How do I back down from this?

[CrazyHorse]

DD (14yo) asked for a pair of shoes while out shopping. Rudely, without explaining why she wanted/needed them.

DH told her she was behaving like a spoilt brat and walked out of the shop.

DD asked the shop assistant if she could try them on but they didn't have her size.

I had a chat to DD and told her no way would we be buying her anything if she was being so rude to us. I told her to apologise to DH and she offered a sulky "I'm sorry"

Having had time to consider the shoes, I now think she does actually need them. How do I go about buying them for her without rewarding her rudeness. She tends to be most rude when she's anxious, and she's anxious because she does need theses shoes.

So she swore at you but you can justify buying new shoes for her?
Rewarding her awful behaviour will teach her that telling you to fuck off gets her anything she wants.

1). You’re not even sure she’d be allowed to wear them at school

1. I doubt very much that her current lace up randomly “fell off” her foot, so she’s taking you for a mug there, and not even very intelligently.

Although you seem to have fallen for it... And obviously 3 - Her attitude is appalling. Why would you teach her that demanding things with shitty language gets her what she wants?

Sorry but what possible activity can she 'need' Dr Martins?

You are being very shortsighted op.

Rod, meet back....

DMs were banned at my dc's secondary school, so you might need to check the rules about that.

Suffering from anxiety is one thing; getting in a rage and swearing like a trooper at your parents because you've been thwarted is something else entirely.

You're still finding lots of reasons to buy her the shoes.

I fear you're falling into a trap many parents (and I did at one point with my anxious asd ds) of trying to find anyway to make her happy.

But she'd benefit much more and be happier if she had your time, she could communicate her needs effectively, she knows you have her back re bullying and brother winding her up etc.

She didn't "need" the DMs before shopping yesterday and she doesn't need them now.

I'm not sure why you've posted here to be honest. You haven't listened to any responses.

This is obviously where I've gone wrong all these years with my teens! Oh.....no.....hang on.......NEVER. Not even my 6 year old would get what she wanted after being rude

Poor kid.
I don’t think you can separate her behaviour from her experience of struggling with anxiety/being bullied.

Don’t focus on the shoes, and don’t buy the shoes because you feel guilty.

When you said ‘cannot recognise hunger cues’ ASD or ADHD was my immediate thought.

I’d be exploring why the bullying is going on and talking to school and your GP. Friend‘s DD has ASD, and her mantra is, if in doubt, check it out. You won’t know otherwise.

Also just because your son didn’t swear as part of a meltdown, it doesn’t rule it out for her, there are so many variations.

Her reason for wanting new shoes isn’t a good enough reason to buy her the expensive docs!

What’s the event, op? The one which she needs docs for?

Yes very clearly she’s gone through a bad time ( i Was bullied and was an anxious mess) however if i’d sworn at my parents it would have been a long time before they’d have got me anything.
She needs to know this is not acceptable.
You shouldn’t make excuses for bad behaviour.
Your dh was right, i certainly would not buy the shoes.

I think you need to wait a couple of weeks and give her time to demonstrate better behaviour.

When you said ‘cannot recognise hunger cues’ ASD or ADHD was my immediate thought.

I thought that too but forgot to put it in my previous post.

OP, I’m afraid you won’t get many responses beyond “she’s a brat and you’re too soft”. There was a thread recently when a mother described some massively abnormal behaviour in her daughter and every suggestion of MH problems or ASD were shot down with “she’s a brat”.

For most Mumsnetters, ASD is seen as an excuse for shitty behaviour rather than the cause, and people like me get shot down in flames for even suggesting it as a possibility. People love to froth about bad behaviour happening simply because someone is BAD.

With the family history I think it’s worth considering. Girls present so differently. Have a look at the National Autistic Society website and search out some articles about girls.

Tourettes is linked to ASD. My DC have all sworn at me on occasion, and whilst I get cross and they don't get what they asked for, it is a symptom of extreme distress.

And shoes (especially lace up ones don't just "come off". I would suspect that it was stood on and pulled off. She laughed it off both as an "inappropriate response" and maybe she was less anxious then. But then as she dwelt on it (a symptom of which was her being in a bad mood in the morning, and why you insisted she came on the trip), it got worse and a bigger worry. Then she had a bright idea that Doc Martens couldn't be pulled off - but you didn't get her thought processes (my DD with Aspergers still expects me to be somewhat telepathic) - and everything kicked off.

