My DH and DD don't get on and it's hurting our family

[firelandmumma]

NC for this, long time MN-er!

For context: DD is 8.5 and I split with her dad when she was a baby. We ended things very amicably and have a brilliant co-parenting relationship, we are close friends, consult each other on all parenting decisions. We have her each half the week - 2.5 days here, 2.5 days at his, alternate weekends. Have done this since she was about 2. She has great relationships with me and her dad and apart from general sassiness and boundary testing, I'd say we are close.

Have long suspected DD is autistic and she is on the waiting list for assessment. Won't go into all the symptoms but one important one is that she is not a touchy person at all. The only people she will touch at all are me, her dad and one grandparent. She doesn't hug or hold hands, would absolutely never kiss any other relative and never has, even those she's very close to.

I met DH when she was 2y 10m old. We took things slowly initially and then he moved in during one of the covid lockdowns. I think he found it unusual even after we'd been together a few years when DD would never give him a bedtime hug or let him read to her etc, but never really questioned it and didn't try to force it. He tried to bond by playing games and play fighting and doing other funny things. As she got older, these behaviors heightened. She refused to let him take her to school (although we have moved past this now) and says 'i just want mummy'. For a while I pandered to it but it seemed to make it worse. Won't drink a drink he's made her, won't let him even pass her things.

Fast forward to today. She's 8.5, has two little sisters aged 3 and 1.

Whenever DD8 is her, she argues with DH non stop. It's just constant. She refuses to call him by his nickname (which is his established name, think Sam and Samuel) and only calls him by his full name which he hates. She speaks to him in this rude arrogant tone. If he speaks to her 'have you had a good day at school DD8?' she either completely blanks him or says 'yes I have, mummy'. At night time we will go to say good night to her and she goes 'night love you mummy' and he will say 'night DD8' - again, she blanks him. Sometimes if I prompt her, she will then go 'oh, night' to him.

Recently the behaviours have intensified and she's started hitting him, which her sisters have started copying. We are not a violent family at all, aside from play fighting and messing about. Earlier, DH asked DD to please move out of the way as he was trying to clean her room up. She replied 'no' and he said 'DD, I need to sort this stuff, and I can't if you're there' to which she just turned around and tried to kick him. He then walked into me and said he's done, she's a brat and he can't deal with it anymore.

Little 2 asleep so I have come into the bathroom, locked the door and told them I'm not speaking to either of them until they grow up and sort it out because it's upsetting me.

This is daily for YEARS. I just don't know what to do.

Obviously I've had many, many conversations with DD about this and why she doesn't like him, she just says 'i just don't he's DD3/1's dad not mine' or 'i don't know' or 'he's annoying'.

On occasions they're alone together when I've sent them on bonding exercises, they've actually got a long really well, especially if they do sports. But it's so short lived and usually ends the moment I'm back in the room.

Has anyone, anyone experienced this and have any advice?

I love my DH. I love my DD8. I'm worried about the impact on my other DDs and the family as a whole.

Well it won't just be random that she doesn't like your DH and hits him. You're looking at her behaviour and not the why. Something about him clearly distresses her. You say she's fine with her younger sisters so it's not simply a case of jealousy.

She’s hitting him because all her attempts at setting boundaries with an unrelated man have been stomped on.

she doesn’t like physical contact with him, so you allow and encouraged play fighting, honestly what’s wrong with you both?

she’s struggled the entire relationship yet you ploughed on regardless, you need to be her parent when she is with you, he needs to back off completely.

he also needs to keep out of her space, she’s reacting to her environment in the only way she feels she has left. You have created a living situation where she has zero privacy from a man she’s already completely uncomfortable with.

violence is never ok, but you have created this situation for your child. maybe she would have a happier life with her dad.

In the new Year you should decorate your bedroom for the DD- she could help choose colours/ decor. Then you should move into the bigger room.

I think you need to try separate what is her autism and what is not, and think calmly with her and dog about what she can be expected to do.
like, she can be expected to eat food he’s made of it doesn’t trigger her sensitivities. She can be expected not to hit and if she slips, to apologise afterwards.

being autistic doesn’t immediately lead to acceptance of such. You’re settin

Put yourself in her shoes and then tell us she’s being a brat!

