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See all MNHQ comments on this thread

Fathers 4 Justice and their recent attacks on Mumsnet

999 replies

JustineMumsnet · 17/03/2012 09:28

Some of you may have noticed that a group called Fathers 4 Justice has been saying some pretty unpleasant things about us over the last couple of weeks. In an 'advert' which appeared first on Facebook and then in yesterday's edition of the I, the group claims Mumsnet 'promotes gender hatred', and labels 'men and boys as rapists, paedophiles and wife beaters'. It calls on advertisers to suspend advertising on Mumsnet.

Most people, I'm quite sure, will see the adverts and the 'campaign' behind them for precisely what they are: a naked attempt to court publicity by a group of people who for whatever reason appear to have tired of climbing cranes in superhero outfits. (And, just coincidentally, in the run up to Mothers' Day). In fact it feels a bit like having a particularly irritating toddler repeatedly prodding you with a stick to get some attention.

By and large it seemed most sensible to ignore them, not least because we've had our hands quite full with stuff that actually matters, like Mumsnet's 'We believe you' campaign to dispel rape myths.

But since Fathers 4 Justice appear to have attracted some grown ups' attention, we thought we should tell you a bit about the background to this attack, the truth behind their allegations, and how they are trying to bully us and other organisations. Here are 10 things you should know.

  1. On March 3rd a Mumsnet user started a conversation about a poster campaign being touted on Mumsnet's Facebook wall by Fathers 4 Justice, and the fact that Fathers 4 Justice was bombarding a number of sites with this troubling image.
  1. A conversation then ensued on Mumsnet about Fathers 4 Justice and their tactics which some members of Fathers 4 Justice joined. Some Mumsnetters said some pretty harsh things.
  1. We deleted a number of posts that broke our forum guidelines regarding personal attacks. In total we deleted 70 posts from the thread which went on over the next few days and reached 1000 posts in total. 60 were posts were made by regular Mumsnet members, ten or so by new joiners from Fathers 4 Justice. Our community managers reminded users to follow forum guidelines on nine separate occasions and at least one prolific Mumsnetter left the site in protest at our deletion policy.
  1. On March 7th and March 8th MNHQ received a series of emails from the Campaign Director of Fathers 4 Justice containing threats of legal action and a threat to contact our advertisers. At the same time comments on the Fathers 4 Justice Facebook page describing Mumsnetters as 'barking mad harridans', 'weird sex obsessed paranoid perverts' and 'child abusing contact blockers' were left unmoderated. As were comments that described me variously as a 'dried up old hag', 'an evil woman' and having an 'IQ that would return a negative score'.
  1. On March 11th Fathers 4 Justice posted another attack ad this time accusing M&S of 'sponsoring hateful, bigoted and prejudiced comments about men and boys on Mumsnet' and demanding that M&S withdraw all advertising on Mumsnet or face a boycott. It accused the company of 'serving up gender hatred for Mother's Day'.
  1. Other organisations have experienced similar bullying tactics. In recent weeks Fathers 4 Justice have targeted the lone parents' support charity, Gingerbread, jamming up its telephone helplines. Senior NGO staff have told us they felt too intimidated to speak out against them.
  1. The suggestion that Mumsnet encourages gender hatred would be funny if it were not so offensive - and plain silly. The central aim of Mumsnet is to make parents' (mothers' and fathers') lives easier. There are many and varied opinions on the site and no one Mumsnet party line prevails, save for the view that we respect diverse opinion. We do not pre-moderate or vet comments made to our discussion boards of which there are around 30 000 every day. Men are and always have been extremely welcome on Mumsnet - we have a Dadsnet forum for Dads to talk directly with other men should they wish. We estimate that around 5-10% of our 2 million odd monthly users are men.

Of course you can always find plenty of Mumsnetters whinging about their male partners' shortcomings - more than there are whinging about their female partners' shortcomings - but generalisations are swiftly pounced on and we do not tolerate gender hatred, or any other kind of hatred for that matter (save maybe hatred of Fruitshoots). We encourage people to be civil and supportive and, in the main, most people are.

