Sleep Nightmares Part III: At 3am No-One Can Hear You Scream

[CountBapula]

I've been moaning about documenting my 8 mo DS's 'challenging' sleep patterns on MN since he was three weeks old. He's still waking every 2-3 hours at least and the other thread's full, so here's a shiny new one for all you parents of hardcore sleep refusenik babies.

Who's with me?

thanks count. sorry for the poor me whinge :)

well after dt2 chose a 3 nap day and dt1 a 2 nap day (which actually worked ok), our night has begun as badly as the last two :( the next 5 nights we're away and they need to sleep in cots all night... this will either magically fix all our sleep troubles or finally break me. not sure which!

wishing you all lots of sleep this week.

Poor you Mama. I hope everything is fine with the tests. I don't think you ever need to apologize here for feeling low. It's damn hard to be cheery on bugger all sleep having listened to your baby/babies cry.

I'm sure it's just a blip count. After all if he CAN do it then there must be something preventing him from doing so. That's what I tell myself after the rare 2 hour nap (last one was a month ago).

Sorry but another good night here. Awake twice after going down to sleep then slept until 3 again for a feed. Woke at 6.40 and fed her again then she slept for another hour. I think that I'm going to have to start giving her a dream feed then not feeding her until 6.

Hope you're all having some sleep success.

I'm sorry mama. I can't even begin to imagine how you are doing this with two, and bad news on top... You poor thing.

Well two nights of sleeping through and last night up every two hours! He does like to keep me on my toes . I think he has a slightly upset tummy, off his food yesterday and kept waking himself up with enormous farts! So I hope it will get better and tonight will be ok again.

They are so random, aren't they, bigkids?! Hope it is just a blip.

DS started off badly last night - woke very upset at 11pm and after some Calpol and teething gel (he'd been batting at his ears, putting his fingers on his lower gum and rolling his tongue over it) plus two unsuccessful attempts to settle him without a feed, I fed him just after midnight, in tears of frustration (me that is) that his sleep had gone tits up again. Plonked him down and went to sleep. Next thing I knew it was 4:45am and he was still snoozing away. At 5:45 DH went in to look at DS and he was on his tummy - first time he's done that. Have heard many times that babies sleep better on their tums so really hoping he's learned to settle himself like that. Up for the day at 6. So not bad in the end!

Sorry to hear that mama - I hope you're ok. I hope ur nights away go well for you.
Count my ds started sleeping on his tummy last week and he does seem to sleep deeper like that. Saying thay he's still awake a good four or five times through the night for his dummy and needing to be resettled. We took him to the cranil osteopoaths yesterday - his third visit - so am hoping we might see some good results from that soon. It seemed to have good effects before so am keeping my fingers crossed.

Hello all, have been in exile due to computer problems again.

It was nice to come on and read of your successes, count and bigkids.

Count I also liked your post on the napping thread.

Mama I think you are on your holiday now, hope is goes well and you can enjoy it without too many worries about health and sleep.

Judys how is the plan going? It made me smile when you said you were plotting some co-sleepig naps! The way your DS went to sleep co-sleeping sounded really lovely. My DS could only sleep when latched on, if we were co-sleeping - not ideal really.

Just a quick update - I had been getting DS to have both naps in cot MOST days, though it could take up to an hour for him to settle to sleep, and overall he was sleeping less in the day. It seemed to have a positive effect on night time sleep though, so I think maybe before he had actually been sleeping too much in the day and was not tired enough at bed time. Now he is generally waking 3 times a night, and I am feeding every time as the path of least resistance. Not sure I will continue with 2 cot naps a day though...it has been driving me a bit crazy!

But I think I will have to revisit night weaning as DS is almost one!! I will feel a bit silly feeding a one year old 3 times a night.

Just re read my update...I'm not sure I could have written anything more boring??! Does any one else bore themselves now with their thoughts about sleep?

Can I join? I've been lurking for weeks now but I'm sitting in the dark holding ds's hand while he tries to settle in his cot (again!) and thought I'd finally post.

Ds is 6mo and has only slept through once in his life. A typical night involves waking 5 or six times. He goes to bed at 6.30 and goes off quite easily with a bf. When he wakes I can settle him very quickly with a bf but I'm trying hard not to feed him for every waking as I'm sure it is 'habit waking' for many of the times and feeding reinforces the waking. He has a dreamfeed at 10.00 pm and then I try not to feed him again before 2.30 am - which is currently leading to not much sleep for me on some nights!

On the plus side, he has started to sleep a bit better since being in his own room for the last couple of weeks. We just need to work on sleeping for longer stretches :-)

Hello and welcome goldenbaby. Sounds very familiar! :)

Put DS down for a nap after lunch. After 50 minutes he started crying. Not just one cry - it was on and off for a minute or two. He didn't sound that upset though, it was more grizzling/grumbling, so I didn't go up as I was watching the Nadal match in the middle of something. Just as I was going to go up and get him, it all went quiet. I waited for a minute and went in.

HE HAD GONE BACK TO SLEEP!!!

He has never done that before during the day. Not once. This is truly momentous.

