Misguided Illusion Part II - Baby still not sleeping through by six months? Come and join us!

[MomOrMum]

Thought I would start a fresh thread as, sadly, we have almost filled the first one.

Feral, Kiwi, Chulita, et al...shouldn't we have graduated from this thread by now?!

Now welcoming a new crop of 6 months+ babies determined to help us reach new heights/depths of sleep deprivation.

Here is the original thread:
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/sleep/713951-Support-thread-for-those-who-were-under-the-misguided-illusion

That?s fabulous Galena though I see last night was a little bit of a set back but hopefully tonight she?ll go through again can I be a bore and get you to roughly sketch down Skye?s day i.e. naps, meal times etc. I am at the end of my tether, since Sat night I haven?t had more than 2 hours sleep. Last night I was at the cinema with friends, left at 8.30pm after I?d got her down (too hot here now to go to bed any earlier sadly) got back at 1am hoping that DH would have been in with her and I?d be able to get ready for bed and have a couple of hours sleep before she woke up at which time I?d planned to take over but got to the front gate of our development and could hear her screaming from there. She was hoarse and all alone and hysterical and had clearly been crying for a very long time, DH was dead to the world asleep in our room and then he has the nerve to be angry with me and we are not speaking today I need attitude from him like a hole in the head. I took DD back to her room and into bed with me but she wouldn?t settle and wanted to suckle virtually all night she slept 5.30-7 when DS woke us all up!

Blue ? glad to hear DS1 is ok hope your night continued well last night. I can?t sleep during the day, makes me feel even worse. I have to find a way to get more sleep soon. I have convinced myself that I am a terrible mother, I am very shouty and feel constantly guilty and that other people are judging me, it is all getting too much. DS is being particularly trying at the moment and I do worry that my state of mind is affecting him (though I see all the other toddlers his age ? 2yrs4m ? behaving pretty much the same!)

Carve ? I?d be lobbing off a load of hair if it meant I could escape DD I am like you, my resolve is fine until I am so desperate for sleep that I will do anything to get it! Hope you have a better one tonight.

DD is off her food at the moment so that probably accounts for some of the wakefulness. It took me 30mins to get her down for a nap this morning but thankfully she is down and I can get on with some things in peace! DS is out with a friend for a few hours ? phew!

Sure you can ask about our days, MrsMc.

Wake between 7 and 7:30
Breakfast 8ish (with half a cup of milk)
Nap about 9:30 usually for 40 minutes (can be anything between 20 mins and 2hrs!)
Lunch somewhere between 12 and 1 (with water)
Nap starts somewhere between 2 and 3:30 for between half an hour and an hour
Tea 4:30ish (whole cup of milk to last from now till before bath)
Supper when we eat at about 6
Bath 6:30ish
Story and cuddle to sleep between 7 and 7:30

Sorry to be so vague with timings, but whilst she wakes and goes to bed at similar times each day, all other times are somewhat fluid - she will generally have 2 sleeps, and it depends on what we're doing where and when those sleeps are. She sleeps far longer in her cot (except yesterday when she napped for 20 minutes in the morning in her cot!)

Breakfast tends to be porridge made with milk and fruit puree and a bit of fruit.
Lunch is either a sandwich, some crisps and a yoghurt or a ready-made pot of food and a yoghurt (if we're out and about). Today she had scrambled egg and toast.
Tea is a hot meal - jacket potato with cheese and beans or shepherd's pie or something similar - and a yoghurt or some custard.
Supper is a bit of whatever we're having and is purely so that she sits with us as we eat, and isn't trying to last too long between meals.

Sometimes, if she's going to have the same as us for tea she has a snacky-type meal at 4:30 and eats her main meal at 6.

She sometimes has a snack mid-morning and/or midafternoon - maybe a biscuit or some fruit.

Sorry this is long, but hopefully it helps!

Carve - yes, we've got the No Cry Sleep Solution. I probably should read it again and see if any of the ideas seem more useful for where we are now. So far, I've just got as far as feeding until he's nearly asleep but not quite, but we've been stuck at that point for a couple of months now.

MrsMc - I know what you mean about feeling others are judging - I'm v. shouty with DS1 too.

We were doing all right at first last night, but it all went downhill after about 2.30 when they took it in turns to wake up - DS2 at 2.30 and 4.30, and DS1 at 3.30 needing a wee. Then they were up for the day soon after 6. Joy!

I'm thinking that I should rearrange DS2's bed time routine so he has his milk before he's too sleepy, but don't want it too close to tea either, so he wants more later. It's all so complicated!

