Misery loves company: to ride it out or Something Must be Done- pick your camp :)

[DreamingOfAFullNightsSleep]

Hello again all- may the sleepers continue sleeping, the new arrivals due or here get the idea very quickly and the rest of us see the light at the end of the tunnel!

Oh dear time I think you may be breaking the 1st rule of no-sleep club with your fabulous tales of sleeping children. Ssshhhh... They read all... They wait until you think it's all sorted and then they strike

Cough is OK now elph. She gave it to me instead the little minx

Sorry to hear about your vomit attacks.

Dd's still mucking about with her nap so bedtimes are all over the place. Currently anytime between 6 and 9pm. She is also being super clingy, which is driving me a bit bonkers.

Have any of you ever co-slept with a baby and a toddler at the same time? I may be looking down the barrel of that tonight. DH is working away. I'm co-sleeping with DS2 usually from before midnight ATM and it would appear that DH has been taking the easy option with DS1 and taken him into bed with him the last few nights when he's woken up. Sigh. I don't blame him - DS1 is lovely to co-sleep with these days now that he's over the hair-pulling (not that that's s problem for DH...) and he's out for the rest of the night when you do it, but the inconsistency will make things difficult for me if/when he wakes up tonight.

I plan on sleeping between them obvs - DS1 under the covers with me, DS2 in his sleeping bag on top of the covers on the other side, bed guards up on both sides. Is there anything unforeseen that I should know about??

Its official. My DC are trying to finish me off and they're working together on their evil masterplan.

DD2 slept 8 - 5 without a peep. Quick feed, straight back down till 7.30. DD1 however was awake for 2 hours from 12 till 2, had to go in 5 times to stop her shouting (in case she woke DD2) then she woke hourly till DD2 got up and woke her for the day. Actually fell over last night from tiredness. Landed with a bump on DD1s floor. Weeped a little.

Today is a whole bar of Green and Blacks day, I can tell already.

Elph, yes have done a few times when everything has gone horribly wrong. Pretty much as you describe although only have a guard on one side so just put a pillow on the other side of DD1. Generally they sleep on an arm each side so I end up pinned down in the most uncomfortable way. But hey, its sleep of a sort so I'll take it thanks.

Hear, I sympathise re bedtimes. Generally they're around 7.30 - 8 but if DD1 has had so much as 10 minutes sleep in the afternoon, she'll be awake anything up to 10pm. She has more staying power than I do thats for sure.

Jesus Chocolate, they're in cahoots aren't they? All of em.

Just found my new favourite quote about sleep deprivation on another thread:

You can do a lot more than you realise when sleep-deprived. You just won't remember any of it.

Or your name on a particularly bad day. A delivery driver just rang the bell and asked if we were number 12 or 14 (e.g.). I honestly couldn't remember for about 30 seconds.

chocolate hope you got your green and blacks, I'd already eaten a malteaser bunny by 8 am .

elph I've never co slept with both the DDs together, good luck!

hear I remember that stage of desperately hoping DD1 wouldn't nap at all as bedtime took forever, so much easier when she hit 2.3 and we no longer got even a whiff of a nap and she'd be asleep by 645. Ah, good times, why did I have a second?

Love DD2 to bits but she's been awake since 430 and has managed 3 half hour naps today. After 4 hours I've managed to get another 20 mins out of her so far but I'm hiding in the dark in our bedroom while DD1is stuck in front of a DVD downstairs, I feel like a right rubbish mum today.

It is good advice about not being complacent, I realise that the next lot of teething could throw everything down the toilet!

Elph - the 5th day is today!!! But that is really good to know and he prepared for, one bad night doesn't necessarily mean that it has all gone wrong.

I guess for me as we were stuck in suck a cycle of feeding to sleep and I was so bound by it, it feels so freeing to suddenly feel that we have changed things and maybe u won't still be feeding her to sleep at 18 after all!
Scotty - you are certainly not a bad mum. You are just shattered. Everyone needs a break, it is so hard to just keep going. If the DVD gives you a bit of head space then that is a good thing

Hear- I lurked on this thread for a while. I probably should have posted then but I was not in a good place, I was pretty much ready to throw myself under a bus I was so exhausted. But you are right, sorry I shouldn't pop on here just as DD starts to sleep! It has been good to hear of others' experiences with sleep training though.

Scotty, I certainly did, I keep a large emergency stash...

You are not a bad mum (or if you are, then so are 95% of other mums, me included!). DD1 never watched any TV until she was 18 months and I was six months pregnant with DD2 and shattered. Since then she has watched a lot! More on bad days, not so much on good days. I figure that as long as there is also plenty of other play and fresh air, TV is not going to hurt. She's currently watching frozen for about the millionth time while I cook tea and DD2 is napping - bliss! In fact, I'm really looking forward to DD2 getting into TV a bit more. Now that's bad parenting for you

Time, we just don't want you to get over-excited. Sleep has been (and is!) a long, hard road for us and we've had many, many setbacks. Its great that your DD seems to be responding well to the training - we don't begrudge graduates from this thread even if we are completely

Thanks everyone, having a bad day but going to try to be a bit more positive. Time good luck for breaking the fifth night curse!

