This is going to be a divisive one...

[TeaAndWine]

Interested in opinions and ways to deal with this. Will try to be succinct.

4 DC between 5-13. We have them two nights in the week and EOW, plus lots of times one on their own for sleepover etc.

DH pays what is set out on CMS but is officialy through the CMS if that makes sense. We just used the calculator on their website. Plus extras for trips/uniform etc.

DH's ex wife is going with a friend to Disney Orlando for two and a half weeks in September, without the kids, so we will have them that time. No problems, I'm quite looking forward to it.

The kids have been to Florida as holiday many times before, and this will be around her 15th time going. Odd to me why of all the places to go in this world without kids you would choose to go their again but hey ho, horses for courses etc.

My question is - Surely if we're having the kids for nearly three weeks DH should not be expected to pay CMS while she's there? That's effectively giving her spending money. Our bills for food/days out etc will go through the roof.

We simply cannot afford to pay the CMS that month and to have them. The CMS is just that - for the children. Who we will have.

We have them numerous other nights that have never been taken into account with the calculation.

I think part of me that I'm happy to admit is bitter as she's never worked a day in her life, even before she had kids, yet we can't even afford to go for a weekend away despite both working full time, but perhaps that's a different thread.

Would we BU to say we will be paying CMS for the one week she has them that month? As the money is for the children, who will be with us nearly the whole month?

Open to hearing thoughts. Don's tin hat

You need to simply work out how many overnights you've had over the last year including this and use the calculator again. There's quite a big increase in overnights needed for a decrease though so you may well find that this increase in overnights doesn't impact on the cms payments.

I understand your perspective but you do need to look at the bigger picture of the entire year.

The attachment should help you to work it out.

There’s more to looking after kids than the cost of food.

She’s still paying rent/ mortgage to house them. Still paying the minimal gas/ electricity for essential appliances whilst away. Still paying council tax. The children will still be using and thus adding wear to their clothes, shoes, toys, gadgets which she has to buy.

A contribution for food would be a nice gesture but I’d imagine she has a much greater financial burden from the children than your husband does.

I'm 50/50 with my exH so no CMS. If it becomes unbalanced we never readjust it to "give me money". how do you do birthdays? I think I'd try to talk to the exW but she could easily argue that she's putting the money into a savings account for the kids.

With regards to bills etc - her house is going to be empty for going on three weeks whereas our bills will go through the roof.

Empty house or not, things like the following need to be paid: mortgage/rent, household insurance, gas and electric daily standing charge and minimal amount for fridge/freeze security lights and alarms etc, tv licence, council tax, internet, phone etc. Also the insurance and tax on her car, which is also for the children’s benefit, needs to be paid.

It’s not as straightforward as the house is empty so no outgoings.

@TeaAndWine it’s done over a year period divided by the months in the year. This is based on many factors including the amount of overnights at one house. So unless it takes you into the next bracket then you shouldn’t receive a reduction in paying maintenance. You could ask if she would provide some spends for the kids but that’s it.

YANBU...my ex has the kids EOW and he pays a pittance but when he has them for a week or more for holidays, I don't take maintenance from him. Only for the weeks where I have the children the majority.

You should pay money as usual. Three weeks isn’t going to make a difference in the grand scheme of things. The money is not just to feed and clothe the children it’s also to make sure they live somewhere suitable. You’re being very petty if you think you shouldn’t pay whilst the mum is on holiday. I’m speaking as a stepmother myself. My husband paid every single month, regardless of whether someone was on holiday or if we had his daughter for an extended period. If you start being awkward about this it will no doubt come back and bite you on the bum.

Three weeks isn’t going to make a difference in the grand scheme of things

It really will put us in a very difficult financial situation for at least a few months.

YABU - the basic amount of maintenance set by CMS is a pittance and in no way reflects 50% of the cost of raising DC. Unless the additional nights push you into a different payment bracket you're still legally obliged to pay maintenance that month.

If you do this, then she is entitled to the same in return to you. So be very careful - only instigate if your DH has them without fail for the entirety of his appointed time.

Have you raised it with her at all? I would say nothing will change with CMS and its best not too but I cant see how asking for a contribution for food etc would be a bad thing.

