Quick thread - need advice - SALT at 3pm

[lougle]

DD2 had SALT assessment in June. result: General speech/language at/around average. Doesn't initiate conversation and didn't respond to non verbal cues, but school say she's ok, so it's not affecting her.
I complained by email, said concerns weren't with general language (I.e. she can name a girl if shown a picture, etc).

Now, SALT coming today to reassess and observe. She deals with SCD/ASD type stuff.

I've been invited to discuss her findings at 3pm (school finishes 3'30), so under 30 minutes to talk.

Can you lovelies think of all the areas I should highlight?

e.g. Mrs X, ELSA told DD2 she wouldn't see her today because she had a meeting. DD2 smiled with her tongue pushed behind her bottom lip, nodding as Mrs X was telling her. I know Mrs X would think she's fine with it. However, ar breakfast DD2 told me that she was only ok with going to school today because she has Mrs X this afternoon.

TIA

Well....there you go. It's done.

Hi - how did it go?

Hopefully you'll have a decent salt. The one we had today did a 30 minute assessment using whats happening, cause and effect and whats wrong cards.

And?

(sorry, I was too busy dividing myself between DS1 and scanning a bigass DLA form at a page a minute to have a look earlier, not that I'd ahve been any more use than a chocolate fireguard)

That's a huge problem Moondog and in my experience leads to denial of needs, or at least to blame them on something intrinsic to the child that can't be changed.

DS has seen several SALTs and most say he has no need. Once he was placed with specialists his needs were properly defined and those needs had solutions to implement.

The effectiveness or evidence-base of those solutions is variable of course but at least they are no longer being blamed on parenting/low IQ/personality disorder/attachment issues/wilfulness.

I'm sat in the lounge with DD2 and 3, trying not to show them I'm crying.

SALT did social assessments. Reciprocal conversation good. Eye contact and joint attention good. A bit fidgety but using adult chairs, so fine. Higher language skills good. Social skills good. Everything great.

Showed her the video of DD2's homework. Said that perhaps writing down the task rather than verbal would be good.

I told her my concerns, that DD1's carer is concerned, etc.

She has said that perhaps we need to get feedback from OT and then have a joint meeting with professionals to see the way forward.

SENCO said she's doing ok in class. Only acknowledged points I raised (ie. wouldn't even look at her until she started doing dragonflies, now does look and engage). Pointed out she can 'dress up and play a role'. I said 'yes, she can play a role she has observed. I don't think she could make up a scenario....'

I ended up in tears (that I managed to hold back, but the voice was obvious) and told them that I really don't need this -I have enough on my plate, and that I wouldn't be here if I didn't have concerns. That I'd far rather be anonymous and slip in and out of the school,etc.

When is someone going to see the real DD2? Poor child.

Lougle see my post just below yours.

DS has a SEVERE language disorder but yet he got through a raft of SALTS who were supposed experts in ASD.

It's being suggested now that his ASD is almost a consequence of his SALT issues.

I'm not sure why they never saw it but I'm beginning to suspect it is partly because comparatively ds would not have normally gone anywhere near a SALT if it wasn't for a 'pushy mum'. He can talk innit. He can talk in sentences. He can ask for things. He can even participate in orchestra practice and take instructions from the conductor.

But when I read his assessment reports I can see so clearly how he differs from his sister. The poor boy has a LOT of problems.

I suppose what I am saying here are two things:

1. I believe you. I believe this is happening and I still believe your dd has difficulties that NEED to be accommodated. I have been in the SC issue world now long enough to know your experience isn't unique.

2. Don't give up hope but don't expect this journey to be as smooth as it was with your other dd (please don't think I'm saying here that I think that was easy though).

Is there any way you can still insist on the CCC2. It was the most devastating questionnaire I have ever had to fill in but by far the most useful at the time and for future comparisons.

I'm bereft.

I could hear the SALT saying that she needed to talk to the other professionals and then perhaps have a meeting all together to 'discuss the way forward' and, perhaps because was a nurse, I heard 'we need to get together and point out that you're neurotic...'

She asked when OT were coming in. I said I'd been told by DD2 that they'd been in and apparently the OT was ordering DD2 a cushion because she was a fidget bum.

