Parental order for donor embryo

[KazBuck]

Ok I was wondering if anyone can give me advice. I was thinking to use a surrogate with a donor embryo but when looking at getting a parental order the child must be biologically related to the intended parents… Surely there must be a way around this ? I know I should speak to a solicitor and I’m waiting on a call just wondered if anyone has any experience with this topic x

@Cornflakes123 as I said, you are entitled to your opinion

So they should since they have no reference point.

i had an unknown grandfather I inherited a disorder from caused a shed load of shit for me a
and my family

traced who he was through DNA on ancestry filled a hole emotionally we all had but he was dead by then

i feel robbed

I’m sorry to hear that but I’m a little confused - was that a result of poorly managed donor conception disclosure?

Wholeheartedly agree!
"Just adopt" is infuriating! As if it's that simple, as if it's a magic solution.

FWIW, to all you "just adopt" preachers, I did look into adoption. I was told I'd be unlikely to get a child under 10, and any child I would get would come with birth family access. Sure, that's important to the adopted child, but I did not want to spend my weekends visiting a grandparent I had no relation to. I went down the donor egg route instead.
Adoption is something that should be done by choice and for the sake of wanting to adopt. It's absolutely not a solution for infertility.

No my mum was a GI baby her father was an American who impregnated my grandmother

it was a massive secret my nan took who he was to her grave

my mum suffered shame obviously it is a different world now

however i personally feel create a baby however you like but the child that is created should know and have contact with their bio parents whomsover they are, because it matters to the child and grandchild

No I'm not. I’m saying that procuring a baby via surrogacy involves a financial transaction.
IVF almost always means one parent’s gametes are used, so there is a strong biological link. You just want to buy a baby off the shelf. That’s known as human trafficking.

I hope your mum has had space to heal .

Thankfully respectfully raised donor conceived individuals have that opportunity to meet their donor nowadays- mine will be able to meet their donor when they are older if that’s what they choose . The donor is someone we talk about regularly and as part of their identity so it’s certainly not a mystery to them.

It does frustrate me that currently it’s not as easy to meet any donor half siblings but I’m hopeful that times are forever changing and by the time they are old enough to decide that’s something they want, the opportunity will be there.

@CandyLeBonBon as I said personal attacks are nasty.i am already aware I am entitled to my opinion as I said and I heard you the first time 😂

@CandyLeBonBon you might want to research a bit more about donor conceptions before posting untruths by the way.. as people with real world experience have demonstrated.

Is it still a case of the donor can meet the child if the child chooses when they are 18?

And is there any reason for this cut-off?

For example if a 12 year old boys wants a father in his life, why is he not allowed to try and make contact at that age? Having a father around when they’re growing up is probably significantly more important than meeting one aged 18?

Is the cut-off to protect the donor? So they don’t have to take any responsibility for them (financially or practically I suppose)?

so a donor is NOT a father - that’s a really important distinction. They aren’t meeting a ‘father’ - they are meeting a man who has provided genetic material.

i can’t speak for other donor children but my children thankfully have positive male influences in their lives . If you look at the divorce stats in the UK , i don’t think my children are particularly unique in not having a man living in the house - and looking at many of the posts on here , are incredibly fortunate that the men in their lives are all good eggs and not the affair having , non-child maintenance paying, non-weight pulling ‘fathers’ that come from more traditional arrangements. I’d much rather my children have ‘good eggs’ surrounding them than that! Again- can’t speak for others but I actually think there’s something very beneficial about ‘community’ around my child - the idea of a mum/dad hasn’t always been the societal norm for child raising and still isn’t in other parts of the world.

in terms of meeting the donor- my understanding is that it’s to protect the child rather than the donor. They need to understand the distinction between a father and a genetic donor - to understand the implications of meeting wider family . Maybe the relationship that develops is a really close one - maybe it isn’t (sharing genetic material doesn’t mean you have much in common - my sibling and I are chalk and cheese). We speak really positively of the donor - he’s done an incredible thing in my eyes - but the reality is , he’s human and I have no doubt has faults and flaws like the rest of us. Some young people will have the maturity and support structure to deal with that at a younger age - others won’t. My children will have access to any therapy they want as they grow up- that might not be the case for all children so 18 is a point they could access it for themselves. Sadly we can’t force people to parent well, so we can’t force people to tell their children they are DC but that age, they can figure out for themselves .

besides anything else - I wouldn’t be comfortable with my young children/teens meeting a random man I didn’t know- doesn’t matter the genetic link.

It might be your perspective that a donor is not a father but plenty of evidence and research into the experiences of children who grew up without/without knowing their fathers demonstrates that from the child's perspective the provider of genetic material very much is viewed as a father. You don't want that to be the case because you have donor conceived children but you can't determine how they will feel, it's out of your control.

