Misguided Illusion Part II - Baby still not sleeping through by six months? Come and join us!

[MomOrMum]

Thought I would start a fresh thread as, sadly, we have almost filled the first one.

Feral, Kiwi, Chulita, et al...shouldn't we have graduated from this thread by now?!

Now welcoming a new crop of 6 months+ babies determined to help us reach new heights/depths of sleep deprivation.

Here is the original thread:
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/sleep/713951-Support-thread-for-those-who-were-under-the-misguided-illusion

Wondering if I can join the 'party'. DD is 8 months and waking about 4-5 times a night (starting about 11pm). She's only just started swallowing food so she's basically waking because she's hungry. This I don't mind but I know that I have to stop feeding her to sleep. She is pretty good and can fall asleep herself but she struggles to self-settle.

Anyway, seems like there's lots of good ideas posted.

Welcome to the house of zombies purplecrazyhorse. Good luck with working on your sleep issues.

Galena - Looks like Skye had a lovely birthday, what a cutie . And at her card it is amazing! Can't believe they didn't show it.

Olivo - great about DD2 but sorry DD1 is not playing ball. Must be so hard to drag yourself to work.

Sorry about my sweary rant, just got to the end of my tether. I seem to have a pattern of calm acceptance that I will be sleep deprived for ever, then I get grumpy and stroppy with it all, then I have a good old cry about it, and then go back to calm acceptance. Isn't my DH a lucky man .

Hello to all the new arrivals, sorry you're having to join.

melonian so sorry you're having such a hard time of it. DH or I could have written the same, and I was reading a thread about seeing a woman swear at her crying baby yesterday and feeling very guilty .

DS is sleeping so much better now, so I'm sure it will get better for you.

Unfortunately he's got a bug at the moment and was totally hideous yesterday, crying so much in the afternoon that he got those big sobby things that lasted when he eventually fell asleep for half an hour on my front. I was emotionally drained when it came time for his bedtime feed. Cue DS deciding to chew, hard, on me and DH coming running to the sound of my sobbing over the baby monitor. I think I scared DH, poor thing .

Anyway, sorry for the long post, but just wanted to confirm that you are not the only one struggling to keep calm.

Melonian ? I could have written your post, I am feeling exactly the same way. I do feel really sorry for my DH as our relationship beyond co-parenting is non existent these days

Galena ? your card was fabulous, can?t believe they didn?t show it what a cutie your DD is

Olivo ? great news with DD2 what?s the issue with DD1?

Hello and welcome Purplecrazyhorse

Isitmeor ? I never swore at DS but feel like I do it far too often with DD sorry to hear that DS has relapsed a bit, hope he is feeling much better soon (and that you are not too sore!)

The last couple of nights I think I have been ?dream feeding? but the wrong way round. Have gone to bed with DD asleep in her cot and then woken to find her feeding or asleep on me so have put her back into her cot only to find her back with me a few hours later it?s like Groundhog Day

Hey ladies how are you all? Can?t believe that our babies? birthdays are getting so close we have a 1st birthday party for a friend?s baby on Sat. I am pretty sure Aaliyah is going to be walking before then, she is so funny with her little walker thing, she looks like Maka Paka! Sleeping has improved marginally in that she has slept from 9pm-12am without needing us for the last couple of nights but then has still been up a few times after that. I guess Rome wasn?t built in a day! The last couple of nights I think I have been ?dream feeding? but the wrong way round. Have gone to bed with DD asleep in her cot and then woken to find her feeding or asleep on me so have put her back into her cot only to find her back with me a few hours later it?s like Groundhog Day

Will try and catch up now?

duh ignore that was meant for another thread

Hello sleep-deprived lovelies

Just popping in to say ARRRRRRRRRRGGGGGHHHHHHHH!!!

