Misguided Illusion Part II - Baby still not sleeping through by six months? Come and join us!

[MomOrMum]

Thought I would start a fresh thread as, sadly, we have almost filled the first one.

Feral, Kiwi, Chulita, et al...shouldn't we have graduated from this thread by now?!

Now welcoming a new crop of 6 months+ babies determined to help us reach new heights/depths of sleep deprivation.

Here is the original thread:
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/sleep/713951-Support-thread-for-those-who-were-under-the-misguided-illusion

May I join your thread? DD is 7.5 months and is put down after a bath at around 6:30 She then wakes at some point between 10:30pm and 12 and then again somewhere between 2:00am and 4:00. (although occasionally there's another waking in there too) Usually she's awake for the day between 6 and 6:30am. Naps are a nightmare - she generally goes down for a nap about an hour or an hour and a half after getting up for about 40 mins, then she might have another nap around lunchtime for a similar length of time. In the afternoon she gets desperately tired but if I try to put her down she simply screams and screams, so I've given up on that! This means she's grouchy by the time bedtime rolls around.

She was fully breastfed for 7 months and I've just started introducing an occasional bottle of formula with a view to reducing breastfeeding. She's also having 3 meals a day - not huge meals, but obviously plenty for her. She has 3-5 breastfeeds per day and then feeds when she wakes up overnight, so 5-8 feeds per 24 hour period.

ARGH! I knew it was tough having a baby, but I thought by now she'd be doing what all my friends babies do - sleeping from 7-7! I hate it and wish I didn't resent it so much when she wakes at night. Hopefully here there'll be people who understand!

(Oh, and she was 3 months premature, so for the first couple of months after she came out of SCBU I let her get away with anything - which basically meant I cuddled her most of the time...)

Welcome Galena, hope you're not too tired. I think there are lots of older babies who don't sleep through and love milk at night - I meet more and more at the moment and my DS is nearly 10 months.... Hope you find it supportive being here - I certainly do!

thank you Chulita, that sounds more than managable to me - I am expecting hours long of screaming sessions and my heart breaking - how can I ignore my baby asking for a nice drink of milk.... Anyway, gearing up for it. It probably won't be so bad after all. (fingerts crossed). He is being good at the moment and going til 1.30 or 2am (after bed at 8pm) for his first feed. The trouble is he always wakes for a 5am feed and then sleeps one more hour. What did you do about the early morning? Did you give yourself a cut off point for the first feed?

Wondering how Isitme is getting on....

And by the way Galena, cuddling your baby sounds like a very good plan to me! What else could one do with a new born? And especially a premature little one!

If she'd gone all night and woke at 5am I'd feed her. I wouldn't feed her earlier than 5 though. She still wakes up at 5 sometimes now, I think it's just one of those things, she's not hungry, she just wakes up and wants to play for a bit
Welcome Galena, no harm at #aLL In cuddling your LO a lot!

, sorry, was trying to type before DD made her scrabbling mark but I didn't preview first. She's a techno geek like her dad

Hello Galena cuddling sounds good to me too.

dycey I'm just about hanging in here thank you for asking. DS slept better last night - I'd noticed that he seems to either be doing a one feed night, or a two feed night, and if it's the latter, seems to be related to discomfort on his part (cough/sore throat and/or teething). So I decided to give him calpol before feeding him if he was going for a two feed night (basically, first feed before 2.30am). Having done that, he only woke for his two feeds, which was a big improvement on the last two nights.

Today's naps on the other hand have been a complete disaster. First attempt was a complete failure - half an hour of DS crying while walking around his cot. Having abandoned that attempt, DS then virtually fell asleep in his lunch. Not surprisingly, he did fall asleep during his post-lunch BF, but woke up and cried (briefly - about a minute) when I transferred him to his cot. This afternoon his left cheek is bright red, so I think it must be his second top tooth making it's presence felt. I felt a lot better when I realised there was something wrong, tbh.

In answer to your question a while back - no, we've never woken him for a dream feed.

Thanks for the welcome guys. Well, I've just had the night and day from hell! DD has the cold that I've had for the past week and DH has had for the past fortnight. Last night she woke every hour and a half. She wouldn't feed at all at any of the wakings, just wanted a very short cuddle (1-2 minutes) then would go straight back down - except at 4:30 when she just wanted to be cuddled and screamed whenever I tried to put her down.

