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Step-parenting

Connect with other Mumsnetters here for step-parenting advice and support.

Being honest, would you be bothered about not seeing your SCs again if you and your partner split tomorrow?

624 replies

FlippidyFlop · 23/10/2020 13:39

Would you? I see this on here a lot when step children are being discussed 'you might not see them again if you and DH split tomorrow'

I just don't think I would personally. I get on perfectly well with them but it's just not something that would bother me if me and DH ever split.

OP posts:
KylieKoKo · 26/10/2020 13:31

@LazyLucille

I see more of my exes child than he does. He moved 260 miles away so DSD comes to stay with us and see her younger brother, my DS.
That's lovely @LazyLucille but it relies on the cooperation of your step child's mother. If her mother did not facilitate this it would not happen no matter how much you wanted it to.
chocolatesaltyballs22 · 26/10/2020 13:33

@MyCatHatesEverybody I never thought of it like that but that's a fair point. Short of keeping up his contact schedule in that scenario (which I have no desire to do) it is a bit of an unrealistic expectation on me I guess.

MyCatHatesEverybody · 26/10/2020 13:39

@chocolatesaltyballs22 your DH is responsible for putting the effort into creating his own legacy with his DC. What does he think you can do that he can't?

KylieKoKo · 26/10/2020 13:39

@chocolatesaltyballs22

It doesn't sound like the children's mother would allow you to see much if them anyway if your DH doesn't even think she would want the children to remember their dad!

MyCatHatesEverybody · 26/10/2020 13:42

@KylieKoKo Yeah but if only she loved and pined for them enough then everything would be unicorns and roses surely?

LyingDogsLie1 · 26/10/2020 14:00

And continued to pay your late husbands CMS.

WooMaWang · 26/10/2020 14:00

IME (and that of many posters on MN it seems), the DSC are anything other than ‘secondary’. Objectively, the resident children are often secondary during contact, which revolves around the DSC.

In our house this weekend we had my DS (11), the DSC (6 and 3) and our DS (12 weeks). As always, the primary consideration and deciding factor in everyone’s weekend was the DSC. The activities and meals were shaped around their interests and really difficult eating behaviour. The actual experience of the weekend was totally coloured by how the DSC behaved, and their father’s ongoing despair about both the behaviour and how it affects everyone else.

I have to work hard to make sure that my DS doesn’t get lost amidst the overwhelming focus on the DSC (after all, it’s his EOW too, even if he sleeps here 11/14 nights a week, rather than 5/14). Regardless of the fact that the DSC are here less often or are younger or whatever, he deserves not to have to spend his weekend in play parks with no equipment suitable for an older child or walking along behind the DSC as they go on their scooters. DH gets annoyed if we (my DS, our DS and me) don’t want to go along on outings (even if his choice of outing is scooters in the park), or if I plan something for DS that the DSC aren’t invited to. But making the whole family centre around the DSC is not fair, and he’s being selfish in prioritising his DC. And also in deciding that he’s too stressed from work so he can’t provide any sense of boundaries or discipline (which means every contact is totally overwhelmed by their behaviour).

Fairness in this family means that their behaviour has to be addressed. They need boundaries for themselves but, actually, it’s not fair to the other children if the DSC are allowed to run around screaming, or to hit them, or to steal their stuff, or to talk (or sing) through the tv programme they’re trying to watch, or to take so long to eat half a sandwich that there’s no time left to go somewhere they’d wanted to go, and so on. DS needs me to stand up for him, and I am not having the DSC treat the baby the way they treat each other. That’s not fair on him.

But equal treatment is hard because that requires their father to be consistent about boundaries and consequences (even if they mean he doesn’t get to do what he wants to do). It’s not fair that my DS loses screen time for things like leaving his light on (it’s an ongoing minor annoyance, and he’s been told more than once so he should stop doing it), while DSD can hit her brother, purposefully makes lunch miserable for everyone (disgusting eating, kicking the person next to her, taking 45 minutes to eat half a sandwich - with her favourite filling, making irritating high pitched humming noises, interrupting everyone when they speak with irrelevant stuff) and then rudely demands that she wants to go to the park (yesterdays sequence of events) and is taken to the park because her father is fed up being in the house and can’t be bothered with discipline on his time off work. As you can imagine, it’s hard for DS to feel like that’s in any way fair. Especially when going to the park with small children is not that appealing to an 11 year old anyway.