This, 100%. Adult adoptee here, btw and agree with the previous comments on identity issues referenced here. Of course they exist, in varying degrees.

Also: doing it with a friend could open up a hornet's nest of issues around who is the "real" parent. Would NOT want to be the child caught up in this scenario. If it even could be successfully managed, it would require excellent communication and empathy and not hiding away/burying difficult questions. Goodness they will be a daily occurrence.

I'm afraid I do agree. I understand it's painful for the couple but they need to facilitate a relationship with the birth parent.

Not true. Lots of data on this.

Could you kindly provide this research? I’d be interested to read it and also to see how old it is…lots of comments on here about DC children is from older research that doesn’t reflect how children are raised nowadays (much more acknowledgment of the DC identity, access to therapy, etc) and the general shifts in society.

for example, I think there’s been a marked change in how we view ‘fathers’ . Definitely now there seems to be a distinction between a man who provides sperm (whether that’s in a donor situation, a ONS, or just a bit of a waste of space) and a man who actively raises and engages with his children. The later - to me- is a dad, the former is not. Nothing to do with donor conception but it does a great disservice to men who are fathers to conflate the two- and I will be raising my children to see the difference.

I can’t speak for others, but in our friendship group- non-traditional family set ups are quite prevalent so that idea that all families have a mum and dad is less common and less of an idea of something someone might lack.

There is loads out there on this that is easily findable on DC and adoptees experience. I am surprised you haven't encountered it yourself already?

I think that poster is too busy convincing herself through the use of convoluted semantics that there is no way her children will one day consider the donor as their ‘father’ - which he is biologically of course - that she is living in her bubble of ‘non-tradition’ families without considering that her children will one day be thinking outside this bubble and will very much likely want to find their biological father and find out more about their family on that side, which genetically is their family whether their mother likes it or not.

Ummm- did you not read my original post when I said they would be supported to do so? We speak about their donor regularly and they will have full access to all the information once they are literate. I’m not going to decide for them if it’s the right or wrong choice to
meet the donor because that’s not my choice to make . But certainly I’ll do everything in my power to facilitate that meeting if that’s what they want … I can’t change the law re the age requirement unfortunately- my personal thought would be gillick competence and access to therapy would be a better measure but I don’t know who would adjudicate that- but that’s also quite privileged of me as I recognise not everyone can afford that.

if they see the donor as their father, then I hope that’s something we can discuss and they can also explore in therapy or with wider family/friends if they’d like an outside perspective- and of course I’ll respect that feeling. However, I have found the more recent research indicates if the information is presented correctly from birth, then there’s less likelihood of them feeling that way. I do hope they grow up to see the difference (I don’t know the sex of my second yet but I’ll have failed as a parent if he thinks being a father is as simple as popping out some sperm- and I really hope if my daughter chooses to have a family the traditional way she has higher expectations for her partner) .

for example, I think there’s been a marked change in how we view ‘fathers’ . Definitely now there seems to be a distinction between a man who provides sperm (whether that’s in a donor situation, a ONS, or just a bit of a waste of space) and a man who actively raises and engages with his children. The later - to me- is a dad, the former is not.

And it doesn’t bother you that your children will never know what it’s like to have a father who actively engages and raises them? Do you think that it doesn’t matter whether children have that kind of father in their life or not?

I think to have that attitude is very harmful to the important role that an active and engaged dad plays in the well-being of a child. Men like this aren’t disposable, fatherhood is not a flippant role in society where the presence or absence of one is irrelevant to a child.

Would you say the same about mothers?

Some mothers are bad mothers and therefore it doesn’t matter if children have one or not?

Because that’s the attitude you seem to be portraying regarding the rights of a child to have a biological mother and father in their life.

But at the end of the day, you have brought children into the world knowing that the situation of your making will likely mean they will need extensive therapy to come to terms with their origins. You will never convince me that this is a reasonable thing to do. And yes I know there could be lots of whataboutery re. lots of women have children with unsuitable men who abandon them etc; but those women and children are victim to their circumstances, rather than a deliberate choice.

This.

There’s a big difference between children being born into whataboutery situations that can’t be controlled, and children being born into situations where they have been deliberately denied a father. That’s a choice that the mother makes on behalf of the child and I can’t ever see how that’s ok.

Totally. Poster is in for a rude surprise. It's the 21st century version of the 1950s adoptee story when children were considered blank slates.

Explore in therapy? I have to call this out. This is gaslighting bullshit. How dare you, seriously.

we’ll have to disagree- I felt the high divorce rate in this country was significantly high enough that it was a bit beyond ‘whataboutery’ and equally likely to end in needing support.

thankfully I have a blissfully happy child and long may she stay that way - I hope however you came about the children they are as happy and confident in themselves .