What's your opinion on maintenance?

[Mamamc123]

Nothing wrong here and not asking for advice as such, just a difference in opinion during a discussion tonight and I wondered what everyone else's views are on how maintenance money is used and what it's expected to cover?
My friend and I are both mothers to our own bio kids and I am also SM to my DPs kids.
Friend was moaning how her ExH doesn't contribute enough financially to her daughter's expenses - he pays well above what the CSA calculator suggests and his daughter wants for nothing whilst she's with him.
She expects him on top of that to buy half of the children's clothes, school uniforms, shoes, activities/ clubs, extra childcare etc - which is exactly what my DP does for my DSDs.
However I think it's unreasonable to expect this much when a regular and fair amount of maintence is being paid and custody is split.
My ExH pays maintence for our children but in my opinion it is for all of those things and I don't expect him to "top-up" anywhere else. I don't think it's fair for a father to be paying for the mother to look after her own children when they are with her if that makes sense? I don't pay my ExH for the kids food etc when they are there.
If something like an expensive school trip or one off big expense then I think it's fair to go 50/50 on that, but in general if you're receiving 100s in maintence every month then you shouldn't always expect more.
Ps: I'm not talking about men who shirk their responsibilities or don't pay - I mean honest good dad's who pay their fair percentage of income and see their kids regularly.
What do you all think?

Racoonbandit does she pay for half of the activities DD does when she's with Dad? Maintenece should cover half the cost of clothing, uniforms etc and a contribution towards her day to day care, Dad shouldn't be expected to pay for all her food and then again when she's with him?
Like I said Dad has utility costs and a responsibility to provide a nice home too

"I get the impression from said friend and other mums I know that there is sometimes the expectation for dads to pay for the kids every expense when they have them"

Their Dad pays their expenses when they are with him, yes. If he takes them out for lunch or something, of course he pays for it

What WhisperingLoudly says. I can't bear these threads. Why are you friends with her OP if you resent her so much?

I don't resent her I love her dearly, you can be friends with someone but have a different opinion

It's all down to individual circumstances surely? Why are you so invested in her life OP?

I thought that maintenance was about maintaining the standard of living of the children after the split?
So if the father is a high earner but the mum didn't work for years and now has a much lower income, then it makes sense that the father is paying more than 50% of the costs for the child (which will include posher clothes than the supermarket ones, nice after school clubs etc...).
An example would be if the child was going to private school, to maintain that it would be the father paying for it all rather father and mother splitting the cost in half.

Basically it depends a lot on the circumstances, difference in wages and the effect that splitting up has on the standard of living of the child.

At least, that's how I understand it.

I'm not talking about a day at the cinema on a Saturday Mam I'm talking about after school clubs and school trips which are a great benefit to children. Why should the child lose out on such clubs because nrp think that paying for half their food/bills is enough?

Children's costs cannot be calculated down to the last penny. It's very easy for dad to have them for the weekend but he is not footing the bill for all the other costs that come 5 days a week.
Always makes me when I read "oh he pays above the government minimum" like he's some sort of hero. It's the bare minimum and paying 20 quid more than that is not hero worthy.

If the father has a net income of say £5 or £6k a month then how would £350 be acceptable? The maintainable should ensure that the child is able to continue to live to a standard relatively close to what they had before the split. I'd also expect a high earner to pay most if not all of significant extras. Not a £20 trip here or there or £100 a term for swimming lessons but to cover things like a school residential, specialist sports equipment and the like. If they're in private school then I would expect he ex to cover all of the fees and specialist uniform such as blazers but the mum to get the shirts / generic jumper / shoes and to pay for the day to day extras such as clubs

"I thought that maintenance was about maintaining the standard of living of the children after the split?
So if the father is a high earner but the mum didn't work for years and now has a much lower income, then it makes sense that the father is paying more than 50% of the costs for the child "

THIS

I didn't pay 50% of the chikd-related costs before we split, as was a SAHM for a large part of it, then only part time, low wages after that. Ex pays the right amount for us, it's just above the minimum and it's a fair amount for our individual circumstances.

Maintenece should cover half the cost of clothing, uniforms etc and a contribution towards her day to day care

Why this obsession with "half". It's not half, it's (supposedly) a "fair proportion". And if one parent, usually the mother, has had to work lower paid jobs and part time due to having children and being their main carer and the father has been able to concentrate on his career and earning a much higher salary, why then should the mother be expected to contribute half financially, as well as 80% time-wise, 80% of the emotional burden and 80% of the admin of raising the DC when the father leaves? When that wasn't the arrangement when they both chose to have children.

It costs £15 pw for DC1 14 yo to get to school. Plus £4 per day for lunch. So already that's £140 per month just so he can attend a state school leaving £210 for the month to pay towards food/bills/clothes and the variables such as school trips.

His school shoes are £40 a time because he has size 10 feet so is in adult shoes. Same for his none school shoes and clothes all adult sizes as he is 6ft already. His uniform in September was over £200 plus extra pants/shirt throughout the year so another £60.