It depends on the relationship you have

Difficult one. She will still need to pay overheads, rent or mortgage for example plus other utilities. But your household costs will increase during this time.
Are you on good terms with her? Discussing money is always difficult but any reduction to your monthly payment would be of help to you. Could you suggest a half payment for that month?

Your DH could talk to her about a possible reduction for food expenses, but as CMS is to house the DC as well as feed them I think you're being rather unreasonable. She still has to pay her rent/mortgage/bills that month. Just because she's on holiday it doesn't mean that those expenses go away and over an entire year she has the DC far more than you do. If you're only having them for 4 nights out of each 14-day period then she's housing and paying for them for more than double the time you do. TBH, I'd probably leave it. Most divorced mums, particularly those with large numbers of DC, aren't exactly rolling in money and CMS is not exactly generous when compared to the real costs involved in child rearing.

I can’t see how it’s going to cost you so much to have them for three weeks. A bit of extra food, but that’s it. The effect on bills will be negligible. You don’t need to take them for expensive days out.

How much is the maintenance?

If you're only having them for 4 nights out of each 14-day period then she's housing and paying for them for more than double the time you do.

I took from the initial OP that they had them two nights every week plus EOW, so that's surely at least 6 nights a fortnight which is one less than half. It really doesn't seem like the unequal split with mum doing all the hard work that people are painting it as.

YANBU and I agree it's strange that she is going to a family resort but without the kids.

We both work and can just about manage a camping trip to northern France with 2 kids as our main summer hols. Very lucky to have a holiday but we can't afford self catering or hotel or a flight somewhere hot. Not the point of the thread - but how the heck can a single Mum of 4 kids with no job afford to take them all to Florida every year?! Not saying she shouldn't have a holiday but it's way more than we could afford to spend. We both work long hours as teachers, so it seems a bit ridiculous.

I imagine she'll have a shock in 10 years when the universal credit, housing benefit and CMS runs out. They all sound school age so I think she should be working at least part time.

However I don't think it's worth asking for a payment break - it will probably cause more fuss than it's worth in the long run.

yanbu.

it gets me because people are mentioning the kids mum having to pay for a house, council tax, gas, electric, water, car, car tax for the kids but have conveniently forgotten that OP and DH pay all these things for the kids as well. They only have the kids slightly less, AND pay maintenance on top.

Three weeks is a long time. How is it that kids cost their mum a fortune, but only cost OP what they eat in food @YippeeKayakOtherBuckets?

CMS is a crap system, that IMO doesnt work for many people at all and doesnt take into account nearly enough factors to be anywhere near fair.

also that gingerbread attachment is ridiculous - why would you still pay maintenance if you have the children more than 175 nights a year? 176 nights is half the time, and if you had them more than that you'd essentially be the main carer! Why on earth would you still pay the other parent?

oooh tricky one OP. I'm very much on your side with the mindset of the ex leaning heavily on my husband for 18 years and working part time whilst sitting in a lovely big bed detatched house, I get how annoying that is!

but..... I would say that when we have my SC for a week our bills don't go up that much. Ours are teenagers as well so if it doesnt come in a packet or a branded bottle they wont eat or drink it.

OK so our total number is 4 when they are here not 6 but it doesnt cost a fortune to feed them. It's blooming hard work but not impossible.

If I were you I'd console myself with the view that as the 13 year old hits 18 you can reduce the maintenance a little and your independence isnt affected at all. Her lack of independence will be impact hugely on the way she has to do things.

Does she ever ask for extra money? I doubt it as you would have mentioned in your OP

Three weeks isn’t going to make a difference in the grand scheme of things

It really will put us in a very difficult financial situation for at least a few months.

Oh come on. If it’s that close to the wire then you’re both low earners in which the CMS level will be pittance so the mother will only have minimum financial support from you

bringringbring

what a load of rubbish. You have no idea of the level of CMS they're paying - i actually imagine having 4 kids for 3 weeks solid does cost quite a lot - maybe they're close to the wire for other reasons?

maybe the dp earns loads more than op, so they pay £££ maintenance and cant afford much else after?

The mother only has the kids 1 day a week more than them, so what she lacks (or you think she lacks) in financial support, she gets in practical, doesnt she?

IMO they shouldnt be paying her a massive amount because she doesnt have the kids a massive amount more than they do!

A “bad boy” is simply not that in to you, hence treating you badly.

He won’t be a “bad boy” to someone else on all likelihood

Sorry wrong thread!