I just want to be able to leave my house for a SIMPLE journey FFS!

[SimpleSimple]

My husband has a habit of basically anywhere we go, wanting to invite DSC. I get it for bigger things (although we do have them 50:50 and make sure to do things when they are here too) but it's even tiny silly things and everything then has to turn into a big thing of collecting, dropping off, waiting for them to finish X hobby before we can go or whatever. They live about a 10 minute drive away and providing they aren't out themselves doing something their mum is basically always fine for us to go and get them and take them out and drop them back off.

Anyway, we had a big of an argument last night because we went to collect our child from pre school at about 6pm and both agreed we'd not had the day for going home and cooking so we said how about a spontaneous McDonald's trip. We were just pulling out from preschool when he starts with the 'can I just ring ex and ask if DSC want to come' and I lost it (not shouting or anything) and said 'can we just go on a simple McDonalds trip without having to mess around picking up, dropping off, waiting for them to finish XYZ before we can go'. It's McDonald's for goodness sake, not a five star holiday.

It's not that we never go to McDonald's either, we do so it's not some massive treat that DSC never ever get.

I can't stand it. The feeling like we can't ever just nip out somewhere that might be considered even remotely good or fun or a treat without first ringing around, waiting, picking up, dropping off etc etc.

I want to be sympathetic because I know it must be hard not to see you children as much as you'd like but for goodness sake it just gets stupid. I'm then accused of not wanting to see them blah blah.

And before anyone asks, if my child was elsewhere for the night yes I absolutely would take my other child to McDonald's without waiting for or going to collect the other!

It could be argued that the DSC knowing dad wants to see them as much as possible is a need, not a want. However they can still know all that with 50/50 contact plus all the planned extras that OP says they do. OP hasn’t complained about the planned extras at all, in fact is clearly supportive of it.

There’s also the effect on the DSC of the impact on their time with mum’s, even if mum is happy with it. My own DH had his DC Thu-Sun every single week, how lovely gut the kids you might think. Except it hurts my now-adult DSC that mum didn’t want to spend any weekends with them because she preferred to stay over at her DP’s house each weekend instead (which is fact, not speculation, she pushed back massively when we suggested she might like to spend some weekend time once a month with the DC).

And why would the DC think dad (or mum) has left when the contact schedule is 50/50? How can there be a “leaver” when contact time is equal (on paper at least).

I'd be pissed off if I was mum, was likely to be midway through cooking dinner and dad rang offering an arguably more interesting option.

YANBU OP, it sounds really annoying, he's thinking only of himself in this. You're entitled to your own time as a family unit, and mum is allowed some undisturbed time with her kids as well.

You’re right

I don’t thankfully

so I will bow out

If the mum really doesn’t mind having less than 50:50 and the disturbances don’t really bother her then it would arguably be better in terms of stability for the dc for their dad to have main residency and the mum go to a 2-3 days a fortnight arrangement with her limited time properly respected and protected. There would be the issue of “mum wasn’t bothered, she just let dad have us” but at least they would have consistency and the OP would be able to get a burger when she wants one (11-12 days a fortnight at any rate)

I think it’s more likely that it does annoy the mum. Not only does she have less than 50% contact but she has lots of interaction with her ex. If she doesn’t answer the phone then he calls again in a few minutes, if her dc are out of busy then he turns up anyway and waits. She might be halfway through cooking and Disney dad is there dangling a takeaway. She might want to take them to the cinema - dads already done it. She wants them to finish all their school work so the next night they can go out, watch a movie or just chill - they can’t do it because Dad is there taking them off somewhere. They are overtired and could do with some downtime and an early night - tough, dad needs validation. What does she say “no, you can’t see your dad, no you can’t have a burger? Why? Because I’m mean and unreasonable”. The kids are definitely old enough to be aware of this dynamic and I’d be surprised if they didn’t know what their job in it is.

I think the reason the other mum doesn’t mind being disturbed or her own plans being disrupted is because it doesn’t happen half as often as OP suggests. I suspect the op is grossly exaggerating. I don’t think they intended any malice but just got annoyed because dh made a suggestion.

It’s not really about “seeing” your dad every day. From pov of the child it’s the idea of being the child who was left.

Posters were making a point about OP’s child seeing his dad everyday, as though he has a one up over his siblings. It’s really irritating and annoying when on so many threads second children are begrudged normal childhood things just in case we don’t upset the dsc any further for something that isn’t the second child’s fault. They’re still a child themselves. That’s what I was addressing.

Now people are making up situations in their head to justify their mad reasonings...

Regardless of any motives he has. The reality is that everyone in this situation is being expected to revolve around him. He's being selfish toward everyone

@HyacinthBookay

pure speculation.

I wonder what the dynamics would be if mum had a b/f? Would the b/ f get ticked off at their dad ringing up a couple of times if kids were out doing something or other? Would he get annoyed if the father hung around while his DC finished their homework or activity?
The mum having a serious relationship would really put someone's nose right out of joint...what do you think?

The youngest child is too young to be aware of any differences after all, he only has an hour with his parents before he's rocked off to bed. That's 1 whole hour to be picked up from nursery at 6pm, driven home, eat dinner (after mum's cooked it) then in bed at 7pm, not counting the daft idea that dad wants to include the DSC on occasion and starts ringing his ex whereby that impinges on the 1 hour window from pick up to bed with littlest one.
I hope mum gets a b/f soon, very soon.

@Zwicky
100% agree.

Bang on.

