Banning the term "cis"

[OlennasWimple]

Apologies if this had already been done, but can MNHQ consider banning the term "cis", given how horrifically offensive so many users of MN find it?

I don't think I need to set out the background and reasoning to this request (but can do so if it would help!)

Attaching adjectives to people - or anything else - does not make them subcategories. A woman is an adult female, regardless of other differences or "issues".
There is no ambiguity in the word.

Dutch interestingly, it's more complicated than that; for any measure you can come up with to define binary gender, there are people who sit outside it. Also trans women's brains are measurably different from cis men's brains in all sorts of consistent ways.

But this I think is not a thread in which we're going to change minds around whether trans women are women; I've only been edging around that debate so far but I sit firmly in 'yes they are'.

Side point: why in these Mumsnet discussions does no one ever talk about trans men (and indeed cis men)? This also confuses me.

Woman is both a biological descriptor and an identity. People in the street don't react to your genitals/whatever, they react to the identity you are portraying. Which in my case is woman.

Christ, you lot are an intolerant bunch, eh?

I am a woman.

Having to "identify as" a woman removes that fact and makes you have to claim it again.

Therefore I do not "identify as" a woman, I am a woman.

Maybe because trans men aren't forcing their way into male only spaces and demanding that 'cis' men change their behaviour because it excludes them.

I'm not intolerant of others, I just don't want to be labeled by them

I strongly reject being referred to as a 'cis' woman. I am not a sub category of women, I am a women. A trans women is just that, a trans women.

I do not need an identifying prefix to explain what I am. Trans women are identified by the term trans women, just as I am identified as a women by being referred to as exactly that.

And yes, I find it highly offensive to be referred to as such, as I under no circumstances identify as being 'cis'.

I would be all for a ban.

Trans women face transphobia. Which just to be clear isn't "anything people say that they might not like or talking about periods". Transphobia has nothing to do with being a woman. Discrimination against women is about culture and biology. Trans women are not perceived by men as women, as a rule, but as non conforming men.

Using 'woman' and 'trans woman' implies that a trans woman is not a woman. Which she is.

I've heard cis used to describe both men and women out in the real world. I suppose mumsnet is mostly women so attention gets focused there. I'm hoping it's that simple anyway.

allthefluffyanimals sorry, but you are wrong.
You can identify however you wish, however if you have xy chromosomes and male sexual characteristics then you are a man. Like wise a woman has xx chromosomes and female sex characteristics. Being a 'woman' is not an identity, it is a biological fact.

Allthefluffyanimals I'm not sure whether it would improve or break this conversation if I mentioned the number of cis men I know who comfortably refer to themselves as such... :)

No one ever talks about trans men because they don't threaten men and men aren't being erased by them. Men don't give them a second thought. They didn't grow up with male privilege. They are biological women, and expect to take second place.

How about people who are born intersex?

ParanoidGynodroid (good name) There is a hell of a lot of ambiguity!

Cis is supposed to mean my gender identity is aligned with my biology. I don't have a gender identity. I'm just "me". I know I'm an adult human female. I know this gives me shared experience with fellow women the world over, which surpasses culture and language.

But I don't identify as any particular gender. I fucking hate gender, it does nothing but harm. I identify as a person. I certainly don't "identify as a woman" if that's what Caitlyn Jenner describes.

Cutting a long story short, then, the prefix "cis" not only shunts me into a subcategory of women - leaving the original word available to adult human males in frocks - it imposes on me a "gender identity" which I do not, in truth, have.

It also means that, when I talk about women, I can't be sure whether I'm talking about an adult human female or a male.

It's a massive dismissal. Of my identity and of my entire sex.

Had a look at several dictionaries, but can't find one that defines "woman" as an identity; only as a biological description (or colloquialism for wife, etc.)
You can't redefine words as you choose, fluffy

I don't like the sound of the word. To me it sounds like an insult. It sounds like 'sissy'. When I hear it, I feel like it is an insult. If a different term was used, I might be more open to it.

I find it hard to keep up with the lingo to be honest. I'm a pretty open and accepting person, as long as you are not personally doing something to hurt me or my family, I don't care how you live your life and you are welcome to live it how you choose.

I do find all of this labelling a bit, teenagerish. I associate it with people who are a lot younger than I am, who are trying to fit out identities and are trying to be a bit 'out there' and 'different'. I see it in a similar vein as being a 'goth' and would find it difficult to take a perso( who felt they needed to bring it up in conversation with me, seriously.

Whatever the verdict of MN, I reserve the right to use the term cis if the subject turns to chemical configurations. Otherwise ... It's a back-construct from trans which seems unnecessary and not worth quite so much angst either way, it just sounds silly. One thing I do wonder about is that while I've seen 'cis woman' elsewhere I'm not sure I've ever seen 'cis man ' ... Hm, wonder how long that would be tolerated for?

LOL. I always love it when a load of people come into threads like this and earnestly tell women we're not actually allowed to reject a label applied to ourselves that we don't accept. Heaven forbid you should say that to a trans person.

what about intersex All?

Errol, see my earlier post - I think it just depends on how relaxed and open-minded the cis men in question are ;)

Excellent post, garlic

I don't identify with a gender either.

Errol, I propose amending my OP to recognize that anyone talking about chemistry on MN will still be able to use the term "cis" in that context

Bloody hell I'm glad I'm a bloke, it must be a complicated minefield being a woman!

A joke and not helpful to the thread, I know, sorry