Misery loves company: to ride it out or Something Must be Done- pick your camp :)

[DreamingOfAFullNightsSleep]

Hello again all- may the sleepers continue sleeping, the new arrivals due or here get the idea very quickly and the rest of us see the light at the end of the tunnel!

I think her methods are very sound peregrin She doesn't expect miraculous results. when we started we made goals and due to dt1's reflux we specifically didn't set sleeping through as a goal (though it'd be nice). I have improved bedtimes (achieved with dt1 and as I say I think dt2 is under tired) and him.being in his own bed at night as my main goals. I really hope it continues as it did for elph We did longer in preparation. 4 weeks to build up to nights. dt1 always used to puke at bedtime, reliably for a year or so. Horrible to watch and comfort and clear up so he has lots of negative associations of pain and vomiting at bedtime we've had to overcome. She doesn't go for a quick fix and has followed how comfortable I am to move on too (though I've done what she's said, I've not been a pain, honestly, but I have been concerned about being very unwilling to continue through any crying as it's a reflux trigger for him. thank goodness he hasn't cried). She also said it wouldn't be worth doing anything but the 6 weeks with him, which I was going to do anyway as that's what elph did. Hooray for her answering your form!!

Dreaming - that sounds fantastic! A whole night with just the two of you in your bed - must feel great that all the work you've done is giving results!

Interesting about making cot a nice place to be - ours is in our room anyway, but DS does seem to be easier to get down on our bed than in his own.

Slept through! He woke at 5:40 but settled himself while I nipped to the loo in preparation for time on his floor before the nightlight came on. Astounded

WOOOOOOOO HOOOOOOOO!!!

ooo... good job Dreaming! super excited for you :o

I'm sorry to say ellie but i think pretty much all of us had resigned ourselves to co-sleeping by that age. I even bought a super king sized bed as it became clear that dd was not going to sleep in her own room. DD is now 2 years 4 months

For what it's worth we haven't done any sleeping on the floor at all. We still operate a policy of allowing her to just come through herself and climb into her bed if she wakes in the night. All the same, since we have started the gradual withdrawal dd has now started sleeping in her bed until past 5am most nights. She still wanders in earlier occasionally but I think the few times she did last week were due to the new teeth. We have even had a few times of having to go and wake her up. Unheard off before this.

We haven't paid for Ann, just copied what Elph did but adjusted for our own preferences. So no night light, or stairgates on the door, and no sleeping on the floor. I am happy to admit that this has almost certainly made the process slower but it works for us at the moment.

hmm, thanks Hearmyroar.

Co-sleeping doesn't work for us. I have tried previously, and unsuccessfully!
Partly because baby thinks being with us=playtime and just rolls about laughing crazily. I tried pretending to be asleep... it worked, he fell asleep but woke up and started pulling my hair and sticking his hands in my mouth about half an hour later! Doesn't look for boob, just wants to play... It is quite funny and cute, but won't get anyone any sleep!

However, I get no sleep at all if he's in bed. I unfortunately still have back and pelvis issues post pregnancy, and my range of sleeping positions are rather limited for this reason, and I still need to sleep with a body pillow, and shift positions quite often which doesn't really work with him in the bed.

I think mine is too young to do what Elph did, so maybe I just have to ride it out until he's older. That said, last night he randomly slept 8.15pm-5am with no wakeup, and went back down until 8am after some boob. If he can do that most of the time I'll be well happy.

I had given him some banana just before bath time yesterday, so did again tonight in the hope that it is some sort of magic sleep-fruit. Unlikely I know...

We don't have stairgates, but did do the rest. I have had a terrible godawful bedtime tonight where one of the biggest problems was me having lost my temper and got really cross and snappy.

I has tried lots of things first but never got anywhere really, he really hadn't improved much over the previous 6 months... ! crossing everything I haven't cocked it all up by being so awful at bedtime tonight.
yes. by 6 months I was at the end of my tether and doing an 'anything goes' approach

ellie Banana is a 'magical sleep fruit' as it happens! Bananas and milk are two highly recommended pre-bed foods for that reason

oh wow ellie, stuff him with banana!!!

elph, help, major regression here, another night on his floor, (12-3:15, finally made it back to my beed, then back with him from 5:15-6:15 on) he refuses to go to sleep without me out of the room again, DT2 dreadful at bedtime- enjoying 'getting out and winding your parents up' game way, way too much. I've got a sudden fear of failing...

