despite being desperately worried about her. Step back from the edge, breathe, look up and out, try and model calmness, positivity and healthy habits (v v difficult when stressed of course) as they need us to be a bit of a rock and an anchor point I think . All v easy to write down and v v hard to do ... .

Thanks all parents eve meeting has just happened and afterwards when we spoke to her calmly about her two targets she kicked off. DH is upstairs speaking to her now and I can hear shouting.
Thanks all i work pt from home, I am NHS phone volunteer responder supporting the elderly/vulnerable during covid and do something else but it would be outing as well as visiting my elderly mum, meeting up with friends virtually going for a walk or a socially distant garden meet up etc.

Sorry about the shouting Splat but good that your dh is sharing the load as it were. That's an impressive list of activities (offering a lot of support to others) so you are already doing all the right things. Good that you have support of friends too. Maybe it's just a case of hanging in there for this stage to pass? Wishing you all the best for the summer.

Thank you again Pegsinarow I had a proper read of the article and I will show it to DH but think I will have to keep rereading it. As most of her hatred and annoyance is targeted at me.
I will try to keep communication channels open as they always have been but its really difficult In partial lockdown and when she won’t admit anything is wrong or worrying her and sees me as they enemy but their clearly is judging by her moods and behaviour.
Also unfortunately she isn’t close to any adult role models either so thats out. My family live close and have had little to do with them and DH’s family live 3 hours away and we don’t know when we will see them again but she’s no closer to them either.
This is part of the problem as an older mum and with DH was out the house for work 12-13 hours a day I had to be super organised and try to be mum dad, aunties, uncles and two sets of grandparents to my DC who were both very close in age.

gandalf456 - hope the door can be fixed! We have glass panels in all of the doors downstairs and I'm amazed that none have smashed with the door slamming we've had. Hope the last week was better

How have things been Andi2020? I really recognise what you said about lying - I struggle so so much with this as I am honest to a fault (and it is a fault sometimes as I don't even do white lies). I really want to build trust back up with DD but every time we give a little, she ends up abusing it.

Pegs the counselling was going to be through school so can't start up until we go back (in Scotland so only a month away now) - she is very much against going but she needs to talk through how she is feeling, to get some self-positivity back and also coping strategies. She's terrified of going back to school though - literally had a panic attack when they announced they'd go back full time. Has your DD been any better recently? You always offer such good advice here, no-one could ever accuse you of being 'me me me'.

Things with us have been up and down since I last posted (I have been keeping up with everyone's posts but just haven't had time to post myself). DD's moods continue to dominate the whole family - if she's in a mood everyone else ends up fighting too (and poor DS is suffering from anxiety both related to that and lockdown) - we need to get better at ignoring it, but it's hard. We also need to stop pandering to her for an easy life.

She's still not engaging with peers other than on social media. She did try to get in touch with one of her old group who had been a bystander rather than instigator of the bullying, but got ignored and now she's just refusing to try and meet up with anyone locally - she was blocked on SC by a couple of boys in her class 'for no reason' but I don't believe her.

We are so worried as we know most of the people she's contacting on SM are (older) boys from other towns and she's made noises about trying to meet up with some of them but not sure that's a good idea.

She swings from being really hyper and upbeat - falsely so - and really down (although she does still communicate with us thankfully). I don't know what we'd do if we didn't have the dog as she still comes out on family dog walks (only out of town though) and when we are out and about, with no phones, we can chat and laugh which I know we should hold on to.

Posting for support!! I'm so done with this I feel so low and can't turn to anyone.
Ds is 18( just), applies for the raf last summer, was refused on medical grounds, we appealed and they upheld the appeal but he's had to apply again as they closed his application.
Due to COVID his application has been 'pending review' for months.
He won't chase it up.
He won't excercise ( doing couch to 5K with dd (23) but that's it)
He stays in bed until ?? It's 2pm now and he's not up.
He's got a car and has passed his test so goes to his mates almost every day.
Won't send off some proper work needed for a trust he's due when turning 18.
Won't apply for jobs
Won't apply for universal credit
Won't walk the dog
Won't speak to anyone on the phone no matter what it's for ( he needs to speak to his car insurance but won't do)
Tells me to back off he'll do it in his own time ( whenever that might be)
Is lazy beyond belief
Husband is seriously fucked off with him now as he works 10 hour days
Daughter has 3 jobs
Son does 3 hours on a Friday night in the chippy. Thinks that enough.
I'm so fucking tired of this.
It's been suggested he has anxiety and depression, I don't think so he's just a lazy sod with zero ambition.
Please tell me I'm not alone!

My first post on this thread here but I posted on the general forum the other day about my DD who is 16 in a couple of months. Last month I found out that she had to take the MAP after having unprotected sex. She told me it was an ex bf and we talked long and hard about safe sex, under-age sex, contraception etc.

However, at the end of last week, my friend (DD’s best friend’s mum) told me the boy involved is someone we’ve warned DD about before. He’s a local ‘bad’ boy who has been kicked out of school, drinks etc. She said her DD had told her all about it and she was v judgey about the whole situation. I asked DD about it and she admitted it but says they’ve since broken up and she hasn’t seen him for 2 weeks.