Childminder/teething has really scuppered the sleep in this household. O has been up at 5am the past week or so and awake at least twice in the night. I'm back at work a week on Monday so fingers crossed he sorts himself out soon or I might actually die. [drama queen emoticon]

Galena I can't believe they didn't show your card - bloody bastards. I'm never watching cbeebies again in protest.

BB hope the hols are going well. We MUST MUST MUST reorganise our meet up. I'm back at work on 10 May but will be off on Thursdays and Fridays so name some Thurs or Fri after 10th May you can do (next week can't do).

I can't believe my little boy is now 1. Madness.

Big sleep-deprived smooches to everyone I've missed.

Soooooo today I've shifted O's morning nap back slightly in the hope that he will then sleep a bit later in the afternoon, go to bed slightly later and wake up later than 5am. Clutching at straws? Yup. Will report back anyway.

Afternoon all!

Sleep is still illness-disrupted. DH is also under the weather so it was just me on duty last night. Not too bad as A needed help around 11pm and then not again until he woke for the day at 5.15am. Could have been worse I guess...

Anyway, this morning noticed lots of blisters on his toes. Surely his new shoes shouldn't be causing that, thinks me. Fortunately I spotted that they were also on his hands just as I was getting ready to take him back to the shoe shop to get refitted. Now think it must be hand, foot and mouth that he's got. I feel itchy all over! It's nothing to do with animal foot and mouth, btw, and isn't that serious, just uncomfortable for him.

Bicnod and BB - I was going to ask whether Its A Kids Thing in Earlsfield was any good for you two to meet up? It's a lot less manic than Jitterbugs and the soft play area is loads bigger and there's quite a large area just for those under 23 months. It costs a bit more (£4 for a two hour session), but for me the pros outweigh the cons, if it's location is accessible for you guys?

Its A Kids Thing would be fine for me, especially if we met mid/late-morning and had lunch there, then O could sleep on the way home in the buggy. Would rather not do an afternoon if we go to Earlsfield as I'll be getting the train and will end up being squashed by commuters if get late afternoon train home.

Do any of the newbies live near Wimbledon/Earlsfield and fancy coming for a natter with some fellow sleep-deprived mums?

Poor little A hope he feels better soon. Is he eating ok? You can get blisters on your tongue/inside of cheeks as well with that can't you?

Thanks Bicnod - he's not too bad, sort of comparable to teething now. I've not been able to look inside his mouth, so couldn't say about what's going on in there. But he isn't eating that well at the mo.

Let's see whether Kids Thing would work for BB. It's been really quiet when I've been there with friend from 11.30-1.30. Would that be a bit late for O's nap?

Sounds good. We're back on 2 naps a day (because of the ridiculously early starts - grrrr) so I could head up there after his morning nap. Maybe we could meet at 11am to have a bit more playtime before lunch?

Poor A - I expect poorly mouth is why he isn't eating very well. Is he drinking milk? When O had a horrible mouth ulcer I ended up topping up his meals with formula for a few days as he was barely eating anything.

Bicnod ? sorry to hear that the sleeping has gone off again I can?t bear it when they wake up really early and it?s clear that it is it for the day my DS has been doing that recently (the later he goes to sleep the earlier he wakes up!) but I am concentrating on solving DD?s issue first ? feel that that is a bigger fish to fry! There is a section in NCSS about getting them to wake up later isn?t there? Something about waking them up a little a bit before they?d normally wake up and therefore starting them on a new sleep cycle? My DD?s 1st birthday is only a few weeks away now, like you, I just can?t believe it.

IsItMeOr ? sorry to hear that both your DH and DS are unwell. Hope they are on the mend.

Weds night was awful - she slept 9-12 (seems to be getting better at that part) but was then up until 5.30am! I'd get her back down, climb back into bed and she'd start up again. Finally we both got an hour of sleep at 5.30-6.30. I was a zombie all day yesterday. Last night she was up at midnight again but then got her down at 1.30 -4.30 and then 5.30 -7.