Autistic, have a man she doesn’t like and hasn’t had a chance to slowly adjust to and bond with moved into her home, swiftly followed by new babies. Being moved from home to home every 2.5 days so having no stability at all and no reliable primary carer. Having a room that is invaded by the man she doesn’t like whenever he needs something from it. Enduring harmful play fighting in an attempt to force her to like said man. Being painted as the bad girl in all this when she lashes out - probably due to extreme deregulation with no real support at 8 years old (!) to make sure she is in a calm and safe environment with her needs met.

The poor girl is yet another victim of parents failing to consider her needs first and foremost.
Yes everyone deserves to be happy, I’m not saying the op should have remained single, but the relationship moved too quickly for most children to adjust in a healthy way, and things were done that did not take into consideration her need to not be poked and prodded by a strange man. The whole thing has been handled incredibly badly and will need immediate action to ensure the poor girl’s life does not end up a train wreck.

She needs stability pronto. This may mean living with her dad more.
She needs privacy, and certainly does not need a forced relationship with her step dad, no matter how lovely he may be.

This is what happens when you put your need for a man/more children ahead of your existing child. You’ve brought a man into her home that she doesn’t like and she has no choice over that, so she’s lashing out and trying to gain control in the only way she can.
You’ve created a family with him, which she isn’t really part of in the same way as the other siblings. You’re all a nuclear family that are related to each other and she’s the odd one out who has to leave every week and go to her dad’s. No amount of explaining and “bonding exercises” is going to change that. It’s all so obvious why she’s feeling unhappy and I really don’t understand these posts about her being a “brat”, “spoiled” or “coming down hard” on her with consequences. She’s clearly deeply unhappy with your family set up and if you do these things you’ll only make her more unhappy and angrier. She’ll be one of those people who leaves home as soon as she legally can and is then NC/low contact with you as she gets older.
Blended families are rarely in children’s best interests, especially the eldest child from the original relationship that’s broken down. But you’ve made your bed now and can’t really change it, so the best thing you can do is stop forcing things. Look after her yourself and limit your DH’s interactions with her, so there are fewer opportunities for conflict. She clearly hates him so trying to force a relationship won’t work.

Also, as others have said the DH’s clothes in a wardrobe in her room isn’t good. So she has no space that is just hers and she has him invading her room ever time he needs something. That’s at least something you can change.

The most important thing you can do is to arrange private therapy both for DD individually, and family therapy for you DH and DD together, to work through this with a professional.

What stands out to me in the OP is that your DD is possibly autistic. I would suggest reading up on parenting a ND child, as it is very different to a NT child - usual parenting techniques just don’t work!

a simplified way to think of it is that they have an extremely sensitive fight or flight response - traditional punishments can trigger this, hence her being argumentative, ‘difficult’ etc.

I know gentle parenting gets a bad rap on MN, but I have found it life changing with my 2 ND teens. Of course there are consequences for bad behaviour, but there are also clear explanations for the consequence. Boundaries have to be super clear and consistent - every time they are rude for instance, remind them ‘this is a kind and respectful home’ and rudeness results in 5 mins ‘to calm down’ in their room, or whatever. Try not to use ‘don’t’ - emphasise the expected behaviour etc. and of course you and DH have to model this behaviour. It is counterintuitive to do this - being positive and calm is difficult but behaviour is communication, and doing this can help DD to be reassured and reduce the fight or flight response.

I’m not an expert, but this is absolutely what has worked for me.

It sounds like she is continually disrespectful, unpleasant, and sometimes violent to him, and this doesn’t have consequences? I understand you are undergoing assessments for neurodiversity, but that shouldn’t give her the right to be disrespectful and aggressive. He also needs to learn to keep out of her space. Cleaning her room with her in it was never going to work, and she is away often enough it can be done then. She doesn’t want to be touched by anyone, so don’t try to, but having the expectation she says goodnight is not unreasonable.

OP have you addressed what @BakeOffRewatch has said? Because they're absolutely right.

He signifies the turmoil her life has been with the divorce, new family, new siblings, switching homes every 2.5 days - does it not seem like an awful lot for a small child? She’s unhappy and stressed. Your DH is in an impossible position. Family therapy would be a starting point.

’I'm worried in the future she will make the choice to live with Dad full time.’

Dont you just want whatever is best for your dd? She isn’t happy at your house. Because of the situation you and your dh created.

You don’t have days out while your DD is at her dad’s? I don’t understand that. Surely her dad takes her out? If so, why do the younger kids miss out on fun activities just because the older DD isn’t there?

