Misery loves company: to ride it out or Something Must be Done- pick your camp :)

[DreamingOfAFullNightsSleep]

Hello again all- may the sleepers continue sleeping, the new arrivals due or here get the idea very quickly and the rest of us see the light at the end of the tunnel!

DH has The Lurgy. I have a migraine. DS2 was up his customary amount. Today we have toddler rugby and swimming for each of the boys. Today is going to be AWE-soooooome.

Dd seems fine here. I feel flipping awful though. Full of snot, coughing, head ache, sneezing, urgh.

Dh is off to the football this afternoon so trying to think of low energy things to do with dd that don't just resort to watching films all afternoon.

Hear and Elphaba poor you, there's nothing worse than childcare with a headache

The good news is, DS1 appears to have dropped his nap That bastard has been the bane of the weekend and non-nursery days forever. It's going to save us SO MUCH in petrol money apart from anything else.

The bad, but not even remotely surprising, news is that moving DS2 into his own room has not made one iota of difference to his sleep. All we're doing is playing musical beds now. I put him down wide awake in his cot. He smiles prettily at me as I turn out his light and watches me as I leave the room, then is asleep in seconds. Then he does a two, maybe three hour stretch before he starts waking hourly, re-settling only for boob, at which point I bring him into the co-sleeper cot. Once the hourly wake-ups become half-hourly, I take him into the front bedroom to co-not-sleep fully so I can at least stay lying down.

And, just like DS1 at the same age, he hasn't the slightest interest in solid food so I can't even find out if that makes any difference it won't

God, the end of February when we start working with Ann feels like a long way away...

Funnily enough I was just talking to DH about forcing ds to drop his morning nap. His awake time has lengthened so much that coupled with his longer after lunch nap there isn't enough time for him to have 2 naps and get him to bed at a decent time. The last 2 nights he has gone to sleep at 8pm which is too late for him and means I don't get much of an evening since we are still having to go to bed quite early.

It also generally takes at least 30m to get him to sleep for naps and last 2 nights it's been an hour to get him to bed. He's tired but obviously not tired enough!

So I was thinking that I give him lunch around 11:30 and aim to get him asleep by 12:30 and awake by 2:30 (today he didn't wake until 15:50 as he didn't go to sleep until late). It will be a bit tricky as he does still get tired in the morning. I'm also a bit worried that it means I won't have a daytime social life anymore .

I'd be grateful for any advice from those with older dc.

Elph, frustrating that moving ds2 to his own room didn't help. It didn't for us either. We moved him at around 5 months at the worst of his regression in the vain hope it would help. Also because I thought we may as well do it while he was already unsettled.

Commiserations to all of those with colds and coughs. DS is still v snotty and also has a cough. Poor boy sounds quite hoarse. Am hoping it will improve after a few more days when he will then pick up another one.

Fingers crossed for a good night for everyone. We've already had one wake up.

Accidentally gave dd oats yesterday. Serves me right for buying flouncy bread flour with seeds and crap in instead of the cheap stuff I usually get.

So a night of wriggly, farty, whimpering misery for us last night and nobody to blame except myself.

I think the morning nap may be part of our bedtime issues too, Attitude. We were out for the day yesterday and she slept 1115 until 1200 and then sort of dozed but didn't properly drop off for around half an hour from 3.15 ish. Both in pushchair. When we got home I gave her a very quick tea and she was asleep within twenty minutes and by 7. Shame it didn't last

I actually thought she was getting ready to drop the second nap around her birthday but she definitely still needs something as she's getting really grumpy by the time she's been up three hours or so, although distraction helps. Plus, she rarely sleeps for more than 45 minutes so I think it will be two short naps for a while yet until she can manage on one short one! You don't sound like you have this issue so would be tempted to give your proposal a try. You might find with the right timing you can reduce the time to settle, that's definitely been the case for us.

Hear, hope your DD is feeling better today.

Still feeling dreadful here and we're off for lunch with ILs soon.

Oh no Hear, I hope today has been better for you and dd.

Raspberry we went to the IL's today too!

I had intended to trial the one nap idea tomorrow but we inadvertently started today. We decided to drive there when he would normally have his morning nap but he didn't sleep. He got a bit whingy late morning but was ok when distracted. He ate a pretty good lunch then was asleep two minutes after we left and slept for two hours until we woke him up. Still took 45m to get him down tonight but it was an improvement and he was much calmer with less faffing around.

So far so good...

Checking in and catching up!
Elpha your DC2s sleep pattern sounds very similar to my DC3. We had our phone consultation with sleep lady last week and have our detailed plan. Have gone with a few tweaks to routine and then a 'gradual reduction' method to wean him off night feeding and co sleeping. Bit daunted but DH and I are going to split the night so we both get some sleep....
Hope all the poorly ones get better soon and everyone gets some sleep.

attitude your early lunch and nap time sounds perfect for a LO going down to one nap

Thanks calm, I hope the sleep work goes well.