Count thats excellent news am so pleased for you and

I decided to try and tackle napping today as he always naps getting a cuddle. I put ds into his cot asleep for a nap this morning and he lasted 20 mins (longest ever!!) the second time he lasted 1 minute and the third and fourth about 1 second

Hi everyone,

Can I join? Have just spent the past 2 hours reading the whole thread whilst trying to put DS2 down asleep. He's having none of it so I've eaten my dinner sitting in bed holding a sleeping baby.

DS2 is 8 months and has never slept on his own for mire than 2 hours. He was a great sleeper/self settler for the first month but now won't sleep unless my (really my boobs) are next to him. He's had fairly disrupted routine as we moved twice in the first 6 months if his life but we were making progress and he was sleeping in his cot for up to 2 hours in the evening and for 5/6 hours co sleeping with me. In the last 2 weeks though he's started waking about 10-20 minutes after being placed in his cot and will take up to an hour to resettle. This goes on until I give up and go to bed and let him sleep next to me.
DH works away all week and I have DS1 aged 2.8 who has development delay to look after and make sure isn't too disrupted by DS2 crying (I gave never left either to cry) as he doesn't understand that there is nothing wrong with his brother and gets v distressed.

Attempting gradual withdrawal but feel he may be 18 by the time I leave the room as I can't even put him down yet!

So tired....

Welcome hanbee. I'm doing gradual withdrawal at the moment with my DS and we've just decided to stretch out step 2 a bit so think DS might be 18 too before I leave the room (think this may be a case of be careful what you wish for as I remember saying when he was about 4 months that I didn't ever want him to sleep in a separate room to me and might be ready when he left home - I'm currently spending half the night on an airbed next to his cot). We've only co-slept one night out of the last 6 though so that's some progress.

Step 2 was letting DS suck my finger for a count of 10 while holding him in my arms and we were going to move onto step 3 tonight which was the same but with a cuddle in the cot instead. I was meant to be only replacing the finger after a count of 10 as well though so I think we need to work on getting him to accept that in my arms before we start in the cot.
I started worrying yesterday about the later steps where we are meant o just sit by the cot and not touch him and started imagining him screaming in the night and not being able to even pat him to comfort him. Thankfully, I've had the discussion with DH and we've both agreed that we won't push on with that unless he is ready - I think as long as we can get to a point where he is not sucking to sleep I will be happy. He has been doing longer stretches in the evenings after the first few hideous days and last night slept 7.30pm till 12.20am.
Congrats on the daytime self settling count and yes raising I do bore myself on the topic of sleep - can't wait until it's not an issue! I had a look at the first sleep thread I posted on here and it was saying my DS is 7wo and will only settle sucking my finger - is that a problem.......

Had a dreadful night. DS2 wouldn't be out down without waking and crying until 9.30 and then woke and fussed/fed at 1,2,3,3.30,4 and then slept until 7.

Yawn.

Oh dear hanbee - you must be shattered :(

DS went to bed at 8 and woke at 10:20 (DH went in and saw him turn onto his side and go back to sleep) and 11:30. He was pretty upset then and scratching at his ear so think it was teeth. He had a feed and some Calprofen but then slept 12-5:30 then went back to sleep after a feed and didn't wake until 7:45

I actually slept well too, which in itself is unusual ...

Glad to hear you're sounding a bit brighter, Judy - hope the plan is still going OK.

Hello everyone and welcome Hanbee and Goldenbaby! We are still having good nights, three nights sleeping through in total! Well, I say sleeping through because DH and I don't need to get out of bed - DS wakes once or twice, cries for thirty seconds or so and goes back to sleep. Does that count? Those nights have been interspersed with some like last night, when he woke at 3.30 and 5.30 for his dummy.

He's up always at 5.50-6 am too which is knackering so we're going to tinker with later naps and push bedtime back an hour today to 7.45-8 to see if that makes any difference.

Count, it sounds like your few bad nights were the blip and not he good nights! Excellent you're sleeping well, I'm still waking all the time!

We had a fairly average night. DS went to bed as usual at 6.30 and woke at 9.30. DH settled him in his cot but it took half an hour. He then had a dream feed at 10.30 but he woke up again at 1.30. I asettled him quickly with his dummy and he next woke at 3.10 when I fed him. He was awake again at 6.00 when I fed him again and then he had another hour before getting up for the day at 7.10. I don't feel too bad, sleep wise, at the moment. But I am going back to work in the next couple of months and I don't know how knackered that will make me if I'm still getting up lots in the night.

hi all. hanbee your description of DS2 fits my DD perfectly (am writing this in bed next to her - its a good night, she isn't being held). I don't have any answers i'm sorry but you do have my most heartfelt sympathies. I cannot imagine having another child as well (indeed ever). you must be some kind of superwoman to get through the days.

interesting that you mention work goldenbaby, I am also making plans to do that in the next month or so. I know the tiredness will be hard but I need something else to turn my mind to other than my sleep deprivation obsession. This may be pure madness but who knows any more!?

Welcome goldenbaby and hanbee.