You'll get a few regressions during the process, usually around day three or day five of each routine adjustment - just stick with what you're supposed to be doing and stay consistent!

But he won't contemplate lying down and going to sleep Elph - even in there for ages he's calling for me all the bloody time. I put him in bed, he gets out. Or gets really worked up. dh had a 14 hour day yesterday (as they do all staff meetings in the evening so he was chairing a meeting 6:30 pm onwards) so I can't have him wake the whole house. Sleep chat with Ann today so hopefully she'll whip us into shape.

and same at bedtime elph he's put up more resistance than ever before in the process last 2 nights. It's hard going at the minute.

Co-sleeping is unbelievably sweaty at the moment - but will DS lie down on his own, or even next to me? I think we all know the answer to that...

Getting a fan tomorrow, so hopefully there's only on sweaty night left.

Sorry to hear about the regression Dreaming, hopefully Ann can sort it out!

Ellie, ours are about the same age but the banana trick only got us four hours' sleep - very, very good for DS though! Might change my plans for dinner tonight...

scandi as elph says I'm pretty sure thaat it's me cocking it up. The trouble is at bedtime if we do what we should with DT2 he goes bonkers so DT1 can't get to sleep. If DT1 wails and makes a fuss, we've no chance of getting DT2 to sleep. DH worked a 14 hour day yesterday and has another long day today so I just can't have him up for hours if DT1 wakes everyone up in the night. Sure Ann will get us back on track as now i've come to more I can see that we have still made huge progress, I've not had to go back to hand holding, we've still got him in his own bed all night, all is not lost. Dt2 is still mostly sleeping through. It'll come right

and maybe a fan with its added white noise effect will make all the difference?! White noise orked a real treat getting my DT2 to sleep through!!

*worked

Sorry to hear of regressions and sweatiness.

We were back to 3.5hrly wakeups last night. First one just gone midnight, settled with no feed in 10 mins with white noise and mucho bum-patting. Second I fed as it was hot I figured he may be thirsty.
Bedtime was a nightmare though. Made a whole new thread about it in the hope of someone having useful suggestions for my rolly little -monster- darling
But I didn't give him banana before bed, because I think too much banana had got him all bunged up yesterday... maybe I'll try again tonight.

Oi, there was some non-sleeper recruitment or what? Sorry to see you all coming here but " misery likes company" so you're in the right place and lovely company

DS1 sleeps through the night, DS2 wakes up for a feed/nappy change. Keeping my fingers crossed it's going to stay this way-DS1 was colicky refluxy nightmare for the first few months, then a sleep refuser. This time it looks like we got a better version of a baby :)

Sorry to not keep up with you, can read the thread while bf in the night but can't type. DS2 cluster feeds in the evening so the day finishes around 10:30 pm for him with the next feed around midnight then 3-4am and 6ish DS1 is ready to go. Tired a bit but things could be worse.

Take care ladies, not forgetting you but really no time to write

Dreaming 6:30 meetings are evil. I am impressed you are managing this well. I find it hard not to get snappy, let alone be loving, when we are all so stretched and definitely no chance of babymaking activities

Hope you are now armed with support from Ann.

scandi and ellie do you give water to your DCs during the sweaty nights? I wonder if I should be doing that, but then it would take longer to settle DS back to sleep (it doesn't help that he won't take a bottle stubborn little monkey)

Bald, this augurs well! Well done to polite DS2.

Elph since you work outside the home full time, how did that mesh with working on naps? Was it enough to do the foundation work etc on weekends, or did your childcare participate in the sleep work? My DS is looked after by my mother during the day now, which could be a good thing if only I could trust her to cooperate.

Hello to scandi, Ellie and peregrine, sorry you are experiencing sleep deprivation welcome to the padded room where we rock silently contemplating our next move.

Dreaming glad to hear of some progress even if there have been a few set backs.

Elph sounds like ds is doing really well and just in time.

Bald glad you are having a better time of it second time around.

Sounds like it is going well for you hear

Well school holidays are here which takes the time pressure off a bit and means dd1 and dd2 can play together. Unfortunately dd2 is either Ill or teething and ds is now teething too. The last 3 nights have been ds waking 2 hourly due to heat/teeth/wind plus dd2 waking around 3/4am and screaming in pain until ibuprofen/paracetamol kicks in followed by writhing in our bed for two hours at which point it is time to get up. Last night dd1 also ended up in our bed and DH had to sleep on the sofa bed with dd2. Day times are tough because ds does not want to be put down and keeps waking up as soon as I put him down for a nap. I ate lunch standing up with him on my hip today as I just needed to eat having missed breakfast altogether in order to make playgroup ( my only break from the constant "muuuummmmeeee" demands).