I couldn’t handle it either OP, but you can’t force your DD to like your dp. Saying that, she shouldn’t be rude or putting her hands on other people. She needs to learn that actions have consequences.

She is clearly struggling and isn't happy.
She has had a new man and a dynamic forced upon her when she was very young, and hasn't bonded with him.
I think she rightly feels put aside with so much change in her very young life.

She should have been the priority when she was struggling with him from the very beginning.
Its been going on years.
She isn't going to grow out of this.

I would be speaking with her father and seeing would he be open to being resident parent.
If he was, then ask her would she like to trial living with him full-time and coming to visit you whenever she likes.

Perhaps feeling like she has some agency in her life would help her to feel more in control.

Parental breakdown, a new step father and two new siblings in 5 years is a lot for any child.
Not surprising at all she is struggling, and then you add in possible autism which often comes with resistance to change.

The back and forth between homes is notoriously unsettling for children.
I would be urgently seeking therapy for her, and family therapy if appropriate.
The teenage years have the potential to be absolutely brutal for you all if positive change doesn't happen for her.
Wishing you well.

Consequences don't work for ND kids. This poor girl has had a new man put into her life who touches her when she says no and walks into her bedroom all the time to get his clothes. She moves house twice per week every week. Can you even try to imagjne how stressful that is?

Couldn’t the clothes sorting wait until she was next at her dad’s? It sounds like your h’s presence makes things easier for you as he is the target of the more difficult aspects of h behaviour. If you want them to argue less then you need to take more of the heat that he’s facing. For example if he has to go into the wardrobe and she’ll be less angry with you rummaging in there then you need to do it or when she takes a bath, you do the sorting out so she doesn’t know. If it was still term time then I’d say do stuff like that when she’s at school but she’s at her dad’s every 2.5 days so there can’t be long to wait until next opportunity. Your h really doesn’t understand how having autism is very different to being bratty. While I sympathise with how annoying and impulsive kids can be, he’s not interacting with her as if the autism is a possibility and is creating problems for himself like not anticipating her reaction to him in her room and considering doing some sorting out when she’s with dad or out of the house.

I know that many adults will feel like that’s pandering but she’s going to have autism forever and he’s better off thinking about his interactions more if there’s a pattern or trigger. I’m not saying that problems will be his fault or that kids behave in a predictable way but he benefits from less conflict with her too. She’s going to get bigger and physically stronger - how would he have dealt with the situation if she’d been a full grown sized teen? I know it’s easy for me to give this kind of advice because I’m not living in this situation but hr needs to consider what it’s like for the younger girls too. Being bullish and arguing with dd1 frequently risks your home becoming one that adult dd2 and dd3 don’t want to visit.

You all have something in common that she doesn’t share. Sounds like she senses this

the disruption in the 2.5 days isn’t good imv - she is probably trying to claim you for herself when she is home and probably wondering what your little nuclear family are doing when she’s not there

I have asd kids and I think you have done her a disservice by not insisting on basic manners early on.
No way would I have tolerated my dc refusing a drink because it was made by someone else or deliberately blanking an adult. Basic manners are none negotiable.

Conversations i don't think are the way to go.
If she is rude then she does time out for 5mins - you need to implement though not dh as he isn't her dad.

Many of the comments on this thread on how to parent are not understanding that parenting a ND child follows none of the normal rules. They can’t give a shit for consequences or rewards.

You force your kids to consume drinks? That's appalling. Hello, bodily autonomy? How do you expect your kids to learn "never accept a drink that you didn't have eyes on from pouring to it being in your hand" anti-spiking advice when you force them to consume drinks that someone else made at home?

Ffs no. But if a child has asked for a drink but then won't drink it because one adult makes it then they would get another

Your common sense is lacking

How long had she known him before you moved him in ?

I think a lot of people on this thread have made excellent points and are spot on re. your DD. She isn't being a spoiled brat, she is trying her best to exist in what is a very turbulent situation, especially for someone who is most likely autistic. She probably doesn't even feel like she's got you on her side anymore since you are telling her and your H and they need to sort it and grow up. It's all very sad and I that the decision to move a new boyfriend in wasn't aborted when you realised that she didn't warm to him at all has done unimaginal damage to her trust in you. For her sake, maybe try and let her live with her dad for the majority of the time and you have her every other weekend and see if it settles. At the moment you are trying to force something that will never happen and it's just damaging her more every year that goes by.