Elph, DD1 has dropped her nap too. However, in a few short weeks we seem to have gone from it being vital that DD1 has at least an hour and a half otherwise all hell breaks loose to it being vital that she doesn't sleep at all during the day otherwise she's up till 10 o'bloody clock. I have gone to bed before her on several occasions. Car journeys are therefore very tricky - she slept for 20 minutes today on the way home from a monster day out - birthday party with bouncy castles, lunch with lots of friends and their kids, decent length walk. She's now bouncing around her bedroom loudly playing and giggling at her toys...

Own bedroom is still not making any difference to DD2's sleep either. She was up from 11.30 till 12.30 and 2 am till 4 am last night. Think it might have been teeth as she finally settled after Calpol. Then up at 5.30 for a feed, then DD1 woke screaming for the second time so ended up in our bed at 6. Its frustrating because I know DD2 can actually do a decent stretch. Its just never when I have the chance to be asleep as well!

Solids? Pah, DD2 is a monster eater. She eats way more than DD1 at that age, and a fair bit more than DD1 eats now. Does it make a difference? Does it heck! Just like rolling, crawling, walking, talking, going to baby groups, childminder, fresh air, cutting naps, extra naps and just about every other bastard thing that people have told me will definitely make a difference to their sleep...

Attitude and Raspberry, I can't remember exactly when DD1 went to 1 nap, but I do remember doing everything to get her to sleep for a decent length of time, including lying next to her cot and shushing and back rubbing/hand-holding etc every time she moved an inch. After a few weeks she settled into a longer nap but not at bloody night time sadly. DD2 has generally been a better napper from the start. She has just turned 1 and some days has 1 nap, and other days 2. She generally likes a lie-in till 7.30/8 so usually has snack at 11, then sleep at 11.30, lunch after nap at 1.30. If she's cranky in the afternoon, she might have another sleep at 4 - 4.30 ish for 45 minutes or so. Its best if she's up by 5 or not long after for an 8pm bedtime.

That was the pattern I followed with DD1 until she dropped her nap recently. I found that gave us time to do something briefly in the morning like a class (as long as it didn't run too late as if DD1 fell asleep in the car, she couldn't be transferred to a cot. When she got to 2 I was usually able to put her in the pushchair and walk around the drive briskly for a bit then she would stay asleep), but meant that we had a reasonable length afternoon to go and do stuff like meet friends or go to the park.

Right, I'm ignoring the vast pile of washing demanding my attention and going to bed!

Good luck all!

Oh I remember from DD1 how hard it is when naps are dropped, but I also remember how brilliant life became when she gave up napping altogether (at 3 months past 2) as we no longer had to plan the day around naps and bedtime became 630! Good luck to all managing this. DD1 dropped the afternoon nap first when going from 2 to 1 and gradually moved the morning one forwards.

We're still having frequent waking, 1-2 hours at the beginnning of the night, 10-20 mins at a time at the end of the night . DD1 has abandoned sleeping through to wake for 2 hours at a time scared of monsters . Anyone dealt with that? Ideas?

Sorry Scotty I can't help you there. I hope she gets through her fears quickly for you.

Chocolate, sorry you're having a rough time. I hope that things improve for you too.

We had only 2 wakes last night which was an improvement from 4 the previous night. Today I stuck with the 1 nap plan, easy today as we have a class on Mondays which I am usually rushing around to get out on time for because of the morning nap being on me. I could see he was a bit tired but he coped and wasn't grumpy at all. After an early lunch I took him out for a walk and he was asleep within 5 mins which was fantastic. Usually I have to traipse around for at least half an hour before he nods off. I walked him for an hour so we both got some fresh air and he's now asleep in the buggy and I'm collapsed on the sofa .

So it looks like this might be a good thing to continue with but probably too soon to say for sure.

Gah, ds up five times last night. I was awake from 2-5 am as he woke hourly and just wanted to stay on the boob, just got back to sleep when he woke again at 5:20. At that point I gave up and sent DH in so ds was then up for the day but at least I got a bit more sleep. So, two naps today will be needed and hopefully back on track tomorrow...

Attitude I sympathise, DD did a 2 hour stint which got me excited but then woke every 10-30 mins till 5, couldn't get help from DH as he'd been up for 3 hours with DD1 who was scared of everything from an animal picture on her wall to the light switch .

Sorry you had a rubbish night Attitude, it is often one step forwards and two back in my experience! (Plus posting anything positive on this thread does tend to have a negative effect on sleep - they read it y'know, and punish us!)