DH has admitted to me that, if he were single, he’d be a complete Disney dad (partly out of guilt but mostly out of laziness). He’d basically decide to ‘beat’ his ex by buying them everything and anything and taking them to things/on holidays all the time (he’s got more money so he’d ‘win’ 🙄) and he’d not bother in the least about their behaviour because it would only be him and he’d just ignore it (until he got really angry and shouty). There’d be no boundaries, love would be something to be bought and, when he got fed up with the rudeness and fighting and such like, there’d be lots of angry shouting. It would not be good for them (and I would imagine contact would dwindle as he got ever more fed up with the behaviour and embarrassed by them in public).

Thing is, it’s very hard to like (never mind love) a child who is allowed to consistently act like a brat and who makes every other weekend, one night every week and half the school holidays really hard work for everyone. It’s not really the 6 year old’s fault that she’s this way (although there is some element of personality involved in some of it), but it’s still hard to get past it when you find Friday afternoon approaching and you steel yourself for another weekend of behaviour you have absolutely no control over.

Meanwhile on MN you are lambasted for not adoring your DSC and centering your entire existence around them. Apparently it’s not enough to have welcomed the children into your home (without so much as a hello from them - they arrive and immediately demand to know what’s for dinner every single time), prepared and cooked meals for them (knowing that their dinner table behaviour will be atrocious and you’ll be losing the will you live), and organised an activity they’ll really enjoy. No. You must be an awful person and we should feel sorry for the DSC because you have detached and stepped back from any kind of parental role. And because, quite honestly, of course you wouldn’t miss all this if you split up with your husband. Who would possibly miss that?

chocolatesaltyballs22 · 26/10/2020 14:04

This thread is a total breath of fresh air for the step parenting board - at last people are being honest!

excelledyourself · 26/10/2020 14:19

@WooMaWang

Thing is, it’s very hard to like (never mind love) a child who is allowed to consistently act like a brat and who makes every other weekend, one night every week and half the school holidays really hard work for everyone. It’s not really the 6 year old’s fault that she’s this way (although there is some element of personality involved in some of it), but it’s still hard to get past it when you find Friday afternoon approaching and you steel yourself for another weekend of behaviour you have absolutely no control over.

Understandable. But isn't it also very hard to love their poor excuse for a father?

Sooverthemill · 26/10/2020 14:22

We have been in each other’s lives for 23 years so yes, our relationship goes beyond that of simply being married to their dad. They are also my DDs siblings. I don’t think of myself as their mum but as one of their 4 parents. I adore them, they irritate me, I can’t imagine my life without them! They are my family.

MyCatHatesEverybody · 26/10/2020 14:30

@excelledyourself and yet no one would suggest that woo should love and miss him if they split up regardless of how she feels about him now.

LyingDogsLie1 · 26/10/2020 14:31

WooMaWang You have just summed up my life as a step parenting so succinctly. Thank you.

DH clears his diary when SS arrives (he will keep his time off so he generally only has days off to have SS so this privilege isn’t extended to SS, he’ll say “what do you want to do this weekend” and “what do you want for lunch/dinner” and SS has his every wish fulfilled. It’s made a hellish, spoilt, entitled child who now cannot hear no from anybody (other adults in his life have done the same) without a full on tantrum. He’s now double digits and everyone is scratching their head wondering what to do with him.

excelledyourself · 26/10/2020 14:35

[quote MyCatHatesEverybody]**@excelledyourself* and yet no one would suggest that woo* should love and miss him if they split up regardless of how she feels about him now.[/quote]
No, just as I haven't suggested she should love and miss the SC.

RedMarauder · 26/10/2020 14:38

I'm lucky. I told my DP that if his eldest child was a brat I wouldn't be around. His eldest child isn't a brat and like some other children I've met with a mother who doesn't know how to behave, behaves very well with me.

MyCatHatesEverybody · 26/10/2020 14:41

@excelledyourself I know, I was just making a general observation as to what some posters seem to expect of step parents without expecting the same of comparable situations. Apologies if it came across as a dig at your comment.

excelledyourself · 26/10/2020 14:47

[quote MyCatHatesEverybody]@excelledyourself I know, I was just making a general observation as to what some posters seem to expect of step parents without expecting the same of comparable situations. Apologies if it came across as a dig at your comment.[/quote]
I see. No problem. My misunderstanding.

