You don't get to have the PFB experience

[YeDaisy]

Am I being unreasonable to think it's utter BS when people say this on here?

I appreciate that some things are different by way of the fact that there are other DC in the home, but as a SM who had her first DC with DH who has older children, I definitely did still feel 'entitled' to enjoy the firsts of my baby.

You see it in response to things like SMs being expected to spend their maternity leave looking after DSC all the time etc...

YANBU. It's different than if their were no older children to think about, of course, but my PFB is my PFB and that's that. No whataboutery tolerated because she isn't (dead) and they aren't (mine).

I think that people are incredibly narky at the even thought of a SM having a baby because the first thing they think of is ok my child's going to feel displaced and a whole load of guilt is added to a dynamic which actually didn't need to be put there.
Sibling jealousy is a thing but it's 100% amplified by adults.

SM feels the need to make themselves and their children smaller as some type of apology or existing. This is where you get questions on were you the other women because then people feel justified to be like ok your a non human and therefore carry other people emotions and have none of your own.

People project their own issues because they haven't dealt with them or feel like they no longer have sole control which makes them territorial. This is where the term the "golden uterus" comes from.
Now not all ex's are evil and neither are SMs, but the bias is clear. You only have to see it on posts where the ex is clearly being unreasonable and people are outright attacking a SM for breathing.

There are sensible people on here but often drowned out by the "second family you should be expected to be second class" as you know what you signed up for, as they rarely are able to see if from the other side

Anyone who actually uttered these sentiments out in the real world would be written off as a nut.

I'm a evil mum and step mum so I think it's most baffling tbh. As a SM you need a will of iron and also a DH with decent boundaries or the attacks on your personal welling, boundaries and general lifestyle will be reduced.

I always think the same thing OP, and said it on a thread on here just a couple of days ago! The thought of SM's and their partners enjoying their child in this way seems to really get people's backs up, but the truth is that is what it was like.

I think some people just really like to define younger siblings by their relationship to the older, though (I'm thinking the kind who make a huge deal of pointed gestures like ignoring the newborn baby and just focusing on the older child when they're born, and making lots of comments about how much less they bothered with everything with the second child) and I've never been like that, in fact it's always annoyed me. I think the above type of person really loses their mind when you add in the concept of the older child in the situation being a stepchild, and it reveals some very interesting psychology.

Surely you kind of don’t get the out of the box PFB experience though because clearly for your partner it’s not their first roll of the dice. There’s loads of stuff my DH is more relaxed about because he’s got an older one. On the other hand- you get the joy of seeing your baby with a sibling and see that sibling bond right off the bat as well as having a confident and calm co-parent who has realistic expectations of what life with a new born is like so in many ways it’s better!

You don't though. That's true.
DD was my PFB but DH's third. It was very different for him and ergo a different experience for us as a couple.
Plus we other kids around half time, which wasn't a bad thing but it did make it different. It impacted on how we ran out house, what car we had, how much maternity leave I could afford to take, how comfortable I was breast feeding around them. It's not necessarily all negative but it is different..

@CrumpetsForAll

Surely you kind of don’t get the out of the box PFB experience though because clearly for your partner it’s not their first roll of the dice. There’s loads of stuff my DH is more relaxed about because he’s got an older one. On the other hand- you get the joy of seeing your baby with a sibling and see that sibling bond right off the bat as well as having a confident and calm co-parent who has realistic expectations of what life with a new born is like so in many ways it’s better!

I think it depends on the nature of your partner and his experience with his first child. My DP having a negative experience during and after the birth of his first child was a big part of why he ended up separating. So it wasn't "old hat, I've already had this positive experience" when he came to do it with me.

In terms of the sibling bond, idk, DSS is only here EOW so they HAVE a bond but from my DDs young perspective at least it's more like having a cousin than the close knit bond I am used to with full siblings.

My DH and I have tried and tried for a baby but it just isn’t happening for us. I’m the “unexplained infertility” type so I’m already used to biting my tongue when people helpfully suggest eating more pineapple or standing on my head after sex.

It stands me in good stead to bite my tongue when people also tell me it’s “better this way” too. Because now my DH can focus on his children. Because it would be selfish to bring a baby into this situation. And, best of all, because it’s not fair on their mum if her CMS goes down because of me.

