FWR

[MarsScarlet]

FYI: I've name changed for this to avoid a pile-on.

This post is about the overwhelming negativity and hostility with the FWR board that new posters and posters with a differing viewpoint face if they attempt to use the board.

There is a persistent group within the board that are, to put it simply, hateful towards others. Despite posting there on and off for more than 4 years, I have never felt welcome, despite not holding any particular extreme views or being abusive to others. Without exception, I am accused of being another poster, or a man, a TRA, or some kind of paid activist. This occurs again and again until I leave a thread in frustration.

I’ve seen this happen to many other new posters. Few return. Why would they? Such an acidic atmosphere doesn’t encourage healthy discussion. I’d just like to discuss women’s rights, but this board makes discussion impossible.

I’m not exactly sure what the answer is, except for @MNHQ to request the board to tone down the rhetoric a bit and back off on any new names they may see on the board. Let people engage with you rather than actively drive them away.

Re-read the OP.

I Wish I had some Jaffa Cakes to have with my cup of tea this morning. I really do.

The cake recipe thing is a hangover from [surely you know this if you've been on there for years?] when questions were asked and TRAs would immediately have to leave and bake a cake.

Well, it’s not as bad as eating a Tunnock’s.

Some clarifications for those who require it:

1. I am only asking for more civility in discussion, particularly with new posters. This does not mean to be more "feminine".

This doesn't chime with your statement about posters on FWR S&G giving themselves permission to be more male in your response patterns. How are posters more male in their response patterns? By being direct? Is there some defined standard for how males vs females respond?

How do we know posters are new if they don't say so? They could have just name changed. I've seen and been on several threads where posters have stated they are new to the topic and asked for information regarding the subject and they have been so provided and their questions and requests for clarification responded to patiently and civilly.

1. Facts/evidence/experience are great, just don't use them against others. (Eg. We've been here longer than you, we've been fighting this fight forever, read all the material..)

Why wouldn't someone read the material provided that posters have used to come to their conclusions? How is that using it against others?

1. Hellofabore was brought up once, in context, as an example of a poster who does write about knowledge/experience frequently, as Eresh wanted examples. I gave an example. It was not a personal attack on Hellofabore.

Hmm, if you say so. I disagree, you specifically decided to target Hellofabore for doing nothing more than clearly stating her case with the knowledge, experience, proven facts and evidence to back it up. Strange thing to do and to claim that is uncivil and hostile. Then you top it off with this rather sneery comment: You were name-checked and your feelings were hurt? I apologise. Perhaps you have an idea, just a little, how it feels on the other side. It isn’t a great place.

I suspect you name checked Hellofabore to discredit her because you cannot counter, or don't want to hear, the evidence she provides.

i prefer a nice digestive, but i commit the sin of dipping them IN my coffee.

Please do start that thread when you need to work out your own position. It may end up being a difficult one but if you state upfront that you are seeking to work out a view and there is none of that undermining intended as I mentioned, I would hope you would find it useful. Even if you don’t agree with any or the majority of posters .😁

You use 'they' for both the new posters, the maybe new but name changed posters and for the FWR regulars.

Well, it’s not as bad as eating a Tunnock’s.

Is a Tunnocks a cake or a biscuit anyway? Does it sit in that Jaffa cake zone as well?

Oops, too much cake chat. <slaps own wrist>

Definitely a biscuit!

I've already covered these, but for further clarification, it was not my intention to target Hellofabore. You seem to imply I might be intimidated by her? Why would that be? I don't know her, and neither do you.

I think at that point you had left the thread and no one else was really talking about the points raised in your OP so it’s not like it was particularly undermining any actual discussion. And there’s been some really productive discussion since, although with other posters. I have asked quite a few times what you’d like to see different on FWR but you have never answered me.

You are so very very wrong on Tunnocks, they do all sorts of yummy things, my personal. Favourite is a snowball or, or two.

apols for any incivility

Darn pronouns! 😄

See, I'd classify the snowball as a biscuit that's been tarted up a bit.

I take it we're talking about those white Tunnocks things rather than advocaat and lemonade!

Yep

I don't know her, and neither do you.

Plenty of Mumsnetters know each other off the boards. It's a nice social community at times. I've met many women from social media at GC meetings, for eg.

Even if it was unintentional, you did it. And then you tried to justify it. And then you used it as a tool so that 'I would learn from the experience'. I classify that as bullying.

And by targeting me, it then leads to others who discuss MN on other sites to then feel they can bully me.

Even if it was not your intention, that is the outcome. On a thread where you are making a point about hostile interactions.

@PepeParapluie

I think at that point you had left the thread and no one else was really talking about the points raised in your OP so it’s not like it was particularly undermining any actual discussion. And there’s been some really productive discussion since, although with other posters. I have asked quite a few times what you’d like to see different on FWR but you have never answered me.

Thank you, I do appreciate the time you've taken to respond to me and other posters carefully. I was hoping this thread might bring some ideas around that. I just want to be able to participate in discussion without being jumped upon by 15 separate posters who have four questions each - and at least half of them are snarky, and as time goes on, the more aggressive it becomes.

I am not unusual - I don't have any out-there views dissimilar from the board.
I am not a TRA.
I am not a man.
I am not another poster that is always namechecked on the board.

I simply have an interest in these issues and would like to talk about them.

But how would that work? Only one poster at a time allowed to ask you questions? It's a form people post as and when they come across something they would like to address. It's just not practical.

Of course, you can start any thread you like. MN may take it down if it is not in the spirit.

What I don't believe posters should do is start a thread that undermines a group of people you disagree with through the words you choose to post and your framing of the topic and then expect people to not react negatively.

It is an example.

If you can’t take the heat then get out of the kitchen.

@Helleofabore

Even if it was unintentional, you did it. And then you tried to justify it. And then you used it as a tool so that 'I would learn from the experience'. I classify that as bullying.

And by targeting me, it then leads to others who discuss MN on other sites to then feel they can bully me.

Sorry, but this is too much. You endlessly bully people on threads, and now you completely mischaracterise this as bullying and make yourself the victim? Unbelievable. You constantly bring up DARVO. This is classic DARVO.

And even in FWR there are always going to be people who don’t RTFT & won’t have checked which questions you’ve already been asked.

I personally would love it if people were only able to post having read the whole thread first, but it’s never going to happen.