WooMaWang · 26/10/2020 15:58

[quote excelledyourself]@WooMaWang

Thing is, it’s very hard to like (never mind love) a child who is allowed to consistently act like a brat and who makes every other weekend, one night every week and half the school holidays really hard work for everyone. It’s not really the 6 year old’s fault that she’s this way (although there is some element of personality involved in some of it), but it’s still hard to get past it when you find Friday afternoon approaching and you steel yourself for another weekend of behaviour you have absolutely no control over.

Understandable. But isn't it also very hard to love their poor excuse for a father?
[/quote]
Obviously it has an effect on how I see him, @excelledyourself

But I can talk to him about the issue and try to do something about it. It cannot go on like this. He doesn’t enjoy contact visits like this and he finds his DD hard to like when she behaves like this (‘she’s my daughter and I love her, but...’ is a refrain).

I understand why he’s allowed it to get like this. And also that he is currently having a very stressful time at work. I also appreciate that he is working against their mother who had done a psychological number on her children which affects their behaviour and causes problems in his relationship with his DD in particular. Plus she doesn’t care about manners or rudeness and is passing that on to her kids (I wouldn’t have procreated with a person like this!).

But that understanding does not mean it’s ok for this to take over our lives. As I said, on his own I think ultimately he’d have Disney dadded his way to no real relationship with them. He’s often genuinely ashamed of them in public.

And, a crucial difference is that I have a relationship with DH all the time. The often horrible experience of contact is not the sum total of my interaction with him. I know him when he’s not trying to navigate all the complexities around his DC. Even when they’re here, I get to see him (and feel relief) when they’re in bed. And I also know he’s fed up with the effect that it has on everyone. So I can try to work with him to shift this dynamic.

He is willing to listen to me and work with me because he recognises that otherwise our relationship will fail. We can’t have EOW, a night a week and half the school holidays where he’s feeling depressed about it all being shit again and I’m feeling angry and resentful that it’s the same old shit yet again.

MyCatHatesEverybody · 26/10/2020 16:26

It's complex isn't it woomawang.

My DH used to be a bit Disney Dad when I first met him. He spent all his contact time being a short order chef, litter picker, butler and entertainment for 4 full-on children all weekend every weekend. The 3 weekday evenings he didn't have his DC were spent clearing up after them then preparing for their next stay so basically he felt utterly overwhelmed and couldn't see that the path of least resistance in the short term was burning him out in the long term.

Luckily for me/us DH was very open to changing his parenting style and what's more, the DC benefited hugely too although it might not have felt that way to them at the time. But children thrive on the feeling of security that comes with knowing their parent is in charge (as long as it doesn't stray from authoritative to authoritarian of course).

I hope your DH can work it out for all the DCs sakes let alone his own. What would he have to say if he read up on parenting styles and the damage that permissive parenting can do?

WooMaWang · 26/10/2020 17:27

I hope your DH can work it out for all the DCs sakes let alone his own. What would he have to say if he read up on parenting styles and the damage that permissive parenting can do?

He’d probably say he didn’t have time to read it. He will listen to my summary of it and believe that I know what I’m talking about.

Hopefully we’ll manage to this out. And not just for me (or us). It’s actually even more important for his children.

MeridianB · 26/10/2020 18:02

Bloody hell, @WooMaWang That is so hard.

The nonsense about how you and your son must go out with them needs to stop. He is using you to lighten his load and spread the responsibility, while failing to respect your son and his time with you.

Can your son go to his dads on the weekend your DSCs are with you, so you can maximise your weekends with him.

DH has admitted to me that, if he were single, he’d be a complete Disney dad (partly out of guilt but mostly out of laziness). He’d basically decide to ‘beat’ his ex by buying them everything and anything and taking them to things/on holidays all the time (he’s got more money so he’d ‘win’ 🙄) and he’d not bother in the least about their behaviour because it would only be him and he’d just ignore it (until he got really angry and shouty). There’d be no boundaries, love would be something to be bought and, when he got fed up with the rudeness and fighting and such like, there’d be lots of angry shouting. It would not be good for them (and I would imagine contact would dwindle as he got ever more fed up with the behaviour and embarrassed by them in public).

And how did this not have you running for this hills? 😱 it’s horrific, especially the “angry shouting” 😢

LyingDogsLie1 · 26/10/2020 18:12

@WooMaWang sounds tough. I can resonate with so much of what you say.

Thanks mycare for sharing re permissive parenting. I have looked it up and it describes my DH to a tee!