The TTC threads can be really vicious on this website.

Mumsnet has been a lifeline for me during lockdowns, but it can be so mean here too. I don’t think that people have any idea that their words can hurt so much. Or how crushingly lonely being a childless SM can be. But hey… you know what you signed up for!

@PeeAche JC, do people really say it's better this way to you? How horrendous! I hope you know you're not alone, a lot of us totally understand the shit you have to deal with as a step parent.

@PeeAche I know it's no consolation but know that those people who are vicious aren't brave enough to say this stuff in RL. That says more about them than someone who has had to be brave in the face of utter heartbreak.

I have seen some of the comments you have received and I'm absolutely floored and horrified people have been so unkind.

Please don't stop coming back for support please not everyone is a keyboard warrior.

It stands me in good stead to bite my tongue when people also tell me it’s “better this way” too.

I got this too, before I was widowed. Apparently, what I was doing for work was too useful to take time out to be a mother

@SpaceshiptoMars

It stands me in good stead to bite my tongue when people also tell me it’s “better this way” too.

I got this too, before I was widowed. Apparently, what I was doing for work was too useful to take time out to be a mother

I’m so sorry! People are so thoughtless.

Globalisation via the internet hasn’t made us all more open minded and empathetic, now that we can meet people of all different backgrounds and with all different stories.

Just go online to find yourself an echo chamber… and scream into it!

I think people over estimate a man's experience of having a child for the first time, and any time thereafter. It's undoubtedly a shock that he won't have with subsequent kids and that's a good thing, but the idea a second partner won't get to experience firsts because her partner already has kids is skewed. Do men remember the first word their child spoke, first steps, first tooth lost? Do they post first day of school pictures? These things matter far less to dads than to mums, whether it be a first child or a fourth. The mum can still enjoy all of those things herself.

@PeeAche I had this too. "At least you have your DSC" WTF! They aren't a consolation prize. I am lucky that LO came along but my god it hurt.

It stands me in good stead to bite my tongue when people also tell me it’s “better this way” too. Because now my DH can focus on his children. Because it would be selfish to bring a baby into this situation. And, best of all, because it’s not fair on their mum if her CMS goes down because of me.
I'm gobsmacked that people can be so rude & insensitive. What on earth is wrong with some people?
Sending a hug @PeeAche.

It all varies I think. There's quite a big age gap between my DSC and my DC with DH so whilst it's not his first, he's not been in the baby/young child stage for a while!

When I think this though it's more about things you see on here like how SMs aren't allowed to spend their mat leave going to baby groups or meeting friends with babies, napping when baby naps etc... Because she should take the DSC to and from school, look after them during the school holidays, "you're home anyway and you don't get to have that experience when you have DSC". That's what I find bullshit. A SMs mat leave is not "free childcare for DSC leave" as it is seen as on here often.

I've seen a SM referred to as a SAHP the other day when she was actually on mat leave with her young baby. Used as a stick to beat her with because she didn't want to offer her time as childcare for DSC so their parents didn't have to sort anything.

@whiterheg I don't agree that these matter less to all dads.

Some fathers, like my own DP and some others I know, didn't experience a good pregnancy, birth etc with their older child(ren). This is for various reasons including the fact that they weren't as hands on.

One guy I know use to take every Friday off until his youngest children were school age and the sole carer of them on that day. With his elder children, their half-siblings, he was working long hours and was not so available for them. If it didn't matter to him that he realised he completely missed seeing his older children grow up from babyhood to starting school then why would he bother with his younger ones?

That's a different scenario though @RedMarauder. OP specifically referenced the Precious First Born experience. What you're talking about is basic, decent parenting. I don't know a dad who isn't hands on and doesn't want to miss their kids childhood but I also don't know a dad who is invested in those "precious firsts" that mums seem to be.

Having a different parenting experience per child isn't unique to step families as any family's circumstances can change over time.

@SpaceshiptoMars, that's awful, I can relate. On the day I lost my first husband somebody actually said, I bet you're relieved the fertility treatment didn't work!

