Slumber Party...The Sleep Deprivation Support Thread

[InmaculadaConcepcion]

We're all in this together... how about a bit of mutual schadenfreude/grim humour/shared agony as we blearily stumble through another day...

Sounds like everyone had a rough night last night. I didn't manage spare room - how could I miss the 2am party? But he did then sleep till 6 so I think we have some progress.

Anyone tried the wake to sleep approach to naps? I just tried it as am too lazy to walk for 20 minutes today but have failed miserably. Am left with the leave in pram and hope the tweety sparrows send him back off approach.

I know people have diff views on controlled crying but I was looking at my diaries for dd1 and dd2 last week. With both of them I dropped night feeds with cc by end 6 months and they both slept through from then..... Mind you neither did this 2 hour party thing.

Re cc - for me it depends on how long you leave them for. If it's only a few mins at a time I can't imagine it doing any harm. I think there's difference between cc and leaving a baby to cry it out, which I don't agree with.

My sis did cc with all four of hers when they hit 13-16 months (depending on the child) and none of them had to be left longer than 10 mins before it worked - except her DS, cc never worked with him and he was 4 before he slept through...

I guess when they're older they have the reasoning powers to understand you when you tell them you're not leaving them forever etc. whereas when they're babies there's a risk they think they've been abandoned (if left too long) and start to shut down their responses.

I think between 6 and 8 months is the best time to first try a little cc - after that the window closes for a bit (too much developmental stuff going on for them to learn another new skill ie sleeping...!)

Anyway, good luck NoSleep - I'll be interested to hear if it works!

DD doesn't usually cry (well, I have never left her long enough for her whimpering to develop into a cry) but I do leave her to whimper for a few mins if everything else has been tried and failed. Then I go back and try again... and again and usually she'll let me rock/cuddle/feed her to sleep after a few tries.

Never tried wake-to-sleep for naps or anything else. DD doesn't have enough of a real pattern for it to work at the mo!!

Last night wasn't too bad. DD was restless and woke quite a lot, but resettled with boob or dummy each time pretty quickly - until 05.45 when it took an hour to get her back down, whereupon she slept until 08.20.

My potential lie-in was sadly interrupted by a coughing fit, which I took out of the bedroom to avoid waking DD. Every time I tried to get back to bed, it threatened to start again until eventually I gave up. Ah well. As I said, up to then not TOO bad... (relatively speaking!!)

We also had quite a few wakings but reasonably quick resettles so not so bad. No parties at any rate. It's becoming clear though that DS is regularly getting out of his swaddle and that wakes him up. It may be time to do some gentle swaddle weaning. I've put him down for his first nap with an arm out and it took him awhile and the dummy to nod off, and I can now hear him rustling. Not sure I have the balls to do this.. our sleep is so fragile anyway.

NoSleep let us know how you go. I think cc is fine when they are old enough and you are comfortable with it. Also great if you've had success before. I've never tried wake to sleep- see earlier comment about balls. Just feels all wrong to wake a sleeping baby, even partially..

Not trying cc yet - will wait until after 6 months and properly on solids with protein and everything. Just not sure how it would work differently to what I do when he's partying at 3 am anyway since last 2 nights all I have done is gone in every 10 minutes or so and said time to sleep and put his music on, since all he does is a small grumble every so often in this time, never actually cries. You would hope that after 6 days of not feeding at 2am he might have got bored of waking up but no. Still it's marginally better than waking every 2 hours which he did before as now he just wakes at 2 and at 5/6.

Plan on ringing the sleep clinic HV next week again - will let you know if i get any helpful advice.

Well I had quite a good night (compared to the last 3) which is a good job as it was the christening today - which went very well (except England lost and my bil broke my light shade leaping up when England scored!).

Fingers crossed for a good night, I've drank enough wine so... !

Well we have some good news at least! After the bad night I mentioned before, we have now had 2 really good nights in a row!