Could it be teething causing him to be awake so much? Boob is such a comfort I think when they are in pain. Hope you get a rest when DS naps.

Scotty, I know Dreaming has had recent issues with nightmares with her DD1 but don't know how she is getting on now - Dreaming, are you out there?!

DD1 doesn't verbalise her nightmares yet, we just get tears. Things I find helpful are talking books (she has stories on every night when she goes to sleep) and her stars projector which she can put on herself. If she has a bad dream I go in and give her a cuddle and put both of those on for her. Sometimes it works and she settles back down, sometimes it doesn't and she ends up in our bed. I know some people with slightly older children than my DD1 that have had success with "monster spray" or "clearing the bedroom of monsters" before bed.

Scotty you had a much worse night than me, I feel like a lightweight complaining.

Chocolate it could well be teething which is usually the culprit for the worst nights along with a cold. I can't see any more through but his last top two are still only partially erupted so could have been moving again. I'm not looking forward to the nightmares stage at all.

He slept for 40 mins this morning, fairly early nap as he woke early. Still took half an hour of walking to get him to sleep after lunch. I will wake him at 3 if he's still sleeping to try and get him down relatively early tonight. That's the plan anyway...

Who knew this was going to be so tricky, I can't wait to start work with Ann. Interestingly we saw the health visitor today and she said they had new research and no longer advocate CC/CIO which is good to hear.

Attitude you're not being a lightweight! It was a bad night even for us and my DD is probably younger than your DS. Let me know how you go with Anne, and if you're taken early as it will give me hope that we might be too!

Chocolate star projector might help, though knowing our luck it would just be another thing she'd say she's scared of!

I hope you have a better night tonight Scotty.

Not sure what will happen here, he's had a slight temperature and been a bit whingy this afternoon.

Hoping that you all get a few hours decent stretch tonight.

I think DD has yet another cold as she will now only sleep for more than an hour when I'm holding her upright or walking in the pram. its killing my back and I've got a weird ache in my hips too

I've tried all the so called treatments like saline drops, olbas oil, humidifier, changing the temperature in the room and nothing seems to make any difference. even the magic snot sucker isn't having any effect. help!

Oooooh the bastard Lurgy's getting me Don't need this on top of DS2's night antics. He was awake three times last night between 1am and 2am alone. I lost count either side of that. Had an initial chat with Ann yesterday. Since I am already a disciple of her methods, she reckons we might only need a three week programme. Can't come soon enough. Can't say I'm looking forward to doing a sleep diary. It will only depress me.

No idea felkov. DS1 had one particular cold that nearly killed me at the time. Since I'm still here, I guess I got through it, but it can only have been through sheer bloody-mindedness.

DD2 slept through last night. 8pm until 5.30am for the first time ever! Shhhh, don't tell anyone!

nothing to see here, DD1 up to usual antics of refusing to go to sleep until 10pm and getting up at 6.30am with a little bit of yelling in the middle of the night. A maximum of 8 hours sleep a night is definitely not enough judging by the total meltdown we get late afternoon and evening. Putting her to bed earlier seems to result in an even later night as she is more wide awake than ever. Debating whether to try and put her down for a nap today as she has pre-school this afternoon and is just too tired to be able to cope. But worried she'll then be up till bloody midnight!

Elph, that's good news about Ann thinking 3 weeks will be enough to clone train DS2. How is DS1 getting on?

Sorry to hear about all the lurgy going around. We seem to be over ours for now but are still surrounded by people sniffing and sneezing so no doubt its just a breather before the next onslaught.

felkov have you tried propping the mattress up at the head end? We use towels under the mattress in a wedge shape whenever there's snottiness. And a few drops of olbas oil on a tissue under the cot sheet.

Also do you have a sling or carrier? I have a babyhawk buckle carrier and can carry DD2 much more comfortably (we've done several 2 hour+ walks) on my front or back than I can holding her on my hip. Or could you rock the pram while sitting down (preferably at a cafe with a large hot drink of your choice, topped with whipped cream and an enormous slice of cake on the side...)?

Chocolate, shhhhhh

Elphaba, sorry you're getting the lurgy. It's miserable being ill when you can't even sleep.

Felkov no additional suggestions I'm afraid. In my experience there's a rough night or two with colds and then it improves gradually. Hopefully this will be the case for you.

We had an even worse night last night. Ds woke at midnight with a fairly high temperature and was up and down all night really just wanting to sleep on me. I think it's jab related as it does say symptoms including a temp can present 6-10 days in. Really hoping tonight is better.

Sorry to hear so many people are feeling rotten. DD1 has an ear infection, getting treated now, hope it might explain some of the up for 3 hour shenanigans. DD2 up to her same waking after 10 minutes antics.

Chocolate I'll pretend I didnt hear you while secretly shouting yipee!