Oh help stitch sounds exhausting. I'd have chosen playgroup too for a break- except dt1 won't move from my side/arms there but still, at least he's not snatching stuff from.his brother or sister...! My dts only napped in the buggy and only if it was moving so there was a good deal of marching round the village eating a sandwich while I went- if dh was home. Harder if I took all 3 as the triple was too hard to push one handed unless on the flat! Does he sleep in a buggy? Only useful for any sitting down and rocking/eating if it fits in your kitchen though ours didn't

DH has saved me. I was on the brink of losing all reason and he did the whole night. He has a teaching session this afternoon though so he'll finish early but he looks knackered. The whole night was good though- only one wakeup from dt1 and one middle of the night poo which dd told me about first thing. She came to ask if she could get dt1 up and sent both back to bed to wait for their lights to come on. Except timer switches aren't hugely accurate so hers came on then we both went and waited by his door for his to come on. For the audience (dd) dt1 lay down and closed his eyes and pretended to be asleep for a couple of minutes until he heard it click on Doesn't do that for me!! So, I'm human again and very pleased he let dh settle him in the night despite an undisclosed amount of time on the landing for dh

Is your dd2 still waiting to have her adenoids out stitch or is this illness unrelated? Hope she's better soon.

Morning people.

Last night was officially the worse night since he was born.
First wakeup 45mins after going to sleep.
Then up from 12.45-3.45. He kept almost falling asleep, but turning over and waking himself up and crying after 2 mins. He would keep still with bum-patting, but after doing that constantly for 30 mins and having RSI in my wrist I stopped, thinking I must be safe. Oh no, within a minute he was awake and crying again. 3 times I came back to bed thinking he was asleep. 3 times he was crying again by the time my head hit the pillow.
My back is flippin killing me from bending over his cot almost constantly for 3 hours.

THis is the time that I start to consider doing controlled crying/cry-it-out. Because I'm pretty sure that left do his own devices he would not have cried for 3 hours before giving up and going to sleep.

Peregrin Yes, I only did the foundation work evenings and weekends and it obviously worked fine. I happened to be off work sick (pg-related) for much of the programme with Ann, but DS still went to nursery during the day as he would have done if I had been at work. Just to spite me, he naps like clockwork at nursery - they get the beds out, he lies down, he goes to sleep, the end . I think Hear and I had a joint fume about this many moons ago when she discovered her DD was the same. We never had to do anything with getting them involved because he was fine there and napped within 'Ann-approved' parameters. His naps at weekends are still mainly in the pram or car on our way somewhere so we can do something with the weekend. If I get him to nap in his bed, I have to factor in a bit of a tussle because he's not keen at all on going down (although he'll usually go down eventually which he never would have done pre-Ann), plus a very long nap, because, ironically, he's now sleeping so well in his bed, which means bedtime ends up being much later. It's less hassle and makes for a more productive weekend to just carry on with car TBH.

Ugh, stitch. We couldn't afford three, but I just need to read yours and Dreaming's posts to convince me out of any fond thoughts I might have about having a third. Sounds exhausting.

Glad to hear things are going well Bald

Ellie Not being judgey at all, but just as a warning, CC/CIO is not the magical panacea for all babies it's made out to be. I tried both, to the letter, for weeks at a time with DS with no change whatsoever. Actually, there was a change - he got worse. If you do choose to try it, that's fine, but be prepared for it not to work in the magical three days everyone else seems to spout about.

Well, DS2 has most definitely turned the right direction now. I've got my final scan and final decision tomorrow as to whether to proceed with the ELCS booked for the 4th. I've decided that if his head is engaged, I think I'm going to have to try for VBAC (?maybe see if they'll induce on the 4th), since it was the head not engaging that was the reason for CS with DS1, so there would be no medical reason to proceed with it for DS2. If his head still hasn't engaged, I'll just go for the ELCS.

Elph, in one way, having a choice sounds trickier... I had a messy delivery and in retrospect, I'd have preferred an ELCS. Pregnant me was all gung-ho about yoga breathing and such, though...

No fan today either - bloody Dyson! It's been months waiting for them to sort out their own recall, not impressed.

Don't think the noise would make a difference though - have an app on all night anyway