She took a little while to settle both times, up to half an hour, and did wake early for her dreamfeed both nights, maybe because of the heat or something, but settled OK after feeding. Then both nights she slept through till around 4.30! (In fact last night I woke and had to go to the loo round 2.30, and I think that disturbed her a bit as she stirred lots and nearly woke, but then went back over which is hopefully a good sign). Then at 4.30 when she woke she was happy and burbling at first and then starting to get towards crying, so I just fed her and then she slept till after 7 both mornings! So it looks as though we may now be dummy-free at least for nights, hurray!

Naps are still very rough though, if I want her to sleep in the crib I still have to sit with her for at least 15-20 minutes (but often more) soothing her while she cries lots, and then stay with her for a good while to keep her asleep - which is practically impossible when I am on my own with her and DS, so some days she naps very badly; but I will have to use my two DS-free days in the week to do some more practise with her until she gets the hang of it. Still, I am hoping the more used she gets to sleeping at night without it, the easier it will get for her to nap without it too. She just seems more dependent on it for naps.

I hope you all get some progress soon too, sounds like some of you at least are seeing a bit of improvement, I hope it continues!

Re wake-to-sleep, we did try this at one point when DD seemed to be waking like clockwork at particular times, and it did seem to help though it's always hard to tell for sure! We didn't "wake" her fully, I just nudged her a couple times, just enough to make her stir slightly and move a little but without opening her eyes, but she did then miss the usual wakeup time (though woke later in the night instead, but still!).

Its just al so random isn't it? I thought there was meant to be some routine wit these babies? but i guess, if I don't have enough of one, how can ds?

Did not settle til 9pm, woke at 10pm, bottle at 11:30pm, slept til 4am, 5am, 5:45am, awake. So why do i feel so crap? I asked DH to settle him at 5:45am, to much scorn and scoffing. Apparantly, I had a lie in two days in a row. So it is his turn. Because he chose to come to bed at midnight. Lucky he had the choice. I told him if he wanted more sleep he should go to bed earlier and that lie-ins are not compulsory and do not follow a set 'turn' seeing as I have been up since 4am. He was not pleased

Yes, any helpful advice appreciated NoSleep!

Some better news, then - excellent! Especially the lack of dummy for overnight, MNIIM. Yes, I found DD needed the dummy more for naps once she stopped wanting much for overnight. But the dummy's become less required for naps now as well after a few weeks. She still feeds to sleep, however.

DD didn't do TOO badly last night. Irritatingly, my cough woke me a couple of times and sent me scuttling into another room to avoid waking up DD and DH, so a precious chunk of sleep lost . Anyway, from 18.50 - 06.30 she woke up I think only four-ish times (needed a second resettle a couple of times, but that only took a minute or two). REALLY want this bloody cough to go, though. I have enough trouble getting the Zzzs as it is...

I feel for you Wood dd decided she didn't want the party to end last night and I was struggling to get her to sleep. In the midst of this dh fell asleep on sofa (too much beer at party) so I had to wake her up to go and get my tea, then he went to bed! I went in and gave her to him half an hour later (so I could go to the loo) and he moaned when I didn't take her straight back - this was before 9pm!!! He said he had to get up early and wanted to get a good night's sleep (poor thing!).

Apparently I can stop all this sleeplessness by giving her a bottle, then she'll go straight through, so it's all my fault (therefore I have to deal with it on my own!)...

Hiccups: my ds is now all on bottles and still doesn't sleep through. Has been on bedtime bottle since 4 weeks and it never made any difference.

i can categorically state that bottles do not necessarily = sleeping through. DS takes a huge bottle of formula at 10:30pm in order to test this theory. He is a greedy boy and is like 'oh yes, MORE food!' and continues to wake. Although, he has slept for 4 hours more recently.

I think it has messed my milk supply up though, he feeds more randomly and they don't feel as full, i am worried I am now starving the poor boy and I am losing my mlk. I just don't really know whether i am coming or going, with milk, sleep life !