You are being far too soft. That behaviour is completely unacceptable. Being anxious/hungry/thirsty/tired does not give a 14 yo an excuse to swear at their parents.

I'd be coming down like a tonne of bricks.

And I definitely would not be buying her shoes!

@MollyButton
Why are you so desperate with your diagnosis ideas?? Tourette’s ffs get a grip!
You’re the mother that would see a video of your child murdering someone and explain it away 🙄

I have to agree. Massive amounts of projection going on there. Op didn’t get her daughter’s (totally imagined) thought processes indeed 🤦‍♀️

I think @MollyButton was referring to the hair pulling being linked to Tourette's- Its certainly not the swearing. But otherwise I think @MolyButton has totally summed it up absolutely perfectly.

DD wouldn't have lied about the shoe falling off, as suggested. DD doesn't really lie. I know this is screaming ASD, but honestly she'd never get a diagnosis ( and she doesn't need one) . I didn't know about the not feeling hunger thing, so thank you to who ever mentioned that. It does seem to make sense.

The last time someone on MN told me I was making a rod for my own back it was regarding DS1, and many years later I can confirm they were totally wrong.

I initially posted because I want DD to have the shoes, but at the same time I don't want her to feel rewarded for her behaviour. That was my dilemma.

Sometimes on MN people can also come up with helpful suggestions and it's been pointed out to me that we need to have strategies ready to avoid a repeat performance. It seems obvious now, but I honestly hadn't thought of that, so thank you to who ever suggested it.

She told you to f off!? 😲😲😲 and you think she needs the shoes??!!! No way. And I don't think your DH did anything wrong at all. I'm so shocked that people think he called her a name 😅 he just called it as he saw it! I would never have told my parents to f off. Not even nessesarily because they were strict but because I would have felt terrible. Teens aren't quite as incapable of controlling themselves as people are making out they are. Unless there is some underlying behaviour issue.

Oh god, excuses excuses excuses.

What does she need DM’s (specifically) for that you can justify the cost of them and want her to have them?

Whatever it is, isn’t going to ‘out’ you, but it will keep me awake trying to think of something!

OP is that classic MN poster; she only replies to the pp that encourage and shore her up her ideas. MN bingo is complete now she has a pp(no one else agrees with) giving her every excuse/label there is rather than accept her DD was rude & nasty and actually parent her child, now she can excuse her behaviour because she has anxiety, ASD, Tourette’s, hanger issues, good luck 🙄🙄

I brought up hunger issues in response to the op saying her DD hadn't eaten. In no way was I excusing rude behaviour, I was pointing out that I regularly notice a connection between low blood sugar and poor behaviour in my child. Can no-one here understand the difference between an observation and an excuse?

None of us are perfect parents and and parenting a reactive teen (an anxious one at that) can be hard going. There has been some good advice, but some posters are very quick to pile on the blame. A little sympathy for the op, on what is meant to be a supportive parenting site, would not go amiss.

rather than accept her DD was rude & nasty and actually parent her child

DDs was vile. I've acknowledged that. We need to parent her rather than walk off (although actually I think DH did the right thing) and I'd rather do that by having strategies in place than being unprepared/reactionary/stunned.

The shoes have not been mentioned since yesterday. I don't think DD will bring them up again. She does need shoes for next week. DMs would be suitable.

At some point next weekend I'm going to have to parent her by taking her to obtain some appropriate footwear that I'm happy to be seen with her wearing.

It's not as if I'm never going to buy her new shoes again because she had one swearing fit, although I do recognise she needs to see the consequences of her actions.

I now realise I don't need to back down, I need to talk with her about the incident, let her know how shocking and hurtful her words were, sort out some appropriate footwear and move on.

DDs not my first child, and I do very much regret being so strict with my elder DC on occasion. I'm not going to cut off my nose to spite my face over this.

Today DD made a birthday cake, tidied the kitchen unloaded and loaded the dishwasher, laid the table tidied her bedroom & changed her sheets all without being asked. She's been lovely and funny. She's not a bad kid. She is bonkers and does struggle with lots of things in life, as do many people.