AIBU to think teacher should have consulted about this?

[Rinoachicken]

Don’t know the full story yet, will be speaking to school in the morning.

DS1 age 9 has just started year 5. He has ASD, always been well supported by the school. Last year discussed with the SENCO about some additional ‘social skills’ work for him as he really struggled last year with this aspect. He found the classroom too loud at times and this was managed by him wearing ear defenders at times or being allowed to work in the library.

He has come home today and told me all excitedly that he now sits at a table alone in the corner of the classroom and this is his permanent seat for the rest of the year. He loves it because he can concentrate better and doesn’t have to hear others chatting etc.

But I am concerned that this will only make it harder for him socially. It ‘others’ him and sets him apart from his classmates, who have up til now been mostly accepting of his quirks, just part of him. He will miss out on the class conversations of his friends (I know they aren’t there to chat but you know what I mean). He will also not be able to practice some of the coping skills the school we’re planning on helping him with this year, as he’ll be alone and not exposed to anything outside of his own personal bubble. His tolerance for others and ability to problem solve will not be able to be challenged and built upon. How is this helping him to grow and develop and be prepared for secondary school and beyond?

AIBU to think that such a major policy change for him should have been discussed with me BEFORE being put in place?

Apparently they arrived in their classroom this morning and it was rearranged and they were told to sit where their reading books were and that those seats were now their seats for the rest of the year

Well that teachers experiment would have blown up in her face (and the rest of the classes) if it had been my DC.

Even though the arrangement would have benifitted them. The sudden change and no questions asked approach. Would have left them feeling insecure and having no control.

The behaviour that would follow would have been very volatile, and mostly doing things to take any part of control back over their lives, which would really not be conducive to a settled harmonious class room.

Pulling a stunt like that, would have arroded any trust DC had in the teacher and would takes months (maybe never) to get back.

Over the years the teachers who have communicated with me and DC, have had an exceptionally gifted and pleasant pupil. My DC confidence has been strong, which in turn helped them bond and socialise well with others.

The teachers who felt they needed no other input, because they were 'highly trianed' and know best, did no end of damage to my DC mental health, and the teachers struggled to maintain DC behaviour and DC level of education, as DC lost confidence in themselves, their concentration and high level of work dropped.
But of course the teachers never saw themselves as a source of the problem, DC was the problem because of special needs, meant they couldn't be a high achiever, focused and not anxious.

Luckily DC had more good teachers than 'know it all' other teachers.

It would be a huge waste of time to phone every parent for every change to the seating plan. That precious time is spent planning for those individual needs

The Arrogance is breath taking.

I would presume that not all the children in your class, is a child of Special Educational Need. So wouldn't need Special Educational Need planning.

But since we are talking a child that needs Special Educational Needs input, Then the Special planning and taking a tiny bit of extra time in informing a parent, is needed.

in fact your statement just comes across as someone who finds having a SEN child in your class, as a pain in the arse for taking up your precious time with the normal kids.

nice.

in fact your statement just comes across as someone who finds having a SEN child in your class, as a pain in the arse for taking up your precious time with the normal kids.

What a scandalous misrepresentation. No it doesn’t.

really?

It would be a huge waste of time to phone every parent for every change to the seating plan. That precious time is spent planning for those individual needs

throwing in about having to waste time telling every parent about change in seating plan, which is implying to the OP. why are you and your child so special?

Ahh I see you are the poster who came up with this little gem.

Equally, I have often tried things without consulting the parent

see my above post.

Your experimenting on a SN child's tolerance of change or other things, can have devastating long lasting effects, depending on how you go about it.

Doing something at school can also have knock on effects for home life too. If a parent is aware of a change at school they can be prepared at home for a change in behaviour too.

Sudden melt downs at home and not speaking at home, being with drawn, quiet or a loss of appetite ect. Would be easier to understand, and also feed back to school whether the change has been detrimental or not.

I think a lot depends.
I do have regular contact with the parents of my SEND students (to differing levels based on age and child because I'm secondary). I wouldn't be ringing up to consult with parents for every seating plan change, but would make changes in line with what is in the child's pen portrait (or their all about me that they fill in for circulation to staff) and/or their profile from our SENDCo.

So, for example one of my children's forms stated they like to be at the back near the door. The problem is that I moved rooms half way through the year so they had to choose either at the back OR near the door. I asked them, they told me their preference. I sat a according to their preference. I'd have been a bit put out if I'd then got a phone call from home saying they had concerns because I hadn't contacted them to discuss this.

Another child has SEMH issues this year Long story short, after talking to relevant colleagues I called home on the PD day to let home know that I'd be announcing my pregnancy the next day (mainly by showing up with a massive bump). That sort of contact even though it was a personal situation was more than reasonable in case it triggered a range of behaviours stemming from that child's fear of change and attachment issues with adults.

The start of a new year is a bit of a getting to know you exercise and it requires open mindedness on all sides, including that the teacher may do things differently from last year and that's ok. An open minded meeting is probably the best way forward

MoobaaMoobaa

I am more than happy to talk to home, depending on the circumstances. Equally, with a Y5 child, it might be more appropriate to discuss it with the child, or the SENCO, or the child’s previous teacher. You seem to have a very extreme attitude, which perhaps would benefit your child in some circumstances, perhaps not. As the teacher I reserve the right to make changes and try things, consulting where I think is appropriate. My HT would back me in those decisions, because ultimately, I am responsible for the child’s education.

LolaSmiles Your approach is what i would expect, as especial for the age group you teach.

You spoke to child about the seating and gave them best choices that where available. I suspect if the child been distressed at the choices given them and unable to decide, you would have rang home to get back up and support.

seaweedandmarchingbands

DC is well out of the school age now. There was no extreme, just teachers who took the time to drop an email or ring about things that might have an impact on DC. They also talked to DC about stuff. In secondary I was less informed but still informed of some stuff. DC was kept informed in everything though.