  1. Fathers 4 Justice campaigns for fathers to have access to their children following separation or divorce. Its founder, Matt O'Connor, says parents have 'fewer rights than a terrorist'. The organisation was temporarily disbanded in 2006 after it emerged that some of its members had plotted to kidnap Tony Blair's son Leo. Fathers 4 Justice boasts that it is 'the most controversial and high profile pressure group of modern times' but it has struggled to win public attention since abandoning its eye-catching tactic of scaling tall structures in superhero costumes. In recent weeks it has targeted Cafcass, the body responsible for protecting the rights of children in court proceedings, Gingerbread, the charity for single parents, (which it claimed supported 'the abuse of children') and Mumsnet. It has also, somewhat mysteriously, branded London 2012 'the fatherless games'.
  1. We believe that the issue of father's access to children is important and needs to be discussed. We understand that many Fathers 4 Justice campaigners are driven by intense personal anger over what they feel is injustice they have suffered in their own cases. But the recent actions the group have taken against Mumsnet and others constitute plain and simple bullying and intimidation and only harm its cause.
  1. Reading this, you may well already be spitting tacks by now. Please do remember that's precisely what Fathers 4 Justice want. If you post on the subject please keep it civil. We won't be bullied, but we don't want to be dragged into the mire either.

Many thanks.

OP posts:
Beachcomber · 19/03/2012 22:16

Buys a Wine for purple.

PurpleRomanesco · 19/03/2012 22:19

Haha! Thank yah.

They are not the only people who can use photoshop. It would have been better but I was also busy being a victim. It's hard work.

MmeLindor. · 19/03/2012 22:19

If "Jane" is one of you guys, I would seriously consider removing that account. I don't think it is good to give them further ammunition against us.

Let us have fun and joke about it, but without targeting individuals.

SophieNeveu · 19/03/2012 22:19

have a look at my learners ability blog here

StewieGriffinsMom · 19/03/2012 22:19

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

notocrap3 · 19/03/2012 22:20

Purple is the Queen!!!

WineWineWineWineWine

Off to get a real glass

SophieNeveu · 19/03/2012 22:20

someone please do the linky!

VivaLeBeaver · 19/03/2012 22:21

Talk about OTT - they're ringing the police again and urging their followers to all ring the police. Shock

KalSkirata · 19/03/2012 22:22

and expect the police to do what?
'Ladies, stop being mean'
ahem

Sunnywithachanceofshowers · 19/03/2012 22:22

LOLWUT

Beachcomber · 19/03/2012 22:24

Are they ringing the police to say that some uppity women are ripping the piss out of them on the internet?

The comedy value just keeps coming Grin.

SinicalSanta · 19/03/2012 22:24

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by Mumsnet.

MmeLindor. · 19/03/2012 22:25

Please, if you are Jane, take the page down. It is not acceptable to target one person.

notocrap3 · 19/03/2012 22:26

Who is Justice@mumsnet??

"please email [email protected] to ask what she is doing to resolve this matter and if you have been upset or distressed, contact the Police. We are again reporting the matter to the Police tonight."

Muppets

Codandchops · 19/03/2012 22:27

Aw bless em - don't be mean ladies.

Just itching to know what the police are saying and doing in response.

Who is Jane? I need a link too.

PurpleRomanesco · 19/03/2012 22:27

I agree with Mme. It's just giving them what they want.

suzy82 · 19/03/2012 22:27

Much as it pains me I agree with MmeLindor - although it's very, very funny it's just going to cause aggro for Mumsnet - let's not stoop to the level of F4J.

PurpleRomanesco · 19/03/2012 22:28

Sorry, but ARFHAARF at [email protected].

MmeLindor. · 19/03/2012 22:28

lol at [email protected]

Jane FB page is gone. I hope it wasn't a MNetter. I don't think so, it didn't seem like the kind of thing one of us would do.

She was spamming followers of F4J, according to their FB page.

SmellsLikeTeenStrop · 19/03/2012 22:28

I also agree with MmeLindor, the secret to being a good troll is to know when to quit, and this is the time.

notocrap3 · 19/03/2012 22:29

I dont even think it was a mumsnetter, i think its one of their own trying to get fake evidence. I cannot even see the page they are talking about?

FrothyDragon · 19/03/2012 22:29

Agree with Mme. This is one person that's being targeted. Specifically the only notable woman in the company. Doesn't feel right.

VivaLeBeaver · 19/03/2012 22:29

The Jane FB page could easily be done by one of them. Then they can complain to all their followers - "look what the nasty MNers are doing, bullying us, etc".

BoulevardOfBrokenSleep · 19/03/2012 22:30

Are they perhaps ringing the police under the impression that it's actually 1586, and we need to be put in scold's bridles for getting above our station?

MmeLindor. · 19/03/2012 22:31

Fathers 4 Justice - The Official Campaign Organisation They have also set up a Twitter account NotNadineO and they are tageting fathers rights and family court campaigners twitter accounts.

No way is Jane a MNetter. Sounds like a troll who was causing trouble.