A first time parent should get the PFB experience, regardless of step children. But the parent who has children from another relationship doesn't get to have it again.

They are responsible for the number of children they have, they need to parent and provide for them all, and make decisions about having children based on the fact that neither the ex nor new partner needs to pick up the slack for their choices.

So many posts have the dad either focused on their first children so they don't feel pushed out, or the new family because they think their ex can just do everything.

Parents need to consider all their children, all of the time. They need to sort out appropriate childcare, not make it a pregnant partner/first time parent's job, or expect the ex to automatically fill in, I mean asking is fine, but that shouldn't come with expectations.

Oh @lunar1 [facepalm]. I expect they thought they were saying something kind, as well.

Don't get me started on the appalling things people say to the newly widowed, I'll never stop! Mustn't derail thread, mustn't derail thread....

[quote lunar1]@SpaceshiptoMars, that's awful, I can relate. On the day I lost my first husband somebody actually said, I bet you're relieved the fertility treatment didn't work!

A first time parent should get the PFB experience, regardless of step children. But the parent who has children from another relationship doesn't get to have it again.

They are responsible for the number of children they have, they need to parent and provide for them all, and make decisions about having children based on the fact that neither the ex nor new partner needs to pick up the slack for their choices.

So many posts have the dad either focused on their first children so they don't feel pushed out, or the new family because they think their ex can just do everything.

Parents need to consider all their children, all of the time. They need to sort out appropriate childcare, not make it a pregnant partner/first time parent's job, or expect the ex to automatically fill in, I mean asking is fine, but that shouldn't come with expectations. [/quote]
I appreciate what you're saying there and yes the dad does have to think about those things. But with established, EOW weekend contact, it hasn't really been the case that DP has been too preoccupied to enjoy my DDs "babyhood" because of having to think about DSS all the time. It's just not been the case. His need to earn money etc is the same is it was anyway.

I think the key thing to remember is that different people respond to things differently. For some, their partners will act very differently the second time around. For others, they won't.

My DP was very young and had a plethora of mental health issues when DSS was born. He was all over the place, and there was disconnect. It's been very different for him having DD.

They are responsible for the number of children they have, they need to parent and provide for them all, and make decisions about having children based on the fact that neither the ex nor new partner needs to pick up the slack for their choices

Absolutely this. I am sick of seeing parents excused from parenting their own children on MN because their partner is "home anyway" or similar.

If you can't parent your children without expecting your partner to take on the bulk of the responsibility then you shouldn't be having more. It's not on the SP, they are responsible for their DC, it's on the parent of the DSC to consider whether that's feasible.

I also got the comments when we were struggling with fertility issues. Things about at least you have a ready made family etc... It's all a load of rubbish. It's not remotely the same having DSC, especially DSC with an involved mother who needs no real input from you. It certainly would not have made infertility easier, harder actually.

Some poster's do seem almost gleeful at saying this sort of thing to people as well.

"Oh bless you thinking you could have an enjoyable maternity leave with your new baby, how ridiculous of you. I'm afraid you don't get to spend your leave how you want to spend it because you were stupid enough to marry a man with children".

@PurfectPaul

Some poster's do seem almost gleeful at saying this sort of thing to people as well.

"Oh bless you thinking you could have an enjoyable maternity leave with your new baby, how ridiculous of you. I'm afraid you don't get to spend your leave how you want to spend it because you were stupid enough to marry a man with children".

Yes this is what I always pick up on, the joy it seems to give them to make these comments. Similar to when they say things like "of course your DH won't enjoy time with just you and joint DC, ALL HIS CHILDREN aren't there". The truth is, these people are wrong and I would never have settled for somebody who acted that way.

@PurfectPaul

Some poster's do seem almost gleeful at saying this sort of thing to people as well.

"Oh bless you thinking you could have an enjoyable maternity leave with your new baby, how ridiculous of you. I'm afraid you don't get to spend your leave how you want to spend it because you were stupid enough to marry a man with children".

I see those posts and think "Your turn will come".

They can be get away with being smug in their twenties and thirties. But are they rock sure of both their marriages and their husband's immortality?

I’m not sure smugly visualising someone’s potential widowhood is such a moral high horse tbh...