It doesn't matter that youngest DC is at the back of the queue. He gets to see dad eat toast in the morning before school.

It doesn't matter that youngest DC can't even have a burger without the important children. He gets to see dad when he gets home from work.

And these aren't poor little SC who come over twice a month. They live with their same dad, every other day!!!

It is indeed utter bollocks that because they leave every other day, to see their mother, that youngest child should be forever indebted because his mother's bedroom is in the same house!

The parents chose to live separately. So their children have two homes. It is not the fault or at the expense of the youngest child that it's parents chose to live together.

Can you imagine the mum trying to get a quick Macdonald's for her kids, and Disney Dad halting her, and telling her she needs to wait an hour and pick up his other child, because it's not fair.

"Get a grip, he's not my child, he's not supposed to be with me, it's a £3 burger, I do not need your interference and disruption while I'm parenting" would be the quite correct reply.

It's a reply that applies exactly to OP. She's too kind and polite to say that. And if she says anything suggesting the same, he gaslights her "well, you obviously don't like them". Utter prick.

The dad seems to think when it is not his contact time, he can act like he has 100% custody. Which would be irritating if it was just OP and him. But to keep making digs at his own child, that it's not worth making a proper meal, or even having a £3 burger unless the other children are hauled over first, that's frankly disgraceful.

@Zwicky absolutely.

There is so much unwitting projection on this thread of unhealthy feelings that adults can't deal with onto children. Those same adults sanctimoniously tell the rest of us that we're terrible, anti-SDC, resentful people. It simply isn't the case.

Nobody denies that a divorce or separation can be really hard for children. Nobody denies that it can be difficult for children seeing mum or dad living with new siblings or step-siblings and not with them full time anymore. How the parents react to this is crucial. It is perfectly possible to ensure that your children feel secure in your love for them and in their number 1 role in your life without 1) pandering to them 2) putting their needs and wants above everyone else's involved all the time. This isn't necessary and when the DH in the original post does this, he is causing emotional harm to all his children as well as to his marriage.

Children thrive on routine and boundaries. Children need to feel secure in their parents' love for them. Such a massive part of this includes healthy emotional boundaries, whether you live full time with your children or not, and EVEN when setting those boundaries is hard for you as the parent. You're the adult, you take the emotional hit give your children the sense of security they need and to make sure that they grow up with healthy models of behaviour and healthy management of emotions.

The DH's first children will be absolutely aware that he feels guilty and that he will put what he believes they want above his wife and current child. This level of power is unhealthy for children and will make them feel insecure, whilst also leading them to believe they are missing out when they're not if they can't come and potentially causing them to grow up with an entitlement complex, believing they should be at the centre of the family universe at all times.

Parenting when not living with your kids full time is tough. The guilt is hard. The missing them is hard. But as the adult, you have to manage those feelings effectively to provide healthy boundaries for your children. Inviting the children is not a problem. Making everyone else's plans and lives fit around them at all times is.

*should say child he currently lives with full time, not just current child btw!

Totally agree

It’s really interesting how the dad should be making sure his children don’t feel abandoned by him with ridiculous outings like this, but the mum could go out for a quick Mcdonalds with any younger children she may have and not her older ones, and nobody would bat an eyelid about it.

Not having a go at the mum by the way. It’s perfectly reasonable for her to get on with her life when her children are with her father. But why is it different for the dad? They both parted ways and decided that the children won’t live with both parents anymore, but apparently the dad should be making extra effort to prove how unabandoned they are to the point that he makes his younger child wait for his tea so that hoops can be jumped through to include dsc.

You just wouldn’t see a mum doing stupid things like that to her younger DC all in the name of making sure her older children feel loved by her. Why? Because it’s horrible and unnecessary.

The dad does it and he gets hailed a hero for making extra effort with his older ones. Everything else is ignored because as a divorced father he should be doing last invites to McDonald’s to the detriment of everyone else. After all, the first were born first.

YANBU co-parenting 101 : respect the time!

It can be adjusted for big things like you say but every little thing is not fair on other parent and to an extent, the kids too.

I wouldn't stop them going, DD's dad wouldn't stop her coming with me for a little trip either, but neither of us would be happy about it. Just because mum says "yeah you can go" doesn't mean she isn't sat there looking at the meal she has made that they're not going to eat now.

Well we all do to some degree. There has to be speculation. Do we really believe that the ex would put up with being constantly badgered like this or is OP exaggerating about this happening as often as she implies? I have no idea. And neither do any of you.

what Does he mean though? Was he able to explain? I’d want clarity on that. It might lead to an important discussion.

I understand his need to make first child know that he has absolutely not been abandoned but perhaps this is not the exact way to do it. I think I’d want to support my husband in finding a way to do that moving forward.

If you can’t both discuss this and work something out then there are big problems because you’re suggesting that it is an insufferable situation for you. I’m not sure he is ever going to change. Getting the support for your anger on here is one thing but of no help whatsoever when it comes to actually dealing with this.

I completely get your frustration OP and as you’d expect are getting a hard time as a ‘wicked stepmum’.

My solutions would be to not discuss before just driven straight to McDonalds. Or to say I’m getting me and our DC a McDonalds. If you want to join us fine, but I’m eating now and not waiting for DSCs to join us. If you want them to have a McDs then you can sort that out after we’re home.

I don't think anyone would understand the dynamic the OP is describing, unless they are a step parent too.

@InceyWinceySpidy
You said it all. 100% correct.