Thanks Galena, that does help. It?s always interesting to know what other babies are doing. I try to sync DS and DD but she often tires before he does and therefore won?t eat enough at meal times. Interestingly, she slept for 1 ½ hours this morning and then had a really good lunch, then slept for another hour around 4 and ate a good dinner and so far tonight since I put her down at 8pm she has only woken once and that is really good going for her! I do believe what the NCSS says about day time naps being the key t good sleep at night.

Blue ? I am too scared to do another NCSS tracked night for the fear of how depressed it will make me! I don?t feel like we have come very far since we started trying to implement it either but I feel I have no choice but to preserve and hope that one day she will magically sleep all night and I will be human again (have you seen SITC2 ? 2 nights to myself a week would help!) hope you have a better night tonight! We get DS shouting he needs a wee too and don?t want to upset all his good work buy not getting him to the loo on time

Meet up information!!

Just in case anyone decides that Gloucestershire is not the back of beyond and fancies a day out... carve and I are planning to meet up at Slimbridge Wildfowl and Wetlands Trust at midday on July 7th. We're planning to lunch and then go round and see the ducks, geese, swans and flamingoes (oh, and the otters if they are cooperating!). I have tickets that get non-WWT-members in at group rates (£8.30) so let me know if you fancy coming!

Thanks Galena & would be good to see others if its doable.

Mixed fortunes here. Very upset last night & co-slept in the end. Think possibly teeth but also unsettled as we communted for DH's work last night. However since Friday DS has been going in his cot for naps which has always failed dismally before. He was having a good length morning nap in buggy in the house and in the afternoon I would often walk for ages to try and get him to sleep longer than 30 mins. He did an hour in cot this afternoon . He certainly seemed less exhausted at tea time so am hoping this makes a difference (although I may not be able to get away with as much cake if walking less!)

MrsMc - LOL at avoiding doing another sleep log. I've only ever done one for exactly the same reasons!

Blue - from NCSS we've altered the feeding to sleep same as you, and also been doing phased gradual withdrawal. Very up and down with it but when DS is well it certainly has made a difference. Just a long process .

DH decided to take over Sat & Sun night. She didn't wake up nearly as much as usual and I didn't feed her between 9pm and 6am. I couldn't sleep though, I could either hear her or had nightmares!

Interesting MrsMc. DH currently having a bit more luck settling DS and we think we might try the same thing as he's either on slack hours/annual leave for the next week or so. Even though you know DH is there its horrid to hear them and not go isn't it? A friend of mine said this worked for them though so fingers crossed....

Is the end near???

DS is 19 months and in the past 3 weeks has slept through 5 times! The first time I thought it was a fluke as it has happened very occasionally in the past. Probably jinxed it now, but it looks like things might be changing for us!

I guess my advice is - be patient! I think all babies have their own timetable for sleeping through. It's hard on you, especially if you work but it will happen eventually and it's not forever. (Bet the little b***r doesn't sleep through again for months now I've said this!)

Glad to hear of improvements MrsMc and Lizum. We're having rubbish sleep here - think the heat isn't agreeing with her. Last night she woke at 11:20 and FINALLY went back to sleep at 1:20 (this from a girl who, for about 4 weeks slept through pretty much every night) Today she flatly refused to have an afternoon nap though, so that was interesting!

I know what you mean Carve. When DH goes into DD I can?t sleep and if I do I have nightmares, guess it?s just the anxiety. He said he?d do last night but he didn?t hear her cry so I went. She woke 3 times before 6.30 and wanted milk on the two last occasions ? just shows you that she doesn?t really need it (from when DH is there) but still wants if I am

Lizum ? so hope he has cracked it!

Poor you Galena it all goes to pot here if they haven?t had their sleeps. DD slept for an hour this morning and 1 ½ to 2 hours in her buggy on the beach this afternoon and went down like a dream earlier than usual at 8pm. DS didn?t have his afternoon nap (normally 1 ½ to 2 hours) just had a 20 min snooze in the car and he is still kicking about in his room being a pest 1 ½ hours after we put him down, he is too exhausted to sleep. Silly Mummy letting him get that way.

Well, she woke at 9:30pm for a drink of water, and then resettled herself with no fuss. I was ! Then she woke at 1:20am and wouldn't settle till 2:40am which was hard cos I'd just got into a nice deep sleep!

I feel rubbish (tired) this morning, not helped by the fact that over the weekend I developed tonsillitis, which is better enough that I don't think I should start the antibiotics I was prescribed, but not completely better.

Go easy on yourself MrsMc. Not your fault, just one of those days for DS.

It's hard sometimes, isn't it? I know I sometimes offer advice, and yet fail to listen to myself!

