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Original poster

Boys in dresses. Yes or no?

557 replies

spidermama · 30/06/2005 11:34

My DS (3.5) loves dresses and butterfly tops and glittery sparkley fairy type stuff. I have no objection. I even bought him a couple of dresses of his own to stop him raiding long-sufferine DD's wardrobe. My only slight worry is teasing from other kids. He wants to wear a dress to pre-school today. What do you think?

OP posts:
AnnieQ · 30/06/2005 14:52

Why is it prejudiced to be concerned about the likelihood of bullying? I have no problems with anyone wearing, thinking, doing what they like - my problem is that the child is 3, and isn't old enough to make a fully informed decision. When he's older he could go to school wearing pink pyjamas with a bow in his hair - but he would then be making an informed decision.

Whether we like it or not, society does put pressures on all of us to conform, and there are consequences if we don't. That doesn't mean I believe we should be conformist, just that a child should be older than this before he is deemed able to make an informed and intelligent decision.

vickiyumyum · 30/06/2005 14:53

my ds2 also 3.5 often takes his dolly out in a pram, and only a few people (adults) have ever made a comment. but the thing about wearing a dress is not that i see that its wrong for a boy to wear a dress its the fear of my little darling being, bullied, laughed at etc that makes me say no.
But then if you are more relaxed about the idae then i am, you are a better person for it and hopefully your son has a good, strong enough background to realise that its his life and he doesn't always have to conform to the norms!
also i'm sure that you are 100% right about living in brighton and it being much more relaxed, they've seen it all(well i certainly have on my weekends down in our flat)
i think i may have changed my mind in the course of writing this post and would be inclined to say sod it, forget about what everyone else says and if your sons happy, then let him!

Heathcliffscathy · 30/06/2005 14:54

yeah annie, but it's not the kids it's parents (perhaps parents like you?) that spiderboy should be worried about being looked askance on by imo.

sh*t i'm turning into yoda, what has happened to my syntax?

Blu · 30/06/2005 14:56

But Enid - I thought you said that bullying wasn't your problem with it - but that susceptibility (which we do all have) to long term stereotyping was? You were the only person honest enough to admit it - don't go!

crunchie · 30/06/2005 14:56

I come down strongly on the let him wear what he wants. But at the same time I don't think it is prejudiced to say no to boys in dresses. It is simply a difference of opinion, and most people who expressed that opinion did it out of a feeling of concern for spiderboy, rather than prejudice (That's how I feel) I am normally v PC but we have to have two sides here and some disagree with me, it doesn't make it wrong and me right. It doesn't make them prejudiced and me perfect. I can understand why some people think boys in dressses are wrong, and i respect that view. I hope they can respect mine that I have no issue with it. The prejudice comes where those people who think it is wrong verbally attack spiderboy/mama for choosing to dress like that. And treating them differently for it. Prejudice is not having an opposing opinion, it is acting badly when someone has an opposing opinion IYKWIM

vickiyumyum · 30/06/2005 14:57

here we go again another thread being ruined by personal insults!
sophable are you not now being the bully towards annie?
stop it now, give your opinion as aked by spidermama and leave other people to their opinions too.

Tortington · 30/06/2005 14:58

i think it would also depend where you live. on our council estate - your asking for your kid to be a lonely individual with no friends until he is 16.

also i completely agree with annieq

if my youngest son who used to like wearing my shoes indoors decided at 16 to go to college in a blonde wig and a sequinne dress. then fine.

AnnieQ · 30/06/2005 14:59

Parents like me?? Sophable, I am not prejudiced, and I have never, EVER said anything to any child based on what they look like or what they're wearing. I really resent the implication that my concern for children being bullied is being sneered at by you as prejudice. I don't give two hoots what people wear or how they look - I'm not exactly conventional myself, but I'm aware that people judge me for it, and would think twice before inflicting that on my child.

All I care about is getting my child through school without her being bullied the way I was, and without the rest of her life being scarred by it the way mine was. Pardon me for being concerned that other children might have to suffer as I did.

[angy]

AnnieQ · 30/06/2005 15:00

And that's me leaving this thread now, because personal insults based on someone's opinion are low and nasty. I haven't insulted anyone; shame you weren't quite so considerate, sophable.

vickiyumyum · 30/06/2005 15:02

hear hear annieq well said!

Heathcliffscathy · 30/06/2005 15:03

enid bloody hell, why so touchy. i wasn't referring to your post. you weren't being 'thinly veiled' anything, you were being open about the fact that you felt we live in a stereotyping world and sod it you stereotype too! i could get equally offended by being called glib. i've purposely tried to maintain a light tone on this thread.

if you want i can be v unglib. i was horribly bullied at both of my schools. my great fear for ds is that he will be bullied or be a bully. the profession i have chosen as an adult (psychotherapy) is massively informed by my interest in this area. i am genuinely shocked that there are mothers on here that feel it is wrong for a baby (lets face it we're talking about a 3 year old) to wear dresses or skirts. if that is the kind of parent that is out there raising their kids to have the same attitude, then ds and any other children are going to have a much harder time of it needlessly imo.

less glib for you?

seriously, i don't know why i made you so angry????

crunchie · 30/06/2005 15:04

Love this thread, it is going so fast. Such a shame about the personal jibes at the end. It is so hard write something and to guess how others will read it. I don't think spoh meant to p**s people off, but has managed to.

starlover · 30/06/2005 15:05

some people on this thread (elsmommy is one) did say that a boy wearing a skirt is "not right"

still haven't had any reason WHY it isn't right. aside from bullying which apparently wasn't her reason..

