🐌 Fantastic Skincare: Hairmageddon looms...

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Thread 11

For those who are taking a peek and wondering what this all about, we mostly discuss a bit of advanced skincare here with a perspective of seeking out the right ingredients (rather than the latest new shiny product and all its empty promises) for our particular skin needs. Distinguishing the acid toners from the actives whilst avoiding the truly unimpressive and harmful ingredients with a hope to achieve a bit of anti-ageing, alleviate irritation and sensitivities with some idle chat in between. Newcomers are always welcome but please note the following:

Questions and asking for help on this thread is encouraged, however, we can’t give you a specific routine to follow and hope it works out for the best. There are no overnight miracles in skincare whether it be in the form of products or techniques. It’s about perseverance, understanding your skin, assessing its needs and responding to that in a diligent manner.

These threads were created to help those who want to learn for themselves. We’re a group of interested and invested skincare nuts happy to offer tea and sympathy and dole out advice. Everyone’s journey with skincare is different, what is universal and binds us is that through actually learning about the different active ingredients it helps us get to know our skin and help us adapt as it will change many times throughout our lives - with seasons, hormonal changes, ageing, genetics etc. It's in everyone's best interests to get to know their skin and to keep reviewing those changes with the confidence that comes from the gathered knowledge here. We really encourage you to spend the time reading through previous threads and linked info sheets that the many contributors have taken the trouble to share.

By no means are we experts, we're only a bunch of amateurs that can only respond by suggesting what we would do in your place, for any severe conditions please seek out professional help.

Ahem, and finally a little note on spending. I'm well aware these threads cause many to reach for their wallets and spend with wild abandon. There can sometimes be a bit of a frenzy surrounding the excitement around a newly discovered product or on the back of great improvements when someone reports back. This is all great, it doesn't however, mean everything that's a sudden miracle for one will be it for you. Usually, it's a light bulb moment for connecting the right skincare ingredient with an individual experiencing a specific problem. Take your time to mull over decisions and question whether it's right for you too. Skincare is highly individual, it's a slow game that should cost mostly in patience, input, education, and perseverance. Please don't make it cost you financially needlessly.

I am very slowly working on consolidating the gathered information from previous threads into easier to read formats but it’s slow going. I would suggest reading thread 1 and at the very least the following info sheets (provided they apply to you):

Where to Start

Basics of an Actives Routine

Skin Types vs. Skin Conditions Info Sheet

Anti-Ageing Info sheet

Adult Acne Info Sheet

NEWish since previous threads:

Understanding Which Sunscreen(s) to Buy

Do I Really Need to Wear Sunscreen Every Single Day of the Year?

A Damaged Skin Barrier - Now What?

FEBRUARY 2018: The month of February sucks. Period. We’re sick of winter and the state of our finances, some are embracing frugality (in different shapes and forms) but water bills and car maintenance are ruining our buzz. Hair appointments need to be made despite the palpitations of fear that the mere thought incites. Oh, and skin texture. As you were...

Sophie I agree, the whole Retonil thing is confusing especially when % isn't listed with ingredients. I've been using serum with retinol listed as one of the ingredients for a good while but would guess the % was low. I added in indeed surface reface and saw a difference quickly with that and that's the most one I reacted with a little dryness to but I used it too often at first. There's also fillers in the indeed so probably they were the reason for the initial quick results.
There's no doubt the retinol has helped the lines on my forehead and a couple on my top lip, so I'm delighted with that.
Miffy nice haul you got

Hi Lone, so to clarify (more to myself than anyone else) you're using the Indeed Retinol Reface, which I believe (but could well be wrong!) falls broadly into the same category at the TO retinols/oids.

Sophie I started off using indeed reface after using serum which retinol was an minor ingredient. I had sample sizes then of other retinol products, can't remember names and then started on TO retinol .5% and have literally just started 1% last week.
I like how TO feels on my skin as it's in an oil squalene, I also liked the Indeed, it kinda left a smooth feeling most likely from the fillers. I'm was tempted by it again as it's on offer in Boots as is their vitamin C but I've plenty now so didn't and offer finishes today.
Their vitamin C was 22% and I think contained HA. Actually I think I'll order that this evening it's a good price.

Thanks Bo for your opinion on Aldi products. I wish skin care had to come with a clearer ingredient list and what % of each product it contains.

Sophie I'm mainly using retinol / retinoid as a preventative measure therefore I don't really feel I need a strong one yet to make any drastic changes line or wrinkle wise as I don't have any.