Bad sleep again here, and now DS2 is coughing again too. Should go to bed myself really. Yawn.

just want to quickly say my ds only started to sleep through when he started walking at 14.5 months, he is now 19 months and sleeps through around 5 out of 7 nights, he has been a nightmare and has totally put me off having any more!!!! good luck to u all x

Well, we're still having random sleep, I think generated by the heat. She tends to wake a couple of times at the moment. The first time she has a drink of water, rolls over and goes back to sleep. The second time she needs to be picked up and cuddled but generally is asleep again half an hour after waking. Last night she was sick at the first wake - I think purely because of the heat. She settled quickly after being cleaned up and has been fine since.

She is also beginning to drop a nap I think - she tends to alternate between 1 and 2 naps. The thing I'm puzzled about is that her 1 nap seems to be in the morning - is this normal for 1-nap children? I thought the 1 nap tended to be after lunch?

I thought so too Galena, but was chatting to my mum the other day about naps and she said "I wonder if DS will be a morning or an afternoon napper?". I'd also thought that when they dropped to 1, it tended to be the morning one that went, but my mum reckoned it was more variable. DS tends to have a longer morning nap at the mo, and I'd been thinking that I 'needed' to get him to switch this round at some point but not going to worry to much now as long as he's not seeming overtired.
Still lots of waking at night for us as well but DS seems to be settling easier & for the last 5 nights I haven't BF him until 5/5.30am! Didn't really set out to do this, but at the end of last week he seemed to accept rocking/music without BF and as DH & I were sharing, it got to 5am and I realised he hadn't BF, so have continued ever since. Like the others, he has had some water a few times with it being hot. Has been helped I think by DH not being at work this week, so on balance he's been going in more. I'm sure that night weaning DS isn't 'the answer' or anything but seems worthwhile to continue if we can. Strange at first though after BF several times a night for 10 months!
thanks for the post princessdaisyboo & glad things are better. Has also made me think seriously about having any more!

We had a couple of nights this week when I didn't BF DS2 until early morning as well. All gone to pot again now though!

I think he is getting a bit better... but I've thought that before. Too hot tonight and everyone's frazzled.

Gah! Knew it was too good to be true. DS hasn'tselpt through since I posted. In fact, last night was a nightmare. He was happily asleep in his cot until I had a coughing fit at 2am. DS was then in our bed, feeding every half hour or so it seemed until 5.30 when he decided it was time to get up and play. He usually wakes around 9am! DH was banished to the sofa to get some sleep whilst I watched DS while he played in the bedroom until I tried a few times to get him to sleep. Eventually, I put him in his cot, lay on the floor and sang the wheels on the bus until he (amazingly) fell asleep. Completely knackered today, but luckily work wasn't too hard.

Rubbish, rubbish, rubbish sleep! Skye's been waking for 2-3 hour stretches nearly every night recently. Not upset unless I leave her, but if I'm in there she claps and smiles at me. Daddy isn't acceptable, so it's me or screaming.

I'm shattered.

I want sleep.

Hugs Galena! We've had a few nights a bit like that. Last night he woke at 1, settled quite easily, woke again 30 mins or so later and then we spent the next hour and a half on frequent wakings and each one being harder to settle.

Doesn't seem to want to BF in the night now, which is good. He's also settled on my hair as an alternative though, which is less good! Doesn't want to chew it though, just hold it. So DH can't settle him cos his hair isn't long enough!! We've tried all sorts of toys with long ears, ribbons, labels, but all firmly rejected.

Thanks Blue - Last night was a little better - 3 wakes but all about 10 minutes. AND DH managed to settle her for the last one. AND I managed to settle her for the first 2 wakes without picking her up (which I haven't managed for ages)

It's a nuisance when they have a strange way to settle which is non-transferable. DD has a dummy, which ideally I'd like to try to train her off, but it's not happening, and I think I'll end up leaving it till she's a bit older.

Looking forward to meeting carve and mini-carve on Wednesday though!

Lookin forward to it too Galena. Anyone else in the Gloucester area able to join us at Slimbridge? Galena put the details a few posts back. We were doing ok with some longer stretches of sleep - he's even done until 1am a couple of times , but last night went back again a bit with more frequent wakings. Hoping its just a bad one as overall there does seem to be a pattern of improvement . Still not BF until 5/5.30am,and I think napping in the cot definitely helps.
Blue - DS also loves my hair and is not remotely convinced by any sort of substitute. Thankfully he doesn't suck it quite as much now and (mostly) its more gentle playing, but he does have a habit of managing to pull at individual strands and it really can hurt!