The SENCO said 'DD2 told them that, so she's got that from somewhere.' I said 'Well it certainly wasn't from me. I wouldn't call her that. I might call her a lot of other things, but fidget bum isn't one of them!'

Oh Lougle

Be proud that your willing to fight for your DD's.

Did they do any actual assessments with cards? Cause and effect etc?

What was interesting from today was that DS told the salt he feels nervous in a room when its people i know and he doesnt but when salt commented he didnt know her he said he did because I'd told him she was coming, he knew what her job was, and when asked if hed feel nervous when I arrived he said no because he already knew her and I would be fine. He also said theres not lots of people. So immediately she can infer from that 1:1 is fine from him and groups are a no no (especially strange groups).

Is it that she didn't see it? Or that she didn't know what could be done about it and didn't like to say, plus couldn't figure out how she'd justify funding if she recommended your dd was helped with things that were not as obvious to most people? And kind of just hopes that your dd will figure it out by herself eventually?

Star I suspect anything that relies on the parent giving information is going to be discounted. I may be a cynic.

She did take my summary of concerns and said she'd pass it along to the Paed with her assessment.

I'm going to sound nuts, aren't I??

He's going to read a letter from her saying 'fab child. Delightful. A joy to assess (her words)' then my summary, which details areas where I have concerns, and think I'm a lunatic.

I wouldn't be surprised if they start to think I'm a MBP mother who wants attention. If only it was so.

:(

lougle what you need is a decent SALT.

DS summary (was just discussion) was delighful, highly intelligent, a joy to assess, discharge with open access and strategies to employ.
Didnt mean there wasnt a whole load of things he struggles with and will struggle with - that were noted.

sorry the outcome was disappointing. I agree with Star and ZZZ. I believe you, and can understand how children like ours can slip through the net - once ar child can speak in sentences, and receptive language is seemingly OK to function without 1-1 support at school, IME the NHS SALT service just isn't resourced/set up to deal with them. As fallback I agree with ZZZ - start reading up on semantic pragmatic/higher level language difficulties, and carry on helping DD2 as best you can. I know you were working on Language for Thinking, a while back, was that any good?

Right ENOUGH Lougle.

A Parent of a child with ASD/SC difficulties is this:

Confused
Neurotic
Desperate
Emotional
Difficult
In Denial
Demanding
Overplaying things

This is how it is. If it isn't true when you start out it becomes true because of the process to get help.

At no time does that ever mean your child doesn't need help.

This is the pathway. This is the way it is going to be. It's SHIT. But your dd is lucky, because you're an outstanding mother, researcher and quite frankly Person, and you will recover from this bout of paranoia and you will figure out what to do next.

And we will help you, like you've helped so many of us.

Fall apart now by all means. You deserve to be able to and you deserve to take a break if you need it. But while you are falling apart know that tomorrow is still out there, and so are we.

She told DD2 that she goes to DD1's school and plays with DD1. DD2 was 'amazed' which encouraged her.

She told DD2 that she used to make mud pies when she was a child. DD2 asked 'did you try and given them to your mum?' She said 'no, I fed them to my dolly.' DD2 said 'did it make her mouth dirty?'

She used a story board about a girl who goes to a beach and a naughty bird steals her watch when she was swimming. She did the question of where the girl would expect the watch to be (the sally-anne test) and she passed - she said in her rucksack.

She told another story about a boy who was annoyed that his tea got cold. DD2 asked 'which type of tea it was' which the SALT was impressed by. (DD2 is obsessed with homophones/homonyms).

Then they went back to class and DD2 joined the group nicely. Used gestures brilliantly.

They joined a group activity and DD2 talked to another child (WOW...I'm astounded )

Did you observe all of this?

Thank you. I'm being pathetic. I just thought she would notice something that would help DD2.

Fab post Star. In a way as my DS had a background of severe language delay at age 3 to 4, I am "lucky" that I don't doubt myself that he has residual issues, and that significant issues including an MDA at that age are formally recorded. But it is harder to be dealing with more subtle issues as school/SALT etc are IME inclined to minimise if a child seems to be placid and suffers in silence.