Heathcliffscathy · 30/06/2005 15:05

how is questioning whether you might be the kind of parent that would judge a child based on your massive concern about that kind of judgement a personal insult AnnieQ?

you what?

starlover · 30/06/2005 15:06

and have to say i agree with sophable.

if you bring a child up to believe that it is WRONG for people to wear certain things... then you are in turn attributing to any possible bullying

Tortington · 30/06/2005 15:06

and picking up on crunchies first sentence. if they everyday pick their own clothes - i think its pandering

i have a friend with a 13 year old daughter. she did this - it made me boil - the kid wouldnt go to school becuase the jumper she wanted to wear wasn't washed. and not of the clothes she had in her other 3 wardrobes would do.

same with the 'let them eat as many snackes as they want as long as its healthy' debate on the other thjread.

you do realise that your children have to be socialised? its part of the parenting process.

as an adult what would you say to meeting someone as fussy as this - we are making our children fussy - its not choice its limiting socialisation when we take it to extremes.

society is what it is - i know some of us live in different worlds and god forbid any of the pandered children ever have to come as adults into the world where my kids are growing up, they would be mentally scarred for life if not physically of that am certain.

crunchie · 30/06/2005 15:07

sophable I think it was your post of 2:54 which suggested that Annie was the sort of person to say something to spiderboy that upset.

Perhaps prejudice is the wrong word in this context, I think.

crunchie · 30/06/2005 15:09

Oh poo custy I pander to my kids!! I do let them choose their own clothes everyday - whilst being gently told to wear something that at least 'goes'

AnnieQ · 30/06/2005 15:10

Sopahble, you wrote about me: "but it's not the kids it's parents (perhaps parents like you?) that spiderboy should be worried about being looked askance on by imo".

I do not look askance at anyone, and neither does my child. She has had other faiths, other colours, other abilities discussed with her here in her home, by me, and she knows that no one person is any better than any other, and that nothing they wear, do, say or feel is any better or any worse than what she does, wears, says or feels.

You cannot deny that your post was judging me as prejudiced, and you judging me is just as bad as anyone judging anyone else because of the way they look or the way they dress.

starlover · 30/06/2005 15:10

custardo i think it depends hpw far you take it.

ie with picking their own clothes... i think that's fine. as long as it is clear that they pick from what is available. they can pick their clothes, but if things are in the wash they wear something else...

it doesn't HAVE to be a complete pandering to them...

tarantula · 30/06/2005 15:12

lol I let (make) dss choose what he wants to wear when hes with us but I wouldnt call it pandering. Hed prefer to have his clothes handed to him on a plate and have someone dress him too. Teenagers grrr

Heathcliffscathy · 30/06/2005 15:14

i stand by the fact that parents that feel it's inappropriate (still wondering what is inappropriate about it, it's a 3 year old dressing up!) feed the prejudice, and are more of a problem then any kids the 3 year old will encounter. sorry...

i said perhaps parents like you annie. i.e. i think it is far more likely that parents will judge spiders ds then the kids.

you've said that you are totally into freedom of choice over what to wear, but not for 3yearolds????

i'm sorry i've offended you so badly by questioning your stance on this...

northerner · 30/06/2005 15:15

Surely it's just a case of different strokes for different folks?

I know someone who's ds (aged 3) has always been a feminine little boy. He loves wearing high heels, feather boas, singing, dancing and is very theatrical. He has even been known to say @i'm not a boy, I'm a girl' His parents are fine with this, and everyone in our circle is very accepting of this, he often can be seen out wearing his sister's Barbie nightie. He is a delightful, funny and gorgeous child.

However, my ds (also 3) is very much a boy's boy, and would never consider wearing a dress/fairy outfit etc. So I think how we feel about this also depends on the character of our child. For some people the thought of their son wearing a dress is totally alien to them. But this doesn't make them prejudice.

Blu · 30/06/2005 15:15

Custy, that would drive me MAD - well it wouldn't becaue i wouldn't stand for it - buut Spiderboy isn't throwing a full-scale-diva-style tantrum because he isn't being allowed to wear a frock - he just likes to dress up now and then - as all the kids at pre-school do.

The particular issue here is not about wearing clothes of his choice, but what that choice happens to be.

I wouldn't let DS wear yesterday's dress-up ladyboy outfit to a christening, because it wuld be disrespectful. I wouldn't let him wear it to his 1st day at reception, because it wouldn't be school uniform. I wouldn't let him wear it in December because he would freeze. But I wouldn't stop him wearing it as 'dress-up' on the grounds that it is clothing more usually worn by women.

Heathcliffscathy · 30/06/2005 15:17

is it possible that your fear of your child being bullied feeds the prejudice?

anyway, i'm sorry enid and annieq. i was hoping this wasn't going to disintegrate, and looks like i have in part been responsible for that (i say in part, because both of your reactions to my comments have upped the heat on this thread considerably). still, [do it sophable do it] i am sorry, unreservedly.

i have to go an wake ds now, am not running away.

still wondering about what is inappropriate? still wondering about use of that word and what it means?