This morning she slept really well - 45 minutes, woke and I put her dummy back in and she slept for another 45 minutes (!) then was only up for an hour or so and had another 40 minutes. However, that was it. For the rest of the day she's done nothing but scream. If I held her she screamed, if I tried to bf her she'd scream, if I tried formula she'd scream, if I put her down she'd scream. We bathed her an hour earlier than normal and she still wouldn't feed at all but she's gone to sleep. This is quite common for her - she'll get herself so overtired she won't feed after her bath, then she'll sleep for an hour or so and wake up a feed like an angel. She hasn't fed much at all today - 2 bf and 1 small solids meal. This bodes badly for tonight I guess.

Ho hum. At least I know its because she's feeling poorly and hopefully should improve!

Hello all,

A better night last night - only one wake for a feed and then awake for the day around 6.40am. The administration of calpol seems to have helped again.

Does anybody else who is still breastfeeding find that their dc feeds for a long time at night? DS fed for an hour at bedtime (would have gone longer, but I prised him off and he went to sleep), then for another hour in the night (I didn't dare prise him off in case he didn't go back to sleep ).

The previous night he fed for over an hour at bedtime (hence my being more proactive last night), then over 30mins at his first feed and over 40mins at his second feed.

Is this "normal"? Not sure I want to do anything about it, but just wondering.

My DD is a nuisance at bedtime - because she doesn't sleep long enough during the day, by the time bath and bedtime comes she's absolutely hanging (and I can't put it any earlier... it's already somewhere between 5:30 and 6, unless she's really being hideous in which case it's 5). This means that after her bath and story she is too tired to feed, so I have to calm her with a dummy until she's nearly asleep and then quickly whip the dummy out and the booby in. If I'm lucky she'll start feeding, but will fall asleep after about 5-10 minutes. I put her down and then she wakes again an hour later when she feeds for about 15-20 mins.

During the night it's anything from 5-20 mins - but she's always been a quick worker! Most feeds take no longer than 10-15 minutes which I'm profoundly grateful for because the way we've found that suits us to feed means both my hands are occupied, so I can do nothing while she feeds except ponder life, the universe, and everything (I won't have the TV on while she's awake - I caught her watching Jeremy Vile and vowed not to watch it with her again!).

Don't know which of us is 'normal' - I have a feeling we both are! My poor DD is not only teething but also has a snotty cold, so 2 nights ago she was awake every 90 mins, and last night had 2 feeds overnight (her norm) but also woke every 60-90 mins, yelled, whimpered and then fell asleep just as I was pondering getting up to her. DH slept through it all! Hopefully getting back to normal again tonight!

I suspect you're right Galena - both normal. Out of interest, what would you do if you had a hand free? I also ponder life, the universe, etc, despite having a spare hand and wondered if I've been missing something. But I am mostly sitting in the dark, which might limit my options?

Last night I made plans for something which I now can't remember. Although I think I did remember it earlier. Although can't be sure now.

The previous night I remembered where DH and I had seen the actor in Private Practice before (was Six Feet Under). And still remembered to tell DH about it the next day.

Galena - can I suggest an itouch with speakers? has been enormously helpful to me, as not only can i download podcasts to listen to, but there is the iplayer, so can listen to plays, womans hour, adam and joe etc etc.

hello everyone, haven't posted on here for ages because [i am going to whisper this] ds has been sleeping through. it's his first birthday today and we've just had about a month of him sleeping reliably. he's had teeth coming through, and a cold, and we've had some bad nights, but it seems that when he feels better he's happy to go back to sleeping for 12 hours in a row.

ds was a dreadful napper for the first five months until i read ncss and decided that i'd just do whatever it took to get him to sleep in the day - walking, driving, rocking, feeding, patting etc etc. eventually he did and now will go down for 1.5 hours in his cot in the morning. something else i thought would never happen. he goes to a cm, doesn't follow the same routine there, but seems to adapt really well.

what i'm saying is that although it feels insurmountable while you're going through the sleepless nights they really will come to an end.
i thought this would never happen, that i had made a rod for my own back, that he was addicted to the boob, and being in bed with me, that i was too soft, you name it, i worried about it. i really hope you're not reading and thinking 'oh shut up about your bloody perfect sleeping baby' - as i would have done, but i wish that i could go back to myself six months ago and let me know that eventually it will be okay, regardless of what i did. and that i could go back to myself a year ago and tell me not to listen to anyone who promised he'd be sleeping through by 12 weeks!!! i think the hardest thing is the constant worry that you're somehow doing something wrong and that's why they don't sleep.

all of that said, this and the other 'my baby won't sleep at such and such a stage' threads were an enormous help and stopped me from going mad / to prison for poisoning dh. mwah to everyone.

has anyone found switching to formula for the last feed has helped with sleeping through?

