Missing school trip as extra punishment - fair?

[Khaite]

DS (15) is going out with a classmate. Today they were caught coming out of a disabled toilet together by HoY.

HoY didn’t say whether there would be a consequence for this, but DS confessed to me anyway.

Late this afternoon HoY emailed me and said DS would miss the practice Duke of Edinburgh school trip on Monday and have an internal exclusion that day instead. Then I was to come in for a meeting on Tuesday morning.

i completely accept DS having an internal exclusion. However it feels an extra punishment that he has to miss the DoE trip. He’s practised for it. His year have had no whole-day school trips at all , ie throughout years 7-10, because of Covid and then the school being crap about it, so he was really looking forward to this.

Do you think it’s unfair he has to miss the trip? I want to ask if he can do the day’s exclusion on Tuesday instead.

Why post on a thread if you can't be bothered to read even the opening post properly?

Well said.

Speaking as an outdoor educator and D of E organiser… I would say that participation in D of E expedition is precisely the sort of developmental experience that is needed for your DC. It would be an excellent intervention in the circumstances. They will be able to focus on their personal development.

You can tell the HOY that from me!

I think a pastoral head is probably well versed in the benefits of the DofE.

I'm sure the HOY will listen intently ...

Learning that (however stupid) your actions are, they had consequences will be a life long lesson.
If he's allowed to go, it perpetuates the "misbehave and mum phones up and makes sure it's sorted" attitude which so many youngsters have.

There’s a load of pious rubbish on here demolishing dc who might not be sure of sexuality and attraction to the same sex. All this insinuation it’s sex and it’s a safeguarding issue is ludicrous. God knows how boarding schools manage! It’s something where talking is the best way out. None of this is an offence in the real world, even between dc. I’ve seen girls in loos together. Personally I would want the school to explain to explain why they don’t want kids kissing on school premises (not unusual in my day!) and any further hidden displays of affection will result in punishment. So kids, be repressed. You know it makes sense.

I think that is a really cheeky view to be quite honest.

If you son gets off lightly then in effect it gives permission for other CF parents and the CF children to start negotiations.

Why can’t he accept that the rules do apply to him, and if being led by his dick at 15 gets him into trouble, he is going to have to get used to being punished.
Sex in toilets at school/college/work is fucking grim, whatever the sex of those involved.

I think you looking to get him off easy is a mistake.

Surely the lesson is just simply that DS made a poor decision on school premises and, as such, school decide the consequence, however unfair it may feel?
All kids do stupid things. The making of them comes from seeing the link between cause and effect. Sometimes life isn't fair and you get a much bigger consequence than anticipated. Such is life and a valuable lesson at 15.

You could have been expelled for that 30 years ago… just saying. Definitely suspended and off school grounds.

Dont you think he should grow up and not get down with it in the disabled toilet. It’s just 🤢

Sure- I don't disagree.

Just that if it was my son I wouldn't argue with the school. He'd need to learn the consequences of being caught in a loo with a girl at school which let's face it, is madness.

Compare this to two fully consenting adults being seen coming out of an employers loo.

Instant disciplinary for.both.

Tough shit!!

Now consider this is the actions of two kids.

It's a no brainer- he needs to accept it was totally inappropriate

Did he have sex with him in the toilet?
Even if he didn't, whatever he got up to will get round the school like wildfire.
They both need to be punished and if missing his DofE is the outcome of that punishment, then he should take it on the chin, as should you!

Hopefully it will deter him from further inappropriate behaviour.

That's true.

Have you misunderstood that my comment here was in response to a very specific comment and discussion that wasn’t about me asking for him not to go on the trip?

Because I don’t agree that me saying I hope the school doesn’t address a situation like this in tutor time or assemblies immediately on the back of yesterday’s incident to protect privacy due to a rash of homophobia is really cheeky. I am going to ask them if they plan to address the issue generally in the above ways, and politely ask how they usually handle not making it obvious they’re talking about an incident with students X and Y who were conspicuous by their absence on the school trip.If the school thinks I’m unreasonable in asking that, they can tell me.

As for having sex in the toilets: you’re assuming. The school have said they weren’t in there very long. I don’t know, but neither do you, and I can only imagine that if the school genuinely thought that was a possibility going by how long they were in there, the punishment would have been more severe.

As another poster said your ds won't be able to pass D of E without taking part in the practise expedition. Particularly as this is unusual behaviour for your ds, I would be expecting the school to allow him to do the day in external exclusion the following day. I say this as a teacher working in a secondary school. Perhaps explain this to the HOY as they may not be aware. Also, explain the sanctions you are giving at home due to his actions and I think I'd go as far as saying that you would be happy for him to do two days in IE if it means he gets to do DofE. This will show that you are being 100% supportive of the school but also allowing you son to complete the challenge of doing DofE which he will be able to put on his CV in the future.

Did he break the school rules? Then one sanction but not the DofE trip.

Thank you because I genuinely would be happy for him to do 2 days in IE and I was wondering if I could suggest something like that.

I just don’t think it’s a big deal. I remember kissing boys behind the bike shed at school in my time. No one was hurt, so to me it’s a total overreaction 🤷🏻‍♀️

Did he have sex with him in the toilet?

@cryinglaughing this Q feels slightly voyeuristic in tone… as do comments by others stating as fact that they had sex in the toilets.

As it happens I’ve already said there is no proof they did, in fact there’s proof (knowledge of the v short amount of time they were in there) that suggests they didn’t, and DS says they were just kissing and went in there for privacy to do that.

What they were doing in there isn’t the material problem as put by the school. The material issue is them (a) in there at all and (b) in there together when they would both know that both (an) and (b) was against the rules & inappropriate.

It's completely routine for badly behaved kids to be thrown off school trips, DofE included. Often it's not as a result of a first misdemeanor, but many. That's understandable, as taking badly behaved children on a trip is an absolute nightmare, and in some cases, it's unsafe. Maybe use this is a lesson for your DC. Sometimes, poor behaviour has actual unpleasant consequences, that they genuinely don't like. Life outside of school is just the same, at 15 it's about time they got the message on that one.

Life lesson learnt.

You break the rules you get punished and punishment given is not negotiable.

I find it very odd that some posters are desperate to know whether or not two UNDERAGE boys had sex in a toilet. And that they think the mother of one of the boys would tell them if this were the case.

Desperate 🤣

I can tell you, something very similar happened in the school I work at. The boys were immediately suspended.

A day in inclusion is pretty lenient.

If I was seen to be coming out of the toilet with another member of staff, I would expect my employment to be terminated immediately 🤷🏻‍♀️

I fail to see why the punishment is even in question