should we address the casual antisemitism on MN?

[thedevilinmyshoes]

I rarely venture beyond my narrow range of interests on MN these days so I don't know if it happens a lot, or if a similar level of hatred is extended to other groups, but what I saw tonight was sinister (particularly against the current backdrop of a surge in antisemitic crime in UK). I wondered if we had an agreed definition of what constitutes antisemitism or if people feel the issue is covered and handled well enough within the existing guidelines.

Really? Are some people really arguing that circumcising boys unnecessarily cant be objected to if it's done by Jewish people? I'm not sure I can follow that argument to be honest.

Being anti circumcision is not anti Semitic.
It is not a unique Jewish practice. Even if it was it would not be anti Semitic to oppose it.

thedevilinmyshoes

Can you provide examples?

Could you give examples of what you mean?
I have never noticed examples of anti Semitism on mn..
If you mean the Bris thread then I don't believe that is anti Semitism. Whilst it is an aspect of Jewish culture, what people are taking issue with is the circumcision itself which is not exclusive to Judaism and so can be disliked without any bias against the religion as a whole.
If it's not that thread then I have no idea what you're talking about!

I don't know what thread you are referring to but if it is regarding a Bris, as a Jew-ish girl/mother/wife, I know better than to get involved in a bun fight regarding circumcision. When you put your religion ahead of practicalities it isn't called progress IMO. We know better now hence DH and I never proceeded with a bris for DS.

It is also why I refer to myself as Jew-ish. I don't keep kosher and have zero interest in doing so. It made sense 2000 years ago in the middle east but for a Jew-ish girl growing up in the UK I never saw the need. We have pretty good health and safety around pork both here and in the US (where I live now). I mean at least it isn't sold as horse meat! There are plenty of aspects of my religion that I am keen to keep but others that I am willing to let fall by the wayside as a historical reference point. My view probably angers most Jews but that is why I love living in a country with free speech. It is ok to agree to disagree.

What the fuck are you on about OP?

Op- can you confirm if it is the circumcision thread?

I don't think anyone was being antisemitic, if the op would have been of any religion (or just mentioned circumcision without religion) they would have had the same response.

yes I could have phrased it much better, something like: 'is antisemitism a problem we need to address on MN' since that's what I wanted to know, a measure of the public mood on this

I'm not going to repeat what was deleted, there's a reason MNHQ don't leave stuff like that on their boards! There is a sort of cumulative effect of reading a few shocking posts in short succession that perhaps makes it feel worse or more of a problem than it is.

Oh and if anyone spots anti semitism I urge them to hit the report button if they are not comfortable challenging it. That is why it is there.

When I was growing up in Canada circumcision was totally standard. Dad, brother, every boyfriend I ever had. It was quite a surprise upon moving to Europe and discovering my first uncircumcised penis. I was like I still don't really understand WHY I was so shocked, it's not like I didn't know about it.......weird.

Anyhow nary a Jewish boy amongst them. So being anti-circumcision isn't necessarily anti-Semitic. IMO.

The problem is op, it can't be addressed if we don't know what you're talking about can it?

"I wondered if we had an agreed definition of what constitutes antisemitism or if people feel the issue is covered and handled well enough within the existing guidelines."

is that very woolly? that's from my OP, it's all I wanted to ask

I read the thread the OP was referring to and is now deleted.

Yes the bris was mentioned, but the comments the OPnis referring to, was the casual use of an insulting term aimed at Jewish women.

Ffs you don't need to repeat what was typed but at least set us in the right area.
How can we comment if you won't tell us what was wrong?

Are you being like this on purpose?

I think you probably need to give some examples of it before people can agree it needs addressing.

I haven't every seen antisemitism on MN casual or otherwise. I don't agree that objections to circumcision sp? constitutes antisemitism. But if you feel strongly then report the thread or post.

Yes the bris was mentioned, but the comments the OPnis referring to, was the casual use of an insulting term aimed at Jewish women.

That is what I thought the OP was referring to rather than the bris.

Being anti-circumcision is not intrinsically anti-semitic, I fully agree.

However, I have certainly seen anti-semitism surface on anti-circumcision threads. When it is pointed out, there is immediately a chorus of 'It's not antisemitic to oppose circumcision!'. It goes round in exhausting circles.

I'm asking people if they have seen antisemitic material on these boards

and if they have seen it is it dealt with under the existing guidelines?

OP, being coy and cryptic leads to rather a pointless thread.

Though I agree that objecting to male circumcision is no more anti-Semitic than objecting to the stoning of women for having sex is Islamophobic.

There is a significant gap between disagreeing with and criticising religious practices and being prejudiced against or hating people of that religious or racial group.

So, thedevil, were the antisemitic comments allowed to stand?

If not, then it seems that the guidelines are doing their job.

Circumcision was v common a generation or two ago in England. Esp in the upper middle classes. My DF was, not Jewish. Many of dh's school friends were, again mainly not Jewish. Was seen as a question of hygiene. One of my god sons is, for medical reasons.

Sorry I see what you're trying to say now.

I haven't seen it. If I saw anything that I thought was antisemitic I would report, unless loads of posters already stated they'd reported it.
I think the same goes for anything racist or hateful.
I'm not even aware of an insulting word for a Jewish woman so maybe I'm ignorant in this area!