When will the bath time stop?

[mannytomanny]

I have two DSC and one ours baby.
The DSC aged 10 girl and 7 boy come to ours after school two days a week.
I find these nights chaotic and messy.
These plans have been in place since the kids started school and goes like this
DH drives to pick them up from school (30 mins) and they come to ours with their bags including pjs which they have to take to school that morning, they do their homework while DH cooks them elaborately different meals to suit their particular likes (while messing up the kitchen) they get their bath, DH still washes the eldest hair(is this normal?) apparently they only wash their hair at ours.
Everything seems such a rush for them as they have to be back at their mums by half 6 and she's 40 mins away. House is left a mess which I do when DH is away, they leave their uniforms here and I wash them and pack them for them to take away next time.
Anyway when will the silly bath and pj thing no longer be appropriate, I just see it as an extra thing to cram in when really they should be able to be more relaxed... it's not a fun time for them it's like a military operation. They are packed into the car with wet hair and pjs for a long drive.
It's not an option to drop them off later either as DM is very strict with not having her evening ruined by late arrival of her children.

It’ll last until your DH grows a pair and tells his ex this nonsense has to stop.
Either the children stay over more or they go back to hers the way they left it in the morning.
This is crazy for kids their ages.

@BingBongToTheMoon but it doesn't seem to bother him, it's just made to be... normal.
So if the hair washing stops would it be normal for them to go home in pjs? I just thought this might happen in these sort of situations

@Kanaloa

From what you’ve said they barely every stay overnight, so these two meals and bath times a week is basically the only parenting their father does?

I agree it’s bizarre to pick them up, feed and bathe them, then drop them off. They should be staying over more often so he can do a proper share of parenting. If this routine stopped, he would only see them one in every three Saturdays? That’s ridiculous.

This.

It all sounds very stressful and rushed but if he only has them overnight one night a month then I don't really blame their mum for wanting him to do a share of the harder part of parenting, which includes the night time routine.

I think he really needs to negotiate dropping them home an hour later if the current arrangement continues, or having them overnight in the week and EOW, which would be more standard.

The PJ's to school thing I find quite sad really. My dc never had to take anything to school to go to their dad's - he has PJ's, etc there for them as he wanted it to feel like another home for them, not somewhere they visit.

OP, you should stop with the PA remarks and hinting. The kids wont be daft and full aware of what you are doing and thats not nice.

However those baths need to stop its unnecessary. I would just say ' lets stop the baths so you can relax properly with the kids when they are here'

The messing the kitchen up would annoy me too, tell him to clean up properly.

[quote mannytomanny]@BingBongToTheMoon but it doesn't seem to bother him, it's just made to be... normal.
So if the hair washing stops would it be normal for them to go home in pjs? I just thought this might happen in these sort of situations[/quote]
No I think even if the help with bathing stops, travelling to one parents house simply to do home work/bath/dinner only to travel back to the other parents house to sleep, is unusual. It just sounds unsettling. No adult would want to unwind and prep for bed in one place only to jump in the car to another place to sleep.

It sounds unusual that you don’t know how or why this arrangement came about. Is your oh not keen to talk about it.

I wonder if this was specified in a court order when they were smaller and they just haven’t thought about changing the arrangement to account for age.

If he’s not going through CSa then an overnight doesn’t have to affect what he pays surely.

@Whatinthelord it's such a lot of driving time too, on these days they spend over an hour in the car and that's not including the morning pick up.
I would say it's me that's reluctant to discuss it, I thought it might have been the done thing as I'm from a nuclear family myselfi had no idea what was ideal. No courts were ever involved although there was mediation I think

So effectively, a 10yr old has to be bathed in in their pj’s by ten to six, in order to be driven home for 6.30pm? Ridiculous! Why can’t they have a wash when they get home? Definitely needs a rethink

With regards to the hair washing, my older dd still needed help at 10, whereas my younger one has been washing her hair herself since she was 6, so I think it really depends on the child.

You're only looking at it from your own point of view. Perhaps your husband likes them to have a bath as he misses out on their usual evening routine. Perhaps he washes their hair because it's another thing he misses out on and because, you say, they only seem to wash it at your house. He cooks their dinners - he's not asking or expecting you to do it. You tidy up after the meal and wash the school uniforms, which is good of you.

I'm speaking as the granny of 2 kids the same ages (10 and 7) as your husband's kids. My son, their dad, is in the same position as your husband. He has his children for one evening after school (it's all the ex will allow, apart from alternate weekends) and that's from 3 - 6pm. In those 3 hours, he has to get them home, listen to them read, help with homework, cook the meal, ensure that the children have a shower and put pyjamas on, get all their things together, take them back to their mother.

I wonder if you resent the time your husband has the children, perhaps because you'd prefer him to be there and helping with your baby?

So they are bathing and into pyjamas at your house but not actually sleeping there, they are home by 6.30? So all of this (with homework and dinner) is squashed into about 3 hours? That's a bonkers routine!
Would be better to pick up from school, do homework, have dinner, play some board games/watch a film/do something fun then be home for 6.30.
Not suggesting the hair washing with dad is inappropriate but at age 10 she will naturally not want that to go on for much longer as puberty kicks in.

Yes that’s a lot of driving and far of having their things at school etc.

If you don’t want to specifically lead a conversation about the contact maybe asking him more open questions might get him to think about the current set up, EG do you think the kids will always come this day/time or do you think it will change when they get older? What are your plans for contact when oldest goes to secondary? That way you aren’t telling him he needs to change the contact, just prompting him to think about it.

Again though, as I said before. It’s not your responsibility. This is something he as the parent should be considering.

I guess as your child gets older the contact will have more impact on you in terms of it is also the contact your child has with their sibling. It would be nice if that time was quality and not rushed.