So I'm happy to stick with TO 2% retinoid granactive (my skin is fussy with oils so have avoided the squalene).
However I'm very excited to be using the Neostrata retinol then the PC retinol from pupsie to see what difference that could make to resurfacing my imperfect cheeks.

mint I just use any old conditioner because my hair needs washing everyday or I just put it up the second day so it doesnt really matter what I use these days as nothing makes any difference.

That said I am really enjoying using Syoss Olio 21 shampoo and conditioner. I did buy the Syoss salonplex but that was way to siliconey and heavy for my hair.

Hi Tant, thanks for that. I am still researching and trying to get everything clear in my head.

I did just read that squalane might cause spots so I was interested to see you have avoided it. One of my main reasons for changing my skincare is to stop getting spots.

I applied my squalane on on Friday and feel an under the skin spot coming up yesterday evening. The problem is I don't know if it's from the squalane or not.... would it have come up anyway?!

Just very confused

I have a retinol type question too - for those who are using differin, retin-a or a higher strength OTC retinol, do you also use a BHA like Paula's choice? I'm finding my skin can tolerate differin OR PC but not both. I don't ever use them together but even using alternate nights or leaving a night in between seems to make me dry/peely. Whereas if I ditch one completely then I'm fine and can use the other one every night with no problems.

Mint I use a garnier ultimate blends coconut hair mask which can be used as a mask, a wash out conditioner or a leave in conditioner on both wet and dry hair. It's for dry hair though, I think it would be too rich/heavy for anyone who doesn't have very dry, thick & frizzy hair.

Ps I'm using the neostrata till it runs out then I will start using PC retinol. (but I might try out the PC one night just to see)

I use PC BHA before my 2% retinoid but that's because it's mild, but I like that I can use both, it works for me for now anyway.

Your face would probably be on fire if you used it before Retin-A.

I was alternating BR P50 and Retirides (tretinoin) 0.05%, 3 nights a week each. No problems.

However...I tried Pestle & Mortar Superstar oil last night and had the first EVER peeling situation. Seriously, I never had it before with TO original 2%/Differin gel /Retirides 0.025 or even 0.05. I have been using some form of retinol for years (LRP and Avene versions to begin with) but never had the skin peel like last night. How do people cope? Do you just bear it out and cleanse the following morning?

Peely skin drives me mad Miffy I find using the FAB cleanser and ultra repair moisturiser helps, along with LRP cicaplast peeling skin cream (which has now been renamed). I also use lots and lots of thermal water spray, layering in between serums and moisturiser and even misting over my makeup when it's really bad, and ditch powders completely. My makeup disappears super fast but I'd rather that than have it clinging to all the horrid peely bits.

According to all the YouTube videos I've watched, some flaking and peeling is to be expected with tretinoin and differin and as long as there's no redness, soreness or other irritation then you just push through, it should pass in 8-12 weeks.

I didn't get any peeling at all with differin until I added PC into the mix and I'm fine with PC if I'm not using differin, definitely seems to be an either/or thing for me.

I have yet to try a retinol. So I can't advise I'm afraid. Peely skin is super annoying though.

Tried to wave my hair and it doesn't work. It looks too young like a child's. Think it's the one length at the front. Straight it's boring and I think a bit frumpy. Wavy it's childish and HUGE. Plus my fringe is waving to the side slightly which has never happened before this cut. Gaaah. Back to the hair salon/stylist hunt. I'd honestly pay £100 for the train fare to London if I could find someone magic. I don't think this one understood thick hair.

Sallie I know what you mean. I’m using differin and have PC BHA too. I’m using differin about 6 nights a week, with some flakiness and peeling. I think I intuitively knew that PC was causing more dryness as I’ve been avoiding using it. Like you, I was totally fine using PC BHA on it’s own but doesn’t seem to work well as a combination. My skin is clearer generally so I don’t feel I’m missing the BHA. I’m also using up a REN glycolic mask once a week, which although not BHA also leaves me dry. I think weather isn’t helping
You could try using BHA one morning, see if that makes a difference?

miffy how bizarre that pestle and mortar retinol has done that. I thought it was a gentle one. All a bit trial and error I suppose but I wouldn’t have predicted that since you’ve used Tretinoin before. Why the switch?

Thanks JDSTER glad it's not just me, I think I'll ditch the PC (though might try just using one morning a week) as I really want to be using differin consistently every night. I've been very stop/start with it over winter and from what I've heard/seen on YouTube consistent long term use is the key. I may move onto tret once we're out of the cold weather and definitely don't think it would be a good idea to use PC with that.

