The deletion of the Upfield thread on AIBU

[PencilsInSpace]

Deletion message: Hi all, as there is already an active thread about this subject on the Feminism boards we're going to close this one.

I don't understand or agree with this decision.

1. people often start threads on the same subject on different boards - is it a new rule that there can only be one?

2. Lots of posters hide FWR so might not know what has happened

3. Upfield made their insinuations against all of MN, not just FWR

Can you say a bit more about your decision please?

Are you fairly new to MN LangCleg?

This also made me smile

Curious...why don’t people like the FWR section?

You really need to ask?

@BertrandRussell I’ll take that as a compliment

Well yes, it’s a valid question. It’s easy to scroll past any threads that are not of interest, but to hide the whole section is a bit odd when you consider what is happening around us. (Separate issue as to whether or not the AIBU thread should have been deleted).

And I can’t stop myself making a point of information following an earlier post. A “radical feminist” is not an extreme or very feministy feminist. All feminists have the same goal- that of full social, political, personal and financial equality. They just have different views about rhe best way that can be achieved. Radical and Liberal are the two main paths. It’s a shame that the word radical has shifted its meaning in recent times.

I prefer Colony of Cunts, to Nest of Vipers.

Their first album in particular

"Bile and vitriol"

Or, women who are so tired of other women and girls being discarded by society we've stopped being Nce and have zero fucks to give when pointing inequalities and abuse out. Or plan old biological truths which are apparently hugely vitriolic

“ @BertrandRussell I’ll take that as a compliment grin”

Good. It was meant as one.

There really is no bile or vitriol, just intelligent/interesting discussions, and raising of awareness, of issues that affect women. Any individual posts that MN deem to be offensive will be deleted, just as they are in the whole site.

You've sort of argued against yourself there.

There really is no bile or vitriol, just intelligent/interesting discussions, and raising of awareness, of issues that affect women.

So there is no bile or vitriol but

Any individual posts that MN deem to be offensive will be deleted, just as they are in the whole site.

So how can they be deleted if, according to your first point, they've never existed?

So many posts get deleted and many posters have been banned. How does this happen if the comments weren't deemed offensive?

Many posters hide the board because if you post on there disagreeing with a point you will be ripped to shreds yet it's not easy to see threads that you find offensive or opposing your own views and not speak out.

I can understand people choosing to not see the threads in the first place.

Hang on though, posters are banned and posts/threads are deleted all across the mumsnet site.

It’s not just having a strong viewpoint though is it. It’s like any radical supporter of a cause. They become so consumed by putting their point across that it generally only serves to alienate rather than encourage those who would otherwise be supporters.

I completely agree with you. I've always considered myself to be a feminist but having seen the views expressed in that board I've really been questioning what it means to be a feminist and if it means being like the FWR board then I want to distance myself.

That's so disappointing MNHQ.

Yes I didn't know what radical feminism meant till FWR.

It just means 'root.'

All things associated with human females only.

Basically anything that negatively effects human females.

Ergo, actually, issues affecting the class of people called transmen, actually comes under this umbrella.

So there is no such thing as a trans excluding radical feminist. (TERF)

so I still don't understand why the thread in AIBU had to go. As the poster was asking if she was being unreasonable to be annoyed about the flora 'decision.' Whereas the thread in FWR knew exactly why it had happened and that it was ridiculous.

“ Many posters hide the board because if you post on there disagreeing with a point you will be ripped to shreds yet it's not easy to see threads that you find offensive or opposing your own views and not speak out.”
See- I don’t get this. If you want to be ripped to shreds I can think of much more efficient places on Mumsnet to organise that! Try saying something feminist on Chat, for example. Try suggesting that since your circumstances have fundamentally changed you can no longer look after your dog proper and need to rehome it. But FWR? Really?

Tequila, there are differences of opinion. Mods delete according to a set of rules that many don't agree with. And many have gone elsewhere (spinster) who have a different set of opinion rules rules.

My experience of the board is that women are articulate, thoughtful and compassionate

Really? So any woman not agreeing wholeheartedly with what is said is accused of being a man - exactly how does that fit with being articulate, thoughtful or compassionate? Basically in order to be a woman you must think like us or you are a man.

A thread was started the other day from a woman who stated that she was clearly not intelligent enough nor articulate enough to post on there but she had wanted to be able to discuss feminist issues and had been chased off another thread because she couldn't cite academic articles or verbalise a good enough argument for the regular posters - how is that feminism? Silencing another woman because you don't consider them educated enough?

And it is very common for people to say “well, if feminism is like the views expressed on the FWR boards then I question whether I’m a feminist” but don’t say what those views are....

I never really understand why people complain that women are centring women on fwr. It's bizarre.

Just as bizarre as the people on the deleted thread who said they were 'too scared' to post on fwr but seemed perfectly happy to go on at great length about how scared they were on a thread which was largely populated by women who usually post on fwr.

It's all rather confusing.

And yes'm the deleted thread should be reinstated. Every user should know about this - even the ones who hide fwr because were too scary!

@TequilaPilates- sorry, cross post.
Can you link to that thread, please?

@MNHQ are tripping over themselves to become fully paid up members of the woke brigade

How dare we forget, we are lesser women by rejecting our tropes and accepted personality types. That is why FWR is avoided by some here, it's full of women who refuse to stick our heads in the sand any longer. I'm not going to be nice, meek or gentile anymore when actual women are being killed/raped/beaten by men and nothing is done in favour of pandering to the feelings and foot-stamping of the poor menfolk.
Men being centred in feminism...you couldn't make that nonsense up!

You can either be part of the solution of part of the problem. It's a very simple concept.

Like MB said... I'd rather be rude than a liar

Mods delete according to a set of rules that many don't agree with.

We yes. But many of us agree with those rules and think that posting against them, is offensive, vitriolic or abusive.

It's kind of like saying that legislation around racism is a difference of opinion - in that racists will disagree with the legislation and believe it curtails their freedom of speech, when actually their views are abhorrent and rules should exist to stop them from expressing their views.

MN is a business. It will make business decisions based on economic priorities.

That's fair enough and you are entitled to your opinion.

It would be helpful to understand your POV with an example. I've given examples of what the core FWR issues around this particular topic are.

Also need to mention the trans widows threads. They're an example of how the ideology has abused and affected them.

A “radical feminist” is not an extreme or very feministy feminist
I did make this mistake until I learned that, without making much of a change to my beliefs, I'd become a radical feminist. I suspect there are a lot like me who think they'd rather be called liberal feminists until they find out you basically can't be pro women and a liberal feminist.
I too think this is a bizarre decision.

@TequilaPilates

So, by your logic a biological factor such as race should be protected from being used as a tool of oppression (rightly so obviously).

BUT, how do you then backtrack and decide that a different biological factor such as sex is any different!? Biological women suffer sex-based oppression that men never have.

Why is it accepted and encouraged to protect factors such as race but in the same breath, throw women to the dogs in order to soothe the egos of men?

Utterly senseless