LazyLucille · 26/10/2020 18:31

@KylieKoKo well of course her mum could say no, luckily her mum is reasonable and sees no reason for her not to spend time with us and her little brother just because their dad is a bit of a knob.

My ex and I separated 5 years ago and now DSD makes her own way to us from school with my own DD as they are teens.

I would be gutted if we could no longer see her, she's part of our family.

WooMaWang · 26/10/2020 21:50

@MeridianB

Bloody hell, *@WooMaWang* That is so hard.

The nonsense about how you and your son must go out with them needs to stop. He is using you to lighten his load and spread the responsibility, while failing to respect your son and his time with you.

Can your son go to his dads on the weekend your DSCs are with you, so you can maximise your weekends with him.

DH has admitted to me that, if he were single, he’d be a complete Disney dad (partly out of guilt but mostly out of laziness). He’d basically decide to ‘beat’ his ex by buying them everything and anything and taking them to things/on holidays all the time (he’s got more money so he’d ‘win’ 🙄) and he’d not bother in the least about their behaviour because it would only be him and he’d just ignore it (until he got really angry and shouty). There’d be no boundaries, love would be something to be bought and, when he got fed up with the rudeness and fighting and such like, there’d be lots of angry shouting. It would not be good for them (and I would imagine contact would dwindle as he got ever more fed up with the behaviour and embarrassed by them in public).

And how did this not have you running for this hills? 😱 it’s horrific, especially the “angry shouting” 😢

Yes. He is trying to spread his load. Actually he wants adult company because he finds it boring too.

I do fight him on the everyone must go and stand around to watch the DSC play. I’ll go if I’ve chosen a decent park with things for my DS to do, but otherwise I’ll just refuse. I don’t even entertain trailing around after them on scooters. That’s DH’s job.

I do organise things for DS and just don’t invite the DSC along too. Things like meeting his friends at the park (so they can sit and chat) or going to the beach with a friend. That caused a huge argument but I stood my ground not least because it was his birthday and he didn’t want it being all about the DSC (it would inevitably have been).

I have spoken to DH about shifting the weekends if he’s not going to sort out his children’s behaviour. He doesn’t want that (because he likes a weekend with just DS3) so he has agreed to step up and put boundaries and consequences in place consistently and promptly.

And staggered school holidays too. He was horrified about that in particular as it means all of us never going on holiday together. But as it stands there is no way in hell I’m going on holiday with the DSC. So I’ve been clear that it’s a choice between actually parenting and consistently parenting them (however much they dislike that, and particularly however much he dislikes having to miss out on things and have unhappy children because they’ve been given consequences) or I am reorganizing my DS’s contact with his dad so that he never crosses paths with the DSC.

It doesn’t help the issue of the baby though. He’s obviously always here. And I am not having the DSC’s behaviour rub off on him. No way. Nor are they going to treat him like they treat each other. And I’m not at all happy that there’s nowhere in the house where he can sleep without being disturbed by their noise (I’m talking screaming and stamping and jumping around, not just normal kid noise). DH agrees that he does not want DS3 to behave like his half siblings. So, actually, there is no choice. He has to step up and sort out his DC’s behaviour.

The Disney dad admission came yesterday (although it’s increasingly obvious). The shouting bit was honestly that he’d just leave things til he was furious rather than intervening early and consistently (so you can just issue a gentle reminder, or a raised eyebrow). I was horrified and told him that he should want to be a good parent to them, not because I cannot live with this behaviour, but because he loves them and wants the best for him. He can’t just pretend it’s all his ex’s fault; he is just as culpable for his rude, difficult children as she is.

Clearly I didn’t realise any of this pre-pregnancy. I only have myself to blame for missing the signs. Tbh, over the last 12 weeks I have very much come to the conclusion that DH and his ex were horrible parents to the DSC as babies (lots of letting tiny babies just scream themselves unconscious; we’re talking full on cry it out for 3 week old babies who’re being inconvenient enough not to sleep when required). So, yeah. A lot of work required here. And I’m very stubborn about the things that matter!

sassbott · 26/10/2020 22:07

@WooMaWang I take my hat off to you.
In your shoes I would be identical. I would refuse joint holidays and I’d ensure my child and the SC’s paths did not cross either. Well done for standing your ground.

It must be exhausting however. So you have my sympathies. Best of luck with it all!

excelledyourself · 26/10/2020 22:32

How's your husbands 3yo compared to the 6yo?

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