I told DD she has majorly broken my trust and has to re-build it. She was grounded for the weekend which meant she couldn’t go to another friend’s house for a get together. I’m letting her go out this week but only until dinner time and told her she is to be in for the evenings for now. I’ve also made her re-instate a tracker on her phone.

Yesterday I went with her to have her ears pierced which, in my mind, had nothing to do with anything else that’s happened, and I viewed it as a bit of a re-bonding exercise.

DD knows she messed up and I can see how upset she is and I thought my actions and sanctions were enough.

However, it seems my ‘friend’ is v unhappy with me. She sent me a furious text yesterday saying how she took a huge risk telling me about the bad boy, it’s affected her and her DD and caused huge dramas and it’s all been for no reason because ‘nothing has changed’ and she’s v upset that I let DD have her piercings! I think she’s just pissed off that I haven’t dealt with it the way she would have ie: completely grounding her for a month, taking away more privileges, getting DH to warn the boy off etc.

I feel like she is completely over-invested in this and is trying to make it all about her. She’s told me she doesn’t want to speak to me and ‘needs space’. I have been in such a mess since this all blew up. I am a ball of anxiety, not sleeping well, not eating etc. She has made me feel 10 times worse by making me feel like I’m such a shit parent. I’ve got no confidence now in how I’m handling the situation 🙁

Can anyone help? Sorry if you saw my post the other day and feel I’m repeating stuff. I’m just hoping for some reassurance and advice about how to handle my ‘friend’.

Thanks if you got this far!

@Inastatus do not feel bad for how you handled your own dd.
Tell your friend thanks for telling me but I will take it from here.

If the piercing had already been arranged then it wouldn't be fair to your dd to cancel.
Yes she done wrong but she told you th ere truth and asked for your help to get Map.
You cant really help who you fall in love with bad boys have excitement about them.
My dd when she was 15 actually pretended she was dating a boy who would now be in the bad boy scene drink weed. But she was actually with a wee innocent boy and I arrived at the bad boys house one night her phone died and he said we are not together but he went out around town with my dd2 and his mum and found her so to be he was a star that night anyway
So the ones that act like hard lads drink smoke are not all bad they can have good qualities.
It seems like your friend wanted you to have a big fall out with your dd.

@Andi2020 - thanks. Yes, I’ll tell my friend to leave me to deal with DD. She is much stricter than me and just makes me feel I’m not doing things right.

@Inastatus mums know their own kids best. Yes we like to rant or get advice on here but when an actual person who is our friend tells us what we don't want to hear well it really is not their place to say we are not parenting correct to make us feel shit.
Do what you feel is right for you and your dd.
What if you had totally grounded her and then she had done something like run away or self harmed that would have been alot worse than getting her ears pierced so what works for one Teenager will not suit everyone.
I have 3 teens and all have their own character and I have to handle each situation differently. 2 younger teens not too bad yet.
Dh always says I'm too soft on dd1 but if I'm too hard she threatens to run away or self harm but if I calm down it blows over quicker.

@Andi2020 - thanks again, you’ve made me feel a bit better

Mairyhinge I feel your pain, it must be incredibly frustrating especially if your dd is functioning so well. My only thoughts are... he’s only just 18, he does have one job even though it’s not many hours, and boys are often IME less motivated and tbh lazier than their sisters. It’s also presumably his first time without the school/college responsibilities and routines to keep him on track?

Can you step back a bit? Maybe give him a deadline (with consequences that will have an impact) which would allow you both time to relax a bit and him time to make preparations? Allow him a month or two (assume he’s just finished school?) but in September (?) you want to see evidence of xyz (whatever you’d like him to do, apply for more jobs/volunteer/go travel etc).
Maybe take up a project of your own or concentrate on something for yourself so you’re not constantly irritated by him?

@Ifeelfat
Thank you, you're right in many ways I just feel flat.
He finished collage a year ago as he hated it and I said ' the option to do nothing isn't an option' he tried his hand at a couple of jobs but nothing came of it then he decided on the RAF but the lack of motivation is killing me.
You're right tho, I need to concentrate on something else and be less 'available' to him.
When do they stop being lazy arses?!

Mairyhinge some of them never, IMO, but you’ve kind of done your duty by now, the rest is up to him.
He may well get there, probably will tbh as you’ve probably instilled the right values in him, but he’s still young and immature and the options around may not be very inspiring...
yes I’d concentrate on yourself for a bit

@Ifeelfat

Mairyhinge some of them never, IMO, but you’ve kind of done your duty by now, the rest is up to him. He may well get there, probably will tbh as you’ve probably instilled the right values in him, but he’s still young and immature and the options around may not be very inspiring... yes I’d concentrate on yourself for a bit

Thank you it means a lot that you've told me what I already know in a way, lol, but I think I'm so caught up in it I do t see the wood for the trees! I'm sure eventually he'll figure it out but all his mates are layabouts - doesn't help!