Sorry to have been absent recently - and thanks for the nice comments about the card. I was gutted that it wasn't shown and won't be doing that ever again!

Sorry to hear there's some ropy sleeping out there at the moment. Unfortunately we're also suffering a bit. Skye's had a nasty virus for the past 2 weeks, and has a very chesty cough from it. Unfortunately it sometimes makes her cough till she's sick - once a day for the past 3 days. Wed and Thur she was sick after tea (Wed in bed at 10:30 and Thur on her highchair at teatime) so she's woken hungry a couple of times each night. However, I've been somewhat mean and simply dosed with Calpol and given water and a cuddle and, to be fair, she's gone back off to sleep after an hour or so. Here's hoping tonight's tea stays down and she sleeps!

One upshot of this is that she's napped longer - yesterday I put her down at 9.50am and she didn't wake till 12:20! This from the girl who has NEVER had longer than 1hr 45 mins before and that only rarely!

Unfortunately, since about 11 months, separation anxiety has kicked in BIG style, and I can't even leave the room to go to the loo without her screaming fit to burst. I've agreed with the childminders that live opposite that she can go over there for a couple of hours a week, so hopefully will get used to me not being there (and I'll be able to hoover round and clean the bathroom and kitchen!) I'm a bit nervous about it though as I don't like the thought of her screaming for hours.

Here's hoping everyone has a quieter night tonight. Do any of you have those blackout linings which velcro to the window so no light gets round? Are they any good? We have blackout linings on the curtains, but the light just comes round them.

Cyber hug to Melonian. I could have written something very similar this week. DS did have three much better nights last week (and I foolishly posted about them - weshould have some sort of anti-jinx rule) but the last 5 nights have been back to the same old same old. He's waking about 5 times again (and did every hour one night this week). After thinking things were improving its incredibly frustrating and I felt really down about it this week. One night I had to leave his room because I could feel myself getting cross about it all. DH went to take over whilst I had a rant to myself. Had lots of 'crap mum' thoughts. I know Mrs P talks about setbacks but his better nights now feel like total flukes. Totally know what you mean Melonian about cycling between despair and acceptance. I'm also very confused about feeding him at night (he gets 2 BF). I really don't know if he's actually hungry or its habit. He does get very upset though and won't settle until he's fed (even if DH manages to get him to sleep it will only be for an hour). I know NCSS suggests differently but I'm not having much faith that he will sleep longer without us actively trying to cut out BF at night. Really don't want to stop BF but have considered it this week. Any words of wisdom anyone?

Not wisdom, perhaps, carve, but I didn't actively try to cut out feeds - I always bfed DD when she woke at night. Then she slept through a few times. Then, when she woke we tried putting in her dummy and she'd go back to sleep for ages. Then, one night she woke and wouldn't go off to sleep again no matter what I tried. I was really flummoxed about what to try, until DH suggested a bf. She fed for a short time and then slept. Haven't had to feed her overnight since. (So once since Easter, I think)

So, we didn't force her to night wean, she did it herself at around a year of age. It's up to you what you prefer, but it worked for us. I still bf to sleep (I daren't mess with bedtime!) but that's all now.

Thanks Galena, I would much rather he do it himself. We have done DH going in and comforting until he's asleep a few times but poor DS gets so upset and I feel so bloody awful. I have always planned on BF for a year plus (was BF myself until 15 months - apparently my favourite feeding time was 5am, have since apologised to my Mum! ). DS hasn't got a dummy but I have wondered if its worth a try, although he may not take to it now (hes 8 months). My best mate is having her hen do just after his first birthday. Am sure I'll still be BF at bedtime then so god knows how thats going to work!