He plays in a local football team at £25 pm plus £40 a season for his kit and at least £50 twice a year for his boots.
He also has a mobile which is £15 pm it's not the latest model and is more for safety than a fashion statement. His haircut costs £10 every 5 weeks or so and he gets £10 per week pocket money which I don't think is excessive.

So looking at £350 pm that your friends receives which is meant to pay for half of everything would not cover the costs for my son and I don't think what he costs a month is extravagant.

its all about maintaining two households as fairly as possible isn't it? which in my opinion is easier when couples are amicable.

I guess peoples individual opinions of money and worth factors too. My exh and i never rowed about money when we were married (we rowed about most other things, hence why he is an ex) and i have found that we haven't rowed about money since we seperated / divorced. Both of us have the same views on money I think.

Me and exh have pretty much 50:50 split so no maintenance paid. we both appreciate we have our own homes / lives to fund and that our dc are part of that. We go 50:50 on school trips and clubs and will both tend to buy clothes for them as and when. It mainly works out fairly although I earn significantly more than exh so do tend to buy the uniform. I also pay for their school dinners, but he tends to to spend more on fuel ferrying them to and from clubs as he works school hours and takes them to their after school clubs etc.

We both put our dc first so between us make sure they don't go without stuff they need.

As someone has just said on another thread: maintenance is supposed to be contributing to their upkeep, not completely funding it

What if the maintence is too low to be a fair contribution?

OP you sound a bit jealous. Her ex obviously pays what he should be paying. My ex pays £650 a month for my DS which is what the CSA calculator says he should. He also gets huge bonuses and a car. The £650 only just covers half the mortgage - I work two jobs to keep us afloat. In a perfect world I should sell up - but I wouldn't get a mortgage to live in the area I do (which is where DS goes to school, is safe and where his friends are).
Do I ask him for half of things? Damn right I do - he earns a six figure salary and still has three times my monthly income left after he has paid me the £650.

My DH pays maintenance of £500 per month, 2 Dad's here 50% of the time yet still his ex w asks for contribution for school trips etc. Every such request is met with a response from me that maintenance is designed to cover theses things. She is labouring under the delusion that the standard of living she enjoyed before divorce should me maintained. NO, we are not responsible for funding your holidays or the fact that you can't budget and have a sense of entitlement. I think the constant Winey requests make her look quite sad and desperate.

Pieceofpurple how am I jealous? I agree her ExH is paying what he should be paying and is generally a good guy. I'm friends with both of them and my friend brought up the conversation of maintenance as my ExH and I have always been civil. She was moaning about his contribution I think expecting me to agree with her and I said I thought she was being unreasonable. She asked my opinion so I gave it 😊 I don't know why people think I'm being mean about her I was just intrigued as to why she thought she needed more money from him?
I live within my means and don't expect my ExH to pay my mortgage as it's my home and I choose to live where I do. He pays for his home which is our children's other home.
Like I said, no right or wrong but it's interesting to see other people's opinions.
Raccoonbandit a fair contribution is based on their income, that's what makes it fair surely?
Mrssapphire your set up sounds amazing!

Some people are just greedy

XH pays exactly the minimum the calculator tells him to. Never contributes to clubs/swimming/trips/uniform.

He barely sees DD (once every 5 weeks, not overnight) and doesn't spend anything on her when she's with him.

He's not a big earner but certainly puts everything and everyone else before her. His loss.

£350 is not a generous amount regardless of how much a father earns

What a ridiculous statement. Of course it is dependent on how much they earn!

Thejiminey - your Ex sounds like a complete tool. Sorry to hear that xx

£350 is not a generous amount regardless of how much a father earns

I think you will find it is a generous amount if the father doesn't earn a lot. Just say he's on minimum wage earning around £1000 a month, £350 would be about £250 more than what he should be paying.
Some people are just so bitter and greedy it's actually shocking.

Stars I am not bitter or greedy and work bloody hard to keep a roof over Ds's head despite my ex paying a lot. In proportion he pays very little. He also rarely has DS overnight as is too busy playing and watching football and rugby

Mamamc123, I completely agree with you! the NRP also has the same kind of costs as the RP - needs to keep a home where he can accommodate his child, and correspondingly bigger bills than if he were living in a one bed flat for example. I don't know why more people don't see this?
And it is not about keeping the child in the same lifestyle as before - this is just not possible when the amount of money to go round is less, as there are two households to fund after a split. So things like clubs etc don't necessarily continue if there is not enough money. It's as simple as that. People have to live in line with their income - whether that is through earnings or maintenance payments.

RacoonBandit - if you have £210 left a month after costs of going to school then I think you are doing nicely, surely? In our household of 3 our food bill is around £75 a week for all of us. And you'd be paying for electricity and other utilities if you lived by yourself anyway. How much extra is for your son's usage? I don't get it.

£210 would not be enough to feed him/clothe him and the bills along with the variables and other costs.
For example DS is home before me so using water/electric and gas i would not be using. I do laundry more times in a week than i would if I was on my own and he eats an enormous amount of food.

£350 a month is enough for the basics I am not saying it isnt but i dont see why asking for half of the extras is wrong.