what on earht are you all doing wih tis suiceide stuff

[FluffyMummy123]

Message withdrawn

No, Thinkstoomuch, no. I'm actually offended. Insulted.

And this
'who don't want MN to be the forum for the seriously depressed mum'
is another gross misrepresentation.

It is objectively untrue. Plenty of us arguing that we are worried about these threads have dealt with mental illness either ourselves or in our families. You're absolutely objectively wrong there.

And you know, OO, that cod dressed in olive oil, pepper, sea salt and a drizzle of olive oil, then grilled for about 20 minutes, is very tasty with a salad and couscous.

But it is untrue if you're saying that posters are claiming that they don't want seriously depressed mothers to post on mn. I haven't seen anyone say that.
It's untrue to say those you disagree with have never experienced mental health problems or suicidal thoughts - you have no way of knowing, and several have contradicted you.
You're saying that people disagreeing with you have a 'them and us' attitude. A very unfair generalisation that is quite nasty to all the people raising this issue precisely because they ARE concerned about people getting actual real life help and not being caught up in a website circus that has the potential to delay them getting actual useful life saving help.

I steer clear of this 'suicide' threads anyway as when I once put my thoughts down on one, I was called a hard faced hooooar iirc

stick to discussions on shoes, much safer

ONe objection people have raised is the possibility/probability that some of these threads might provide cheap thrills in some peope's otherwise boring little lives (just like the Jerry Springer or Tricia shows) - and I have to say, so fucking what? It's totally irrelevant and unimportant to what's actually going on with the sufferer if some people are sitting at home with a bag of maltesers hitting Refresh and widdling with excitement.

As to the 'leave it to the professionals' well, mental health professionals are just people. I have met a few. Many are great, know what they are doing, care about the clients, help a lot. Some I wouldn't trust to housetrain a hamster or get their own pants on in the morning. And the same with RL friends: sometimes someone might post on MN because the professionals are busy and the RL friends have all said 'look babe, would love to hear you tell me about it yet again but the baby's just shat on the carpet and the microwave's exploded, can we talk later in the week'
There are way too many variables for New Rules to be any use (a lesson I have long wished this fucking government would learn).

I agree with the point you make in your first paragraph, madamez.

I do think, moreover, that Franny makes an extremely salient point in bringing up the issues attached with MNHQ tracking down posters when they are in life-threatening situations like suicide.

'yes, you're right, let's dismiss the opinions of mental health professionals straight away shall we? Why not? They obviously haven't got a clue because thousands of mentally ill people on the internet say so. I mean jesus. '

i actually refered to psychiatrists,not ALL MH professionals,in my post,and it was in response to your saying that a consultant psychiatrist(well,someone who claims to be one,i have never met the poster in RL so wouldnt know)has said the suicide threads are unhealthy.

No, I suppose you're right about the New Rules, it's not really possible, but i still think the malteser munchers watching the unraveling person is not a particularly healthy scenario for anyone. Especially when they pop up demanding an update. Completely different to a person asking for support, that's fine, it's the urgency of suicide, it's not something that should have an audience I don't think.

'Them and us' perhaps sounds pejorative, but that wasn't how it was intended. To put it another way...it seems to me that if you felt empathy with those who are suicidal and for whom MN is an outlet (and no one is saying the ONLY outlet) they trust, you surely could never think that having the thread pulled/getting a message from MN/getting lots of people posting 'we're very, very sorry but please call your GP' was a good idea.

BOco, thing is, some suicidal people want an audience (not making any statements about any MNer or any actual individual, merely a general observation) some people who want to kill themselves want to make a big dramatic performance out of it (like a final 'fuck you'). Again, it's not a situation you can fix with rules, because people will always find ways round them, and in many cases the Rules will be doing more harm than good.

Sorry, I don't mean empathy - I'm sure most feel a lot of empathy. I'm trying to think of the right word.

Diva, my initial post was a response to Daddyj who had basically said everything was OK because a Samaritan had said so. You can pick and choose people's views on this thread to back up your own and I was showing that another mental health professional had said the opposite, that's all.

madamez post of 21.01 was spot-on.

...some people are sitting at home with a bag of maltesers hitting Refresh and widdling with excitement.

Beautiful! I love it.

Had to break off to BF. What I mean I guess, is 'there but for the grace of God'. If it was me and I was treated in the way some people think is best, I'd be more likely to top myself, not less. I'm going now. This is all a bit too raw for me and I'm not able to express myself as clearly as I'd like.

i tell you what...if i was ever really low i'd rather talk to madamez than any health professional.

Well for someone wanting an audience and a big dramatic fuck you, these threads are certainly unhealthy aren't they! That might be what they want, but for a chance of recovery it's not a great help having the refreshing widdlers surely?

Thinkstoomuch, sorry. I just don't want you to misunderstand and think people are not being empathetic. I for one don't believe that thread deletion is the best option at all, it'd be very harsh. But I do think there needs to be a way of dealing with it which is actually maximising people's chance of getting real help and avoiding it becoming something it shouldn't. That's all.

And you lot complain about the Nanny State? good grief!

fgs

posting on a parenting site asking for advice on preparing your children for your death is NOT NORMAL

and then people get cross when poor, wellmeaning, everyday mums on here find it hard to handle

there is no such thing as normal.

oh yada yada

that is such bullshit

anyway you know what I mean even if normal is a silly word

enid - are you angwy?

I think this is a really shitty thread. We all know about the Samaritans. Sometimes we just need people we vauguely know about to talk to, and they might be virtual (MN)friends rather than RL. But I guess most of you have better things to do with your time than to help desperate people. So perhaps MN should just have a "if you REALLY need help, don't come here, phone the Samaritans" banner. Would that be ok with you, iCod?

surely if these threads ( and despite a 'spate' they are very rare) occur once in while and we can help the person in need then where is the harm?

mental ill health is taboo enough ...

what else will we boycott ? style threads ?