I'm sorry about your hair Enid are you letting it dry wavy naturally or using a tongs etc? I know this would be a bit of faff but could you straighten it and then just tong the ends for a bit of wave/movement? I was thinking of getting a blunt cut fringe in mine but I'm probably better off sticking with my current long side swept effort as it naturally veers off to one side anyway and I think a blunt fringe might be pouffy/mushroom like on me.

I was stop/start too Sallie but I’ve made a concerted effort this last month to use it most nights. Dr Sam and Dr Dray talk about the concept of ‘most bang for your buck’ which is what you get with a good retinoid/retinol. I know that differin is working on oil production and pores better than a BHA can. I’m seeing good results with the differin, which I wasn’t getting previously with just PC BHA. Change of foundation and stepping away from primer might have contributed to clearer pores but whatever it is, I’m satisfied (for now). I’ve still got P50w to introduce but reluctant to rock the boat at the moment, while I’m a bit dehydrated.

JDSTER Same here, Dr Sam, Dr Dray and others I've watched have convinced me differin or tret need to used consistently on the long term to see benefits, one of them said it can take 6 months plus to see a difference and skin can get worse (dryness, peeling) before it gets better. So I need to stop flibbertigibbeting around stopping and starting and adding new/different things to my routine.

Sallie I did it like you suggested. It's how I always used to do it when I wanted instant waves. Maybe it's not long enough or too blunt. 🤷🏻‍♀️ I wish I'd asked my old hairdresser how she used to cut it before she left. She won't remember now.

Must concentrate on this being step 2 to getting my hair back how I like it. It is just hair.

😬

How are you getting on with the roller Sallie? I get a bit of puffiness in the mornings sometimes. I bet a jade roller kept on the fridge would do wonder for puffy bits. Cooling.

Sallie oh I missed the bit about straightening first. I haven't tried that. Just blowdried it straightish. Could be an option, thank you.

Mint Redken heatcure masks are fantastic for dry or rough feeling hair.
I highly recommend the Olaplex treatment I just had at the hair salon. I think you can ask for it as a stand alone treatment even if you don't have a colour. I can't fault how shiny, silky and smooth my hair is at the moment even if the cut is annoying me a bit. It's worked wonders.

Heatcure masks here. m.lookfantastic.com/redken-heatcure-at-home-self-heating-mask-100ml/11346908.html?affil=thggpsad&switchcurrency=GBP&shippingcountry=GB&gclid=EAIaIQobChMI84bf1cnq2QIVjpTtCh1zhg4rEAQYASABEgJKi_D_BwE

Expensive for just 4 masks but for a special treatment they're good.

I'm using Lush American Cream atm but rate the Garnier Ultimate Blends range. I used to use the Argan oil one and found it very nourishing. (Orange bottle) Can't remember what your hair type is. Mine is thick, oily roots after a couple of days and prone to dry ends.

Hope you sort your hair out Enid. It sounds frustrating.

Interested to read JDSTER and Sallie talking about prescription retinoic acid use. Not sure my skin would be ready for that. Decided to stop the TO as pretty convinced something in it doesn't agree with my skin and it didn't feel great on my skin. Got other spots coming up and hope they will go back down if I leave them alone.

Bo - do you use the verso eye serum and the Medik retinoate together? Also Bo (or anyone else but asking Bo as her skin seems similar to mine): what would you recommend for my skin in terms of a retinoid? Sensitive, combination on chin and dehydrated. No major deep lines. Some fine lines really - eg more around eyes when smile. Also the summer sun is starting to hit here (although I always wear SPF) so wonder if best to start a retinoid after the summer anyway....

My anti-red mark vit C arrived this morning - just in time for my new round of spots!!! Will have to wait for spots to go before using it.

And I should add that I have been using retinol cream and eye cream from Castalia for a few years now but no idea of the % of retinol (and the retinol is very far down on the ingredients list).

Miffy - read you used the LRP one. Would you recommend it?

Tant thank you I will take a look at that conditioner, I think I've seen it in Tesco??

Sallie I have a feeling I can't use anything with coconut, I'm not 100% sure but I think every time I've used something with coconut as an ingredient I get spots on scalp and around hairline.

Enid thank you I'll check those out too.

Do u all use sls free shampoos?

Also meant to say its difficult for me with conditioner because I HAVE to use it at my roots too as my hair is coarse and wiry (how attractive)