Galena ? poor Skye and you must have been a very tough week. Don?t think you?ve been mean at all giving her Calpol, cuddles and water. Sure that?s all her body needs when she is trying to sleep. Lots of separation anxiety here too. It?s easier when DS is around and when she has just been fed. We live in Spain and have shutters so it is very dark when DD is sleeping. Hoping that DD will self wean. DS did at 8 months ? 16 mornings on the trot I tried to feed him and he refused me and I was gutted but with hindsight, I was very lucky and I can?t see Aaliyah ever self weaning from BFing!

Carve ? I know what you mean about having to leave the room. My DH doesn?t help me in the night but sometimes I am so tired and so fed up that I put Aaliyah in her cot and tell her that Mummy needs sleep and that I can?t help her anymore as I am too tired. Eventually DH may try to help but often she cries for 2 mins or so and then I have to go back to my post. I too nearly always end up feeding her to see if that will make her go back to sleep. She won?t take a dummy either. My DS is addicted to his dummy!

Sorry there's bad sleep in the air.

We've been having some progress, of a sort. DD can now settle herself 50% of the time, and if not can usually be patted and shushed, which hasn't worked for months. She has dropped 1 night feed if we pat her but unfortunately it's the 10pm one, so no more sleep for me . At 1am and 4am she still won't settle without feeding, but I'm sure she doesn't need the calories, as weaning has gone really well, and she won't feed at 7am at all. I'm going to try and dissociate feeding from sleeping by feeding her before her bath and seeing if DH can settle her for bed. I think we'll try feeding again at 10pm and then see if DH can settle her at 1am. If this doesn't work I am quite close to making her go cold turkey for feeds at night even if it means I sleep downstairs with earplugs...oh who am I kidding? I talk the talk but I'll never see it through.

Galena, sorry about poorliness and separation anxiety, must make things hard for you. I think we're going to get those velcro blinds as well, can't make things worse can it?

Bicnod - noo things can't regress for you - you are my ray of hope that the gradual withdrawal stuff can work! Hope this is just a blip. Are you sure you aren't making it up just so you won't get kicked off the thread?

MrsM - hugs for you, sounds like you're in a low patch. It's hard when they won't settle for DH and it just ends up taking twice as long. I get really resentful when I have to do it all myself though.

Have a good bank holiday weekend, all

I have that issue with the first feed of the day, she has generally been snacking all night and isn't hungry let us know how your plan goes

Same here. Playing/looking around/grabbing my hair much more interesting than feeding first thing. Will be very interested to know how moving the feed goes Melonian, was having very similar thoughts myself the other day.

Am thinking I may have to give up BFing. I feel like a cow, she just wants to feed all night and pinch and scratch me. Any tips?

I did the controlled crying and it was a miracle cure. I didnt like the thought of it until my friend pointed out that my baby would benefit from a good nights sleep too and that it wasnt so selfish. He was 10 months and I have a third on the way and knew I had to get it sorted. I did the 3 minutes of crying then go in and comfort, then leave for 4 minutes, then go in until 10 minutes stretches. I only got to 4 minutes each time and he learnt to go back to sleep. It took a week of backwards and forwards but now he sleeps from 19.00 - 05.30. I also would wake him up from his naps in the day after 20 minutes, and fed him as much as I could so that he wouldn`t wake up hungry. the only thing is that we live in detached house but I would have felt uncomfortable doing it if we had neighbours who could hear. Hope it helps, not meant to be a smug post, just ideas xx

Can I just add that I was advised to this by my HV !!

It just doesn't work with DD, she gets so upset and then gets herself totally hyper.

Last night she slept 9-3.30 and then 6.30-9 so quite a good night really. Interesting that she actually had 3 naps yesterday, all in the buggy so her choice. 11-12, 2-3 & 6-7.

No tips MrsMcJnr but have been thinking the same this weekend and quite upset as never thought I'd even consider stopping at this point, but not sure I'm enjoying it anymore. Going to sit on it for a few days. DH did point out that we could buy some formula and have a go and that wouldn't mean I had to give up there and then & I could change my mind etc etc. Muchos and about the whole thing at the mo.