My DD (6 months- two solid meals a day) wakes screaming in the night- and no amount of comforting can help, pacing up and down, rocking in my arms etc- the only thing she wants is about 30 seconds of boob- so it cant be hunger- just the comfort of the breast...

Ooooh! staines, hello! I've been trying to find you to see how you're doing! Glad your LO's sleeping better.

slicer, DD was bf til she self-weaned at 11 months. Formula made no difference to her sleeping patterns ime. She did a lot of comfort sucking til she was about 8 months but she did grow out of it.

slicer my ds is still doing a lot of nighttime comfort sucking at 9mo. I try to be glad that at least something comforts him

slicer out of interest, does the same thing happen if you send in DP to comfort him? Some friends found that worked for them as an alternative to sucking.

hi , can i come join? i am at my wits end after yet another night of truely awful sleep on top of months of fairly bad sleep. Can any of you tell me if this happened to you, dd was sleeping fairly ok, sleep at 7, feed at 10, 3 then awake at 7-7.30......then..she got a cold and i was ill and probably abused the entertainment factor of my boobs. Ever since then she wont nap during the day, whereas she was having 3 good hour and a half to two hour naps and she wont sleep for any more than two hours, mostly she wakes up on the hour, every hour. She is 6 months and 2 weeks and on the verge of crawling, i dont know if this makes any difference.
Im thinking of trying to cut out all but one feeds during the night because i end up trying to settle her, she wont then i just pop her on and she is asleep within minutes, she doesnt actually feed.
She has also taken to waking up for an hour or two wanting to play, this morning it was from 3.45 until 6.....needless to say there have been some tears shed this morning, both hers and mine.
so come on....is there any light at the end of the tunnel?

Hello minnie sorry you have to join us.

Is it possible she's teething? I've had a few of those hour or so wakes, and the only thing I've noticed is that some of them (probably not all though) are associated with the arrival of teeth a little while later.

But my ds's sleep went haywire around the 5 month mark. We have only just managed to get back to one or two wakes a night by using controlled crying at 81/2 months.

Sorry can't help on the naps - mine has never done more than 2-3 hours total napping in a day lol.

i dont think she is, she doesnt seem very dribbly or flushed cheeks, she does put everything and anything in her mouth though.
I think I might try harder at settling her down without just popping her on the breast, thankfully dp has come home from work today to save my sanity so i have had some lovely sleep and should hopefully be in a better position to see it through. fingers crossed.
Isitme, how did you get on with the cc? Id always thought "never" but now i can really see why some people use it.

minnie cc seems to have helped a lot with DSs nighttime wakes - generally just up for feeds now. But not so sure about it for the naps. Had 15mins proper crying followed by 10mins of occasional bursts this afternoon for just a 30min nap, which I'm not convinced was worth it for either of us.

For the nighttime wakes, we'd had about 4months of DS waking up almost every hour (at most every other hour) in the night and were wiped out by it. The cc seems to have stopped that within a week - the first three nights were the worst, and tbh nothing compared to the soul-destroying on-edge tiredness of DSs habitual waking.

Sorry minnie yes, I always thought never too, until a few weeks ago.

I can totally understand why after having the week from hell. I see there is a debate raging on the discussions of the day about dropping night feeds from 6 months.

hi chulita! sorry to see you're still on here.....i thought my words of wisdom would be largely wasted, and am sure i'll have to eat them before too long. hope all's good with you
x

IsItMe, overnight, I think pondering life, the universe and everything is fine. During the day, however, I wish I had a hand free to MN, read a book or play my DS. Oh, and as for the idea of an Ipod with speakers, I'm not sure hubby would be too impressed with my choice of music being played at 2 in the morning!

Having been smug-ish that DD only feeds for 10 minutes, the last 2 nights she's fed for 30 and 45 minutes respectively at bedtime. Hasn't made her sleep any more though! Bah!

Galena DS only feeds for about 3mins per feed during the day, so that's not a problem. What I resent is the BLW hour-long mealtimes when I try to sit politely taking an interest in what DS is doing after I've finished my own meal, but long to be doing something else (MN, email, interwebs, tv). Any attempts to do anything other than fetch more things for DS to eat result in him getting distracted from eating. Grrrrr. In my lower moments I tend to sit there recalling seeing non-BLW friends spooning stuff into their dc's mouth in 5mins and wondering why I ever thought BLW was a good idea.

Can't comment on BLW as I'm one of the non-BLW ones who spoons mush in in 5 minutes (although I did try her with finger foods today and she threw a major hissy fit!) but in the post a couple of days ago you were talking about him BFing for over an hour overnight... That was what I was replying to.