His night time is more random now. The one thing that used to be the same most evenings was his sleeping, gradually brought it to 7.30-8pm, and been there for a while, later than i wanted but a pattern nontheless. Not any more, he has decided to be cute, cooing and happy/kicking about at 7pm, and 8pm, and oh yes, 9pm he is alssep now, finally.

I hope you ladies get some rest tonight, come on babies, we want record sleeping in unison ok? (i cannot go to bed yet, as planned. I have DDs birthday party to arrange)

Thanks ladies, obviously I know that, shame about my stupid dh!

My cough only sent me out the bedroom and onto the sofa once last night. I still got to DD first though when she awoke and started whimpering! Must be very tuned into her. I think she woke for feeds around four times, then a couple of mini-awakenings when she hadn't resettled fully (quickly dealt with) and one that took longer, but still wasn't too bad. Up at 07.20.

My eyes still feel hot, though!. Can't remember what it was like to have more than an hour and a half's kip at a stretch.....

hiccups glad the christening went well but sorry you are having to have the 'formula will make the difference' discussion. If only it were that simple!

mynameis- great news on the night dummy front. Hope naps follow. DS is becoming increasingly reliant on the dummy to get to sleep and I'm wondering if I should intervene now.

IC sorry your cough is still giving you some gip Adding my voice to WF's plea to the babies to give us all a night off. Especially in this heat.

We've had a couple of nights from 11.30 to 3.30 which have been good although I suspect unsustainable (especially given today's nap disaster). However, day naps and bedtime have become an absolute fecking nightmare. He used to be able to self soothe reasonably well for naps and bedtime, with a bit of work (good thing too given that he won't feed to sleep and rocking winds him up..) but has completely lost this. Only thing that works is a dummy and sometimes not then. Cue much crying. How can he have forgotten how to self soothe overnight? Is this the 4 month regression kicking in (he is just over 16 weeks) or just babies being babies? I CANNOT go back to having to give him every nap in the sling. It was killing me and totally buggered up my knee. Any words of wisdom/ comfort?

Hoping for Babies in Shock Sleep Success headlines from all tomorrow..

Oh, SAA, how infuriating/depressing. Could well be the bloody 4MSR... How does he do in a pram?
If he only needs the dummy to fall asleep, you should be okay. The problems arise IMO when they need the feckin' thing to STAY asleep... With any luck, if you make sure the dummy is always removed once he's gone under (if he doesn't spit it of his own accord), then hopefully he won't become accustomed to it always being in his mouth when he hits the top of a sleep cycle... (well, it's a theory, anyway!!)
Have you tried old soothing stuff, long-abandoned? I find it's surprising how often stuff you think they've grown out of in terms of calming etc. can work when re-introduced after a break.

DD's naps were somewhat shorter than the ideal today, thanks to a hospital appointment. We shall see if there'll be any impact on her overnight sleep...
[fingers crossed emoticon]

Good luck for tonight and thanks for encouraging words about the dummy. He usually spits it out or I take it out so perhaps I shouldn't worryfor a bit (although tis my default position!). He loves his pram but unfortunatelynot for sleep. Just when you think you've cracked something, they change up again. Out of interest, how much day sleep do you reckon they should be having? My DS prob gets between 3 - 4.5 hrs depending on the day, hismood etc, broken between 4 naps.

naps - oh ds normally has about 2 hrs max! but today he went for a stroll in the pushchair with dh, (after i left the house at 7am for a desperate need for space, i have asked, and it has not been given, so this morning, i took it, went to sainsburys cafe and had beans on toast, americano and read the paper while dh forfeited his lie-in and had to look after the children, ha, he got that for never helping me in the night, i had a hissy fit at 5am and chucked my toys out of the pram )... anyway, back to naps...so, yes he loved the pram, and slept for 1.5 hours or so? much longer than normal, then this afternoon i had to go on a lengthy car journey which took longer due to traffic, road works, and getting lost! so, 2.5 hours before he woke! so, i make that 4 hours. Which he needs, as last night did 9pm-5am with wakings at 12:30am, 4am, 5am, 5:30am.