Well done for the good nights and Sympathy and coffee for the bad ones to all.

Fell out of routine over the past 2 days as we were flying and the distraction of noise and people walking about woke her up. Fed her whenever she fussed on the plane so kind of started falling back into feeding to sleep but stopped today and she hasn't blinked. Unfortunately I haven't been able to get her down in the hotel cots at all so she's been co sleeping. The beds are so huge that its been lovely. Very late flight out tomorrow night so just taking it all as it comes.

Gaaaah last night he had woken five times before four am when I gave up and brought him into bed. Woke for good at six. He just would not be settled! I'm shattered :(

Sorry you had a bad night bigkids - hope its just a blip.

Welcome golden and hanbee - sorry you have bad sleepers too

Well for the first time EVER ds did not come into our bed last night [ smile] well not until 6am which I can more than live with.

He slept on his tummy all night. He woke at 2am, 2.30am and 4.30 am but only for his dummy.

I feel bad he is on his tummy cos I know the sids guidelined dont recommend it. We never put him down on his tummy but he rolls over straight away so unless I am going to turn him back all the time I can't do much about it!

Snarfle - please don't worry about him sleeping on his tummy. I'm pretty sure the SIDS thing doesn't apply if the baby has rolled himself on to his tummy as he is obviously developmentally advanced enough to have some protection against SIDS.

I feel awful this morning. I never leave DS to cry but when I hear him in the night I always give him a minute to see if he will self-settle - which he does do occasionally. Last night I heard him stir, so I put the monitor on mute so it didn't wake up DH, but then I fell back asleep! The next time I woke up was an hor later and DS was asleep. So he could have been crying for most of that hour and I didn't go to him :(

Sorry for the bad night bigkids - sure it's a blip but it must be frustrating. Congrats on having a night without your DS in your bed Snarfle. Hope you enjoyed the extra room.
I was feeling a bit doom and gloom again last night as DS would not settle for his 3rd night and was then overtired and screaming at bedtime. DH had to stay with him as I couldn't deal with it but he fell asleep after about 20 minutes. I made DH stay in the room with him - we're meant to leave the room for 10s to 30s if he gets that upset but I felt that would be doing cc by default and I think he is teething as well.
So DS went to sleep about 7.50pm and then woke once in the evening and twice in the night before getting up at 6.30am. I think that may be one of our best nights ever! He was awake for an hour at 3.30am but kind of like you goldenbaby, I had muted the monitor when I went to him before so woke to hear distant screaming - I felt bad too but can't be helped.
And this morning he napped for 1hr20 minutes without being settled! I actually woke him up as I'm not meant to let him nap for more than 45mins then - felt a little bid odd waking him but I'm trying to stick with the plan.

Hello again, I posted a couple of weeks ago and then moved to a flat without internet connection so couldn't reply to people's messages. Have had a quick catch up on the last few pages but haven't read them all - I'm too tired! Sorry to hear that there's still a lot of sleepless nights but it's nice to have the company. There's only one other person I know in RL the same boat.

Thanks for the comments about the head-scratching that I read before I went offline. We bought some of scratchmitts which are definitely helping with the scratching, sadly not with the sleeping.

I ended up calling the LLL last week as I was so concerned about whether feeding to sleep is making the situation worse. Between 7pm and 5am I fed my 8mo five times last night. I'm sure she wasn't hungry but that's what she wanted to get back to sleep and wasn't taking no for an answer. It's really beginning to get me down. I just don't know what to do anymore and all the 'helpful' comments of CC aren't really that helpful. Tonight I tried not to feed to sleep and she was up 20 minutes later. Oh god. Here we go again. :(

Missrose hope the move went well. Five feeds does sound like a lot in that time. I've been there :( Have you thought about trying to cut back night feeds? We tried that at around 6 months by reducing feed duration gradually over a week or so (10 mins, then 7, then 5 etc). DS still woke up loads but at least I didn't have to feed him every time. Sounds really tough for you :(

Judy sounds like the plan is going brilliantly - hurrah!

We're generally down to one or two wakings a night. If it's two, the first is before we go to bed, so I'm really only getting woken once. Life is so much better. I do hope DS is sleeping through once in a while by 12 mo as I don't fancy trying to do my job if I'm still getting woken once a night. Still, I know others on this thread have coped with far worse.

It's a little bit one step forward one step back at the moment - well maybe one and a half forward as do feel we're getting somewhere. Last night was awful but think DS had a sore stomach - he was awake for 3 hours at one point!
bigkids I was really interested to read your post about hoe the gradual retreat worked for you on another thread and am planning to show it to my DH. Glad to see you could pick up your DS and co-sleep in the early hours and it still worked. DH thinks if we don't do things to the letter we will fail and the millpond lady said if I co-slept again we'd have to start st the beginning.
By the way, if any of you are feeling brave enough I think we should have a graduation thread where we say what the nightmare was and how it improved. Be good to have a positive thread for a change and I've read good posts from count, bumper, bigkids and others on threads which would be nice to have in one place. Would have to ban people who say they just started a routine at 2 weeks though!