I feel sorry for the kids. It’s clear that you find their presence annoying.

Would be better to pick up from school, do homework, have dinner, play some board games/watch a film/do something fun then be home for 6.30.

Allowing dad to easily opt out of parenting altogether. I’m not saying this routine works but it’s unreasonable for him to be just watching films and playing board games and occasionally letting them stay over. He’s their parent, not the fun uncle.

It all sounds very stressful and rushed but if he only has them overnight one night a month then I don't really blame their mum for wanting him to do a share of the harder part of parenting, which includes the night time routine.

I think he really needs to negotiate dropping them home an hour later if the current arrangement continues, or having them overnight in the week and EOW, which would be more standard.

The PJ's to school thing I find quite sad really. My dc never had to take anything to school to go to their dad's - he has PJ's, etc there for them as he wanted it to feel like another home for them, not somewhere they visit.

I doubt it's him that wants to have to take them back for 6.30 though, or fill his short weekday time with them with a bath and hairwash, when he could do that on a Saturday when they have the whole day? Or do it but drop them home later?

Also, I'm sure he would have pyjamas for them if they stayed? But with this routine he'd just be buying 2 new pairs of PJs every week just to send them home to mum in. At their ages they definitely don't need to be delivered home in PJs at 6.30.

@Hellolittlestar

I feel sorry for the kids. It’s clear that you find their presence annoying.

Nope.

@Kanaloa

Would be better to pick up from school, do homework, have dinner, play some board games/watch a film/do something fun then be home for 6.30.

Allowing dad to easily opt out of parenting altogether. I’m not saying this routine works but it’s unreasonable for him to be just watching films and playing board games and occasionally letting them stay over. He’s their parent, not the fun uncle.

It depends on the reason why they don't stay over though surely - if he wants them to stay but mum won't allow then I don't think the above is unreasonable.

If he doesn't want them to stay for whatever reason, then I agree that may be the reason the ex pushes him to do this routine.

@Hellolittlestar I definitely do not, on a weekend day it's so lovely having them, it's relaxed and everyone has a lovely time while getting things done without rushing. On the weekdays I barely see them as they rush from one room to another. Occasionally they'll get time to watch tv but mostly it's just rush,rush rush

@mannytomannys I don't think you necessarily need to have any awkward conversations.

In your shoes I'd just have a chat to him about how rushed the whole thing feels and whether now they're older he should revisit whether they need to be home quite so early/whether they could skip the bath and hairwash and he could do it on Saturday instead.

I would suggest caution OP before talking to him.

I expect your dp finds it very hard that his dc don't need anything from him, and doing bath time and cooking different foods makes him feel needed to his dds. It's very very hard as a step mum (trust me I know) to watch your dh over compensate so he feels he is needed and does something for his dc that doesn't actually need to be done/in a normal family would be done by the dc themselves. My theory is that treating them like they are more little then they are ticks boxes for both nrp and the dc that feel they have missed out on their nrp living with them.

I would speak to him about having them overnight if thats what you think would work. But, do you want that or is it actually quite nice that dh gets his being a dad need met by cooking and bath time, his dds feel cared about and you get to have more space in your home then if they stayed overnight. If it isn't broke atm then don't fix it!

Very good point by PeaceInMyLife above. Think about your own preferences before approaching him about it OP.

Either they spend the night at yours or they only have dinner and then quality time and they can get ready for bed at their mum’s. It doesn’t make sense to do it hours before actually going to bed.

I have 7yo DT and they both wash their hair on their own.

This is a strange set up for a 7 and 10 year old. Perhaps it made sense when they were little, but they are much older now so seems it might be time to relook at the pattern. It sounds very chaotic, rushed and in no way 'quality time'. Contact is for the benefit of the child, not the parent - there's no way I would have suggested or agreed to this. I totally get why you feel this is chaotic - it must be literally like a military operation to cram all that into such a small window. Bedtime should be calm, unwinding for the day, ready for bed - not being put through a mangle, put in a car for a long drive ... Seems very unfair for the kids themselves.

At 7 my DD could wash independently (with supervision) in the bath. Her hair I kept doing till she was about 10 at which point it switched to me teaching her to do her own properly. She was not comfortable with her Dad washing her at that age, so until she could wash her hair independently I did I when she got home on WE she spent there. I doubt it will be long before she's saying she wants to bathe alone - she's that age. Also as they get older, and home work / after school activities start to pile up - it gets very tricky doing evenings when you live such a distance apart. Best to get it set up in a way that's going to work going forwards!

but it doesn't seem to bother him, it's just made to be... normal.
So if the hair washing stops would it be normal for them to go home in pjs?

I wouldn’t encourage the bathing to stop as it’s their routine and it sounds like they won’t get to wash at home.
As the eldest is 10 it will soon become easier as she’ll bath herself whilst DH sorts the other one out/sorts dinner, so it will be less rushing around.

Yes good point @PeaceInMyLife I'm not sure what I want really haha
Maybe I just want my DH to happy and relaxed
But if they stayed over during the week proper bed times would become priority and they certainly don't get those on their Saturdays

Errrr this is the weirdest routine ever and you're right OP, it needs a serious rethink. The 10 yo won't be letting daddy be in the bathroom with her for much longer. And getting into PJs by 6pm? Bloody ridiculous at that age. Sounds like this outdated arrangement is rushed and stressful for everyone. You're right to suggest to your DH it needs to be reviewed. Just be careful cos the ex probably won't welcome your opinion!

Mine still had baths at this age. They liked the bath, more relaxed than shower.
In fact 2 of mine didn't like showers at all.

And 2 of mine had long thick hair, and could not rinse it properly, I remember starting to teach dd1 how to wash her hair and it was 2 full years before she could really do it, she was about 10 then.