Ouch WF although love your 5am toy throwing. I may try that the next time my DH sighs when I get back into bed at 4 and tells me off for feeding him (DS that is..) Apparently it 'encourages' him to wake up. Nothing to do with hunger then.

Hope that your 4 hrs gives you a better night. My DS must be one of the only babies who doesn't really do car sleep.

SAA do you think it could be the start of teething? Some do get them very early, and also it can be sore for a while before they are noticeable apparently...

Yes do make sure the dummy doesn't stay in for too long else you might end up like us!

Naps... I have read that at 4-5 months the average is 4 to 6 hours total (can't remember other ages without looking it up). Poor DD is not getting anywhere near that at the moment though, she is probably getting under 3 hours most days and some days lucky to manage two, and all in 20-minute chunks which is not meant to be good either Still doesn't stop MIL saying "maybe she just doesn't need much sleep though?" or "are you sure she's tired?" if I dare complain about her nap problems... though she is lovely apart from that.

IC good on you for throwing a strop, hope it has some good effects! And that you start to manage a bit more sleep again soon...

We had another of the better nights last night, although apparently she woke a couple of times during the evening (I was out though!). After her dreamfeed she slept till after 4 though, then fed and then slept again till 6.40 so I can't complain!

Naps are still a nightmare though, I think we are seeing some very small progress (she doesn't cry quite so much now and I can sometimes get her back to sleep eventually after she wakes) but she still can't manage more than 20 minutes at a time in her crib, and is now getting more restless in the pushchair too and often wakes after 45 mins even if I keep pushing... Then she gets all tired and grouchy (and so do I after spending the whole day trying to get her to sleep better, and failing!). She has been very restless this evening, already 3 wakeups since bedtime, which I think might be because she is tired - hope that doesn't mean we are in for a bad night tonight...

4-5 months, how many hours should they be having?!! not my little cub! only as a diddy newborn did he sleep that long in the day

No strops here, but I think WF earned hers!!

Naps - it SO depends on the baby!! I'm beginning to chill about naps now. As long as DD has enough to keep her sweet, that seems to be the main thing. Shorter naps over the last few days don't seem to have made a difference to night time sleep, if anything it's been slightly better.

Gotta run

Where was I? Ah yes... naps...
Yes, I reckon as long as they have enough to prevent overtiredness, it doesn't necessarily matter if they are fairly short. In fact, I don't think there's much you can do about it (unless preventable stuff is waking them up, of course).

Gotta go again!!

...and another thing...

Sorry, this post keeps getting interrupted!

Well, not too bad a night again last night - I think DD only woke four times (sleep-addled hazy recollection of numbers). She took an hour to resettle the last time, but otherwise went back down fast. I have a feeling the total amount of sleep I clocked up may have touched 6 hours.... wow! (OK, maximum stretch probably 90 mins, but I'm not complaining)

Once again, naps not ideal today, but once again, she's gone down easily [don't jinx it emoticon] a little after 19.30. Fingers crossed for another reasonable night.

May everyone get a decent number of Zs tonight...

DD just woke up. Resettled quickly, though.

im so glad to find other people on here who understand what its like to never get a lie in and have wake up calls at 5:30am!

My DS1 is 2.5 now and he never was a good sleeper, didnt sleep thru until about 2 yrs
(for the first year i look bak and i literally was a zombie!) i suffered listening to all of my friends saying how their baby slept thru at 6 weeks/3 months etc and kept thinking maybe soon he will sleep thru...i was waiting a long time!

now he will sleep thru from 8ish until about 5am - then he up, out of his room and into ours. the other 30% of the time, he also wakes durin the nite once, wont go back to sleep for an hour and then is still up at 5:30am without fail. altho i would love to know how he knows the time been as his whole room is totally blacked out!

i just want to get some sleep! i work 9 till 5 and am literally a danger on the road, falling to sleep at the wheel. wen will this life of 5:30am's ever stop?!

i pray the new baby will sleep better than DS1 - for my sanity mainly!