Why are so many men obsessed with getting abs?

[PGWo]

I see it on the cover of any men's magazines when I go out. Why do men starve themselves and spend every waking hour working out just to get some bumps on their stomach?
Do they actually think it would impress women? Any woman who cares about abs probably isn't worth their time anyway.

I think OP must be joking around. Come on, admit it! 😀 if not then it's one of the most exasperating threads I've read on S & B

And only responding or engaging with particular points and ignoring the rest. It makes no sense!

@PGWo

I see it on the cover of any men's magazines when I go out. Why do men starve themselves and spend every waking hour working out just to get some bumps on their stomach? Do they actually think it would impress women? Any woman who cares about abs probably isn't worth their time anyway.

This is a minority of men though. I am currently OLD and most men who "generously" share topless pics of themselves haven't been near a gym in years, if ever.

[quote MoreHolidays]@Jonny1265
Where isn't the bullying? The sport revolves around being able to severely injure the opponent as much as possible. The possibility of injury is a feature of the game, not an unfortunate byproduct.

"It’s surprising how often adult rugby players also mention the importance of pain and injury, the very things that ring alarm bells for doctors (and mothers). The knowledge that you’ll probably get hurt a bit – cut, scratched, bruised if not actually stretchered off – seems part of the point."

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/mar/04/rugby-dangerous-children-risks-schools-sport-available-all?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Other[/quote]
Pain and injury isn't the definition of bullying though is it? Bullying is unwanted and a power imbalance. Where is that in rugby?? And injury is possible in many sports. As I said earlier, I got more injuries playing football than I did rugby. Being stretchered off is extremely rare. I never witnessed it in 10 years of playing at either club, county or professional level.

But masculinity doesn't have a lot of meaning in an isolated sense. It's the social or cultural behaviours expected of men, this will differ depending on the culture around you.

I grew up working class and some of the men I was exposed to were more likely to maintain masculine identity through fighting, how much they could drink and quite performative masculinity. (This is my experience only - I am not saying all WC men). We'd probably call this toxic masculinity now.

The middle class men I met at university might be more likely to define their masculinity though being able to financially support those around them or knowing a lot about which wine goes with what or how to ski (just silly examples).

There is no single definition of masculinity or femininity - just head over to the gender boards to see that!

@MoreHolidays

I think what you may be overlooking OP *@PGWo* is that we want our partners to desire us sexually. It's not that we feel like we have to, but that it's what we want. Not to mention, sex is much better when it's with somebody who desires you physically. For the record, I'm not offended if other men check me out. They can appreciate my shapely bum or my big boobs all they want. I'm sure *@PurpleDaisies* feels the same - no need to be careful!

I assume that when I am in public, people notice what I look like in the same way as I notice what they look like. There’s no need for me to be bothered unless people to choose to act inappropriately by commenting or staring.

The op does not seem understand that you can be attracted to someone both for their physical attributes and their personality. You can’t really have a successful relationship without some sort of physical spark. That doesn’t mean your partner needs the body of an athlete.

@elidelochanthefirst
Yes butnwomen who are attracted to abs arr much more likely to be attracted to the fighting men you described than the wine-drinking skiers.

Look at the muscular male sex symbols. They're usually either rugby players (very violent) or actors known for playing violent, aggressive characters. Nothing like the middle-classic people you met at university.

Plenty of women drink wine and ski and nobody thinks of them as masculine. That's not true about fighting and drinking.

Wouldn't you prefer he appreciate your personality and humanity?

@PGWo can you please explain why you think it is one or the other? Does your partner not find your body attractive? Don’t you find them physically attractive?

@PurpleDaisies
It's nice if they do though.

Yes butnwomen who are attracted to abs arr much more likely to be attracted to the fighting men you described than the wine-drinking skiers.

How can you possibly know that? You’re just making stuff up and staying is as fact, as you have done over and over on this thread.

[quote PGWo]@EssexLioness

What else does masculinity mean?[/quote]
Yeah you’re definitely taking the piss now OP! Google it - you’re quite clearly not listening to anything any of us say. One of the stupidest posts I’ve seen on MN and I’ve been here for a good 10 years or so

But we've given so many examples of men who are ballet dancers with amazing abs, look at the strictly come dancing dancers. Women who like men with abs aren't base cave men seekers who only fight! We can appreciate lots of things about men!!

@PurpleDaisies
Earlier you told me you have a good bottom and bosom and I said you should be careful lest men notice you. I shouldn't have said that and I apologize.

What I should have said is that you wouldn't want men to notice your body when you're out in the supermarket. You know it'd be wrong of them to do that, that only a sex pervert looks at women like that. Why should we think any differently of women who look at men like that?

As for my husband, he's not muscular. In fact he's quite thin. I don't think that's bad. Again, we met at university and we were both more interested in studying and doing well academically than partying or studying.

Why on Earth would a woman who is interested in muscles like some middle-class wine drinking skier?
Like countless women here have said, abs are attractive because they convey masculinity i.e. strength, aggression. Fighting does that too.
Think about all of the muscular male sex symbols - Jason Momoa, Dwayne Johnson, Rugby players etc. They're famous for either being aggressive themselves or playing characters who are.

@elidelochanthefirst
What are some examples of ballet dancers who women find attractive?
@EssexLioness
I'm curious what you think it means.