Then there were teachers that thought they knew best.

The results of both types I have already posted up thread.

MoobaaMoobaa

We’ll have to agree to disagree about approach. Sometimes I do know best. 🤷🏻‍♀️

MoobaaMoobaa
Oh yes. Absolutely.
I think that's why it's with seeing where the path is going for these children. Once in year 7, my approach is typical for the staff who are good with SEND students (can't speak for all because I've seen some mixed practice ). From that I would expect Y5/6 to start moving a bit more towards the child's voice and listening to them, with the contact with home in the background. Otherwise it makes the move to secondary much more difficult (for both the child and the parent in my experience).

So in the OP situation, I wouldn't expect a consultation on this strategy change especially if the child was happy with it, but would think it reasonable to have a chat with OP about how her DC was settling in Y5 around a fortnight or 3 weeks in (and obviously sooner ib either direction if there were concerns). Given their child is openly happy about the situation, the teacher has responded to the child then I personally feel that concerns about not being spoken to about it are a little much.

seaweedandmarchingbands

I'm sure you are a good and knowledgeable teacher, and sure you do communicate with your pupil's parents adequately.

Its just this thread has brought out the fight in me again, after spending some years with some teachers, practically banging my head against a brick wall, because they have almost no understanding of children needing different approaches. but believe they do know best, or worst case not caring at all, and lable DC as naughty, and the only calls I got was to tell me, they were in trouble.......again. Those teacher made and still make my blood boil.

MoobaaMoobaa

Fair enough. But in this case, it looks like the teacher has made a reasonable decision.

Quick update:

Had a good conversation with the home-school link worker this morning (no teacher in sight so couldn’t speak directly to teacher).

Said that I understand it’s a well proven strategy to have a separate workstation, and DS was happy and I think it will benefit his academic work very much, but that I would like to know how they are going to make sure he doesn’t suffer socially.

DS would happily spend all day with just a teacher for company as he loves the company of adults. But that’s not overly helpful or healthy.

Said about him saying he feels lonely and left out sometimes and that I want to make sure it doesn’t have a worse effect.

She knowable me really well and we have very positive relationship and she is going to check what the intention is (because my DS is convinced he now is ONLY to sit there not move around for anything) and agreed that if the support greatest has changed for him then it would have been nice for that to have been communicated to me.

Basically, I’m happy for them to make whatever changes are necessary to support him at school, as long as they are making sure the social and emotional well-being is also being supported.

She also said she’d find out where we are with getting an ECHP application in ready for secondary and said that actually that’s another reason it would have been beneficial to let me know what changes in support were being made, because I am having to start to think ahead about his next school and that’s easier to do when I know what sort of support his is going to need.

Anyway. Good meeting and most likely going to be having a meeting with SENCO and teacher in the coming weeks.

Well done OP, that sounds like it was really productive and you handled it well.

Grrrrr so just collected DS from the childminder and he’s all annoyed and confused because he’s been moved seats today.

At the exact same time I was talking to the link worker about it this morning, DS went into his classroom and found someone else sitting in ‘his’ seat. He was asked to wait by the teacher’d desk until the teacher could decide where to put him and ended up on a table with 6 others.

Now he’s all upset because he has lost ‘his’ seat, and is angry at the teacher because ‘he said they were our permanent seats for the rest of the year and now it’s not my seat anymore so he lied’

Agggghhhhhh 😡😡😡😡😡😡

Just to be clear, he has not been moved because I said something - he was moved first thing, at literally the same time I was speaking to someone about it.

Maybe another parent had complained about this teacher’s seating plan and hence the change! Not saying it is right but this is one of the reasons some posters on here are saying that sometimes it is better to let the teacher decide what is best because in this situation, your DS has suffered if this is the case.

Best email the teacher if it is difficult to see him and a childminder collects your DS in the afternoon and hopefully get this resolved.

I wish I could email the teacher, but unfortunately email addresses are not given out at my sons school.

I’m not working tomorrow though so I can wait around in the morning for the link worker again

Saying they were seats for the year was foolish on the teacher's part.

I like the fact school have an email filter though for staff.

Chloe raises a valid point. Some parents think they have far too much influence on seating plans and love to weigh in about how fair/unfair they think something is and can be quite bolshy to the point of expecting the class to be moved around their child's whims.

A former head once joked in a meeting that we should have long, thin classroom with front and back rows only for all the students who apparently need to be at the back/front based on zero educational reasons.

I'm hoping that isn't the cause of the move around though as the teacher will have set a precedent that will haunt them all year (and end up affecting other students like OP's child whose seating has to fit around the drama llama)

My dd was moved around the classroom while the teacher desperately tried to find someone she wouldn't talk to. She even talked to the non--verbal autistic boy and finally in desperation the teacher moved her next to a cardboard cutout of a cow and she happily talked to the cardboard cutout of the cow. I offered to give the teacher duct tape for Christmas.

Rinoachicken I think you need to go into school and insist on speaking with the SENCO, the teacher and the Home-link person in the flesh and not leave until you have communicated with all three AND worked out a plan.

Here in the USA, ASD is a recognized disability and as such a person with ASD has rights and it would be considered discrimination to not have an adequate education plan and throwing around a few terms about lawsuits and discrimination would get them to pay attention (one of the upsides of a litigious society). I wonder if anyone can weigh in with the English equivalent.
I really regret not having made a big fuss earlier, because the things that my dc's children did to them at that age stayed with them through out their school years and negatively influenced them about the benefits of education and learning. As a result, I have two highly gifted dc's in a family full of overly educated people who don't want to go to University and did everything they could to leave high school early.

sorry dc's teachers*