Sorry time I didn't mean to make you feel bad. We ask live hearing about people who manage to get a bit of sleep. My post was meant in a light hearted fashion. We developed the 1st rule of no sleep club many years ago (from horrific experience) and I sorry of forget we have newer folks who haven't been around so long, so have no idea what I am jabbering on about. Please blame the lack of sleep :o

Scotty I do wish she would just drop the darn thing. I thought we had it sorted until she got I'll last week. No I feel bad if we don't let her sleep, but regret it horribly when we have a rubbish bedtime like tonight. To think I spent so much time trying to get her to nap not so long ago

Good god, my typing has gone all to shit. I'm off to bed before it gets worse!

hear I was quite lucky that DD1 genuinely needs/needed less sleep than most so could get to the end of a day in a cheerful mood with no nap from a young age, its much harder when they need the sleep and are ratty without it (step forward DD2!). Soon the napping stage will pass altogether, hope it comes soon for you!

time how did it go?

Hear - you didn't offend me at all! I am also keen to not offend any sleep deprived people!

Scotty - erm... She slept 8-8
Of course this means when she stops sleeping again I will feel like utter shit as my body has finally remembered how to sleep!

Wow. We have never had 12 hours straight. DS1 will sleep through once or twice a week (or as/when it suits him ) but 11 hours is the closest we've ever got to the mythical 7-7.

Hear Does she just get too tired and strung-out without it still? I am so glad to be rid of that bastard nap. Only a very short time before we're back to planning our lives around it, though, with DS2.

Didn't need to co-sleep with both last night, thank Christ. After a slightly traumatic bedtime that did require several seconds of my hands applied to my face while they both wailed, the night was relatively uneventful. Not unbroken by any stretch, but surprisingly manageable.

time wow! We've had one 11.5 stretch in nearly 3.5 years but like elph 11 is generally the most we get. Wow!

Hello all....goodness it's been busy here. Glad to hear of all those having sleep success and hope you are now a vomit free household again Elph.

Not much to report here, still on a few wake ups a night although did have a lovely night earlier this week where she only woke once. DH helpfully woke me fidgeting to ensure I didn't get adjusted to having a normal amount of sleep.

Had a half hearted go at offering water instead of milk last night. DD pushed the cup away, pointed at my boobs and said "muh". Clearly more effort will be required!

Time, are you still getting 12 hour nights? if so after only a few days of sleep training! DD1 at nearly 3 will do an unbroken 11/12 hour stint 3 or 4 times a week (assuming no illness!) but it's taken us a long time to get here with many set backs along the way! DD2 has some way to go too!

I reckon it bodes well for your DS2 though Elph.

DD2 has been a bit better again since two horrendous nights of sitting and holding her hand for two plus hours from 3am while she wailed at me. She's managed an 8-5 stretch a few times now but still not consistently.

But DD1 has had a temp for the last two nights and now DD2 has a very snotty nose and can't sleep. I predict a fun night!

Then next week DD2 has her jabs...

Strawberry, night weaning is very hard! My rule (now) is no feeds until at least 5. But I've broken it a couple times recently out of sheer desperation!

Glad you're having success time, fingers crossed it continues!

Raspberry we're much the same here including one lovely night where he slept from 8:20ish to 6:45 which was our best night since last June. However as is typical the number of wakes gradually increased and we're back to around 3. Infinitely better than the previous week or so's shenanigans but not great! I've never got as far as offering water at night, I could just imagine the response that would get

Chocolate I hope tonight is not as bad as you expect.
Elph I hope you are now a vomit free house too.
Good luck everyone!

Well having spent two hours sitting with DD2 I just had time to clean my teeth and get into bed before DD1 woke. Calpol administered but sleep location negotiations have not exactly gone my way so my travelling duvet and I are currently on the floor in DD1s room waiting for her to go to sleep. Unfortunately calpol seems to have the same effect on DD1 that a double expresso does on me. Could be a long night on mumsnet

Hope that you managed to get some sleep Chocolate and that they are not too poorly. Calpol seems to have the same effect on my DD, seems to make her bounce off the walls. I tell myself it's because it makes her feel so much better. I'm doing similar to you and have instituted a no feeds on first wake up rule which was ok last night. Then she woke at 545, had a big feed, fell asleep again and I am now wide awake which is annoying as Friday is my day off!

Funnily enough Attitude she often asks for water at night especially if she is allowed to drink it from my glass. Her cup is almost always rejected! Occasionally she even goes back to sleep afterwards but usually wants milk as well.

Some of you must be starting with Ann very soon, am looking forward to hearing about all your transformed children

I had my initial chat with Ann yesterday, felt hopeful at the time but still struggling, especially with naps. We've always done a sling nap in the house first thing to let me sit at the table and play with DD1, used to be guaranteed at least an hour, then she started only doing 20-30 mins now she's not going off at all, screaming and hitting me in the sling which is so distressing for both of us. Just don't know what to do, she's finally fallen asleep now but it's attached to the boob and she rarely manages more than 20 mins like this and is more dozing than actually sleeping, and it's over 3 hours since she woke. DD1 in front of her third peter rabbit this morning and saw me shouting at DD2 feeling like the world's worst mum again but being driven mad by the naps, it's worse than the night time sleep!

Urghhh up for 2hrs 20mins with him in the middle of the night. He was awake for an hour and three quarters and then I couldn't get him in to bed for a while. Was sooo tired. Should have given him calpol or ibuprofen but he didn't seem poorly, just awake. We have had almost the full spectrum this week it seems.

Scotty you have my sympathies. Ds was a 30m napper for months and months and then lengthened them all on his own, hopefully this will happen for you. They are not perfect as the morning nap (now dropped) was on me and afternoon nap in the buggy but the lengths were good at least. Of course I don't have an older one too, it must be tough.

Raspberry I hope you have a good day off. Going back to sleep at 5:45 is pretty good, here that would mean up for the day!

I've pretty much finished all the paperwork for Ann. I'm both excited to start and apprehensive about what it will entail and how upset he might get. Still we can't go on like this indefinitely.