Er.... Have you seen Matthew Bourne's Swan Lake!!!

And I think Henry Cavil appreciates skiing and a nice wine...

[quote PGWo]@elidelochanthefirst
Yes butnwomen who are attracted to abs arr much more likely to be attracted to the fighting men you described than the wine-drinking skiers.

Look at the muscular male sex symbols. They're usually either rugby players (very violent) or actors known for playing violent, aggressive characters. Nothing like the middle-classic people you met at university.

Plenty of women drink wine and ski and nobody thinks of them as masculine. That's not true about fighting and drinking.[/quote]
Are you genuine with what you are posting? This is one big wind-up

I'm just going to add some more gorgeous dancers because hey, it's nice to look at 😆

Masculine and feminine are just social constructs which are pretty outdated concepts now. It died out about the same time as boys were expected to wear blue and pink was for girls. Your views are so perculiar and sound like something out of the Victorian age: outdated views on gender, sexual attraction, lack of understanding about what healthy bodies really look like etc.

[quote PGWo]@FrangipaniBlue

What else could it mean? What's is 'masculinity'? What is a 'masculine' personality?[/quote]
From the Oxford Dictionary...

"having qualities or appearance traditionally associated with men"

Are you saying all men are violent?

I missed your apology. Thank you for accepting you were wrong to tell me to “be careful”.

What I should have said is that you wouldn't want men to notice your body when you're out in the supermarket. You know it'd be wrong of them to do that, that only a sex pervert looks at women like that. Why should we think any differently of women who look at men like that?

I don’t go to the supermarket thinking about whether people are looking at my arse or not. If I’ve been to the gym, I guess whoever is behind me might notice I’ve got a nice figure. I don’t think that necessarily makes them a “sex pervert”. I’ve noticed guys who look for when I’m out and about. I don’t know how they would know that. You’re being totally disingenuous to suggest that nobody except perverts thinks about how attractive other people around them are. I am not condoning sexual harassment at all. I am talking about what we all think in our private thoughts.

As for my husband, he's not muscular. In fact he's quite thin. I don't think that's bad. Again, we met at university and we were both more interested in studying and doing well academically than partying or studying.

You’ve totally missed the point I was making. I was asking if you found your partner physically attractive, not whether or not he was muscular. That’s how relationships work. There’s a spark of physical attraction. It’s totally nuts to pretend otherwise. My husband is also this, not particularly muscular and has no visible abs. When I first saw him, the first thing I thought was that I found him good looking.

[quote PGWo]@PurpleDaisies
Earlier you told me you have a good bottom and bosom and I said you should be careful lest men notice you. I shouldn't have said that and I apologize.

What I should have said is that you wouldn't want men to notice your body when you're out in the supermarket. You know it'd be wrong of them to do that, that only a sex pervert looks at women like that. Why should we think any differently of women who look at men like that?

As for my husband, he's not muscular. In fact he's quite thin. I don't think that's bad. Again, we met at university and we were both more interested in studying and doing well academically than partying or studying.

Why on Earth would a woman who is interested in muscles like some middle-class wine drinking skier?
Like countless women here have said, abs are attractive because they convey masculinity i.e. strength, aggression. Fighting does that too.
Think about all of the muscular male sex symbols - Jason Momoa, Dwayne Johnson, Rugby players etc. They're famous for either being aggressive themselves or playing characters who are.[/quote]
It’s not wrong for anyone to notice the body of someone of the opposite sex 🙄 It would be wrong If someone walked up to you and grabbed your boobs, or shouted ‘get your tits out’. This is why I think you’re on the wind up now. Nobody thinks like this surely. So what if a random man happens to notice a women’s body, or vice versa. Are you seriously expecting us to believe you have never noticed someone else’s attractive body, and that the only people you know doing this are perverts 😆

Honestly OP 😅

Anyway, to play along.

Why on Earth would a woman who is interested in muscles like some middle-class wine drinking skier?

They could be both? A middle class skier, with muscles, who drinks nice wine.

Even the Queen famously found Prince Philip attractive in her early teens before they were dating, so I guess she must be a pervert too. How dare she be attracted to his body

A body that is masculine in someone's opinion and 'toxic masculinity' are different things.
Your implication seems to be that heterosexual women who appreciate a physically fit/muscled male form are all shills for the violent patriarchy and heterosexual men with an (even silent) appreciation for the female form however it comes are all sex-obsessed perverts.
What you find physically attractive is not a political choice. Who you choose to partner with can be but sexual preferences and likes and dislikes aren't social/political statements.
Would you make the venn diagram of men with abs/rugby players/men who display toxic masculinity a circle???
And would you blame women who like men with abs for encouraging toxic masculinity?
By the way my DH is lovely and squishy round the middle so I have no skin in this game other than to try and bat for some sense and reason.

I don't want men to suffer chasing an extreme ideal any more than I want women to, but attacking physical features that give people a tingle below the belly is nonsense. Call out bad behaviour (in men and women) if you want, but associating a behaviour with a body type and then calling out the body type and those who are attracted to it is a bit off the rails.

Men's abdominal rectus isn't like a pouch for keeping bad words and deeds in, and the bigger they are the more they have tucked away in there...

Why on Earth would a woman who is interested in muscles like some middle-class wine drinking skier?

I'm guessing you've not watched much of the Winter Olympics then OP?

and don't even get me started on the bobsleigh teams........