Salary to consider private

[Duckyneedsaclean]

Just wondering at what take home salary you would consider/be able to pay for a private school place?

We were hoping for a bursary but not been granted one - trying to figure out if we can afford full fees.

I think was probably using Outstanding in the non ofsted sense, sorry.
We picked a Good (ofsted) State Primary over an Outstanding (ofsted) one as we preferred it. When it came to Secondary it was Private or Failing

@Hoppinggreen ah ok makes sense. Your situation is really the only reason I see sense in private secondary. There are so many parents in my area of London who go for a good private when they have a great state school. I know a child who moved at the end of Y8 from a really amazing state school to a 'nothing that special' private. I can't for the life of me understand it.

I think you're convincing me about private primary, it it's an excellent one (not all are)! But when a child is at a private primary, there's a lot of pressure to keep them in the private school system. I'd be interested to know how many parents resist that pressure and move their children to state for secondary. I also came across snobbery between public schools and private but non-public schools.

@User534 I doubt you'll find many of those people as most save for secondary if they can't afford both. However I would put money on the fact a child coming from an excellent private prep will do better at the state school than a child coming from an excellent state primary. There's obviously so many variables but that's just my opinion.

This!!

I never understood the state till eight mob, which is damaging to primary schools anyway. This state plus rubbish too, like I have time to personally arrange all these extra clubs and activities that Prep does ? A good grammar and selective/partially selective state school are getting the same ballpark A level results than schools that would cost me 30K a year.

For us it was never a question our DC wouldn't attend Prep, but private senior schools for us is a back up for a grammar school / good selective or semi selective state, knowing the 'ground work' has been done in Prep.

We have a joint income that averages £430k (varies annually) and have no problems with 2 in prep. Plenty of money left for housing, holidays, travel, activities, pensions and savings (but no car as we're in Central London). Fully expect to be able to help with uni, housing, wedding costs etc in the future. So it's not an either/or situation for us at this income level, and find it hard to understand anyone who feels it's too much of a sacrifice with a similar income.

We have the option of an excellent state secondary comp, but still plan to use private, as DDs can be introverted and would get overlooked in the larger classes. Plus facilities are very scruffy at the state school, despite excellent teaching, and there are funding challenges for all state schools right now, with a lot of opportunities closed eg trips and extra activities, use of technology etc. It's a long way off though - we'll certainly apply for the state school and visit closer to the time.

Most of the UK doesn't have grammar schools, and where there are grammar schools, there aren't always very many of them. I'm not sure what you mean by selective state schools that aren't grammar schools? I can see that a good private prep school may be worth it because the child gets a better education and has more fun, and it relieves parents of childcare and extra-curricular hassle, but it's not needed for the child to do well at secondary level. It's perfectly possible for a child who's been to an ordinary state primary to do extremely well at secondary school, whether state or private.

We have a pre-tax joint income of £105,000. We can afford private school (£18,000) for one child with limited extra curriculars.

We also pay half private school for DSS1 at the same school. That is truly about our limit I think.

Crucially we do not have a mortgage. If we did I do not think we could do it.

In UK, only about 10% of people earn more than £180k a year. 7% of people send to private. Not all high income will choose private. I think you are more familiar with primary. State primary study is 1-2 years behind private. But some state school kids are doing well for 11 plus, so parents organise outside tutoring. Some people said private kids got tutoring as well... Not all state primary has bad facilities, I know some secondaries have new building and development plans. really need o visit schools. state Primary schools are much smaller compared with some privatise all through from 4-18. State primary with these ALL through privates are not comparable... Both state and private schools are facing financial and funding challenges. Just the state has to absorb with reserve or fundraising activities/events which is not a thing! You will see more activities, clubs, and events where they can raise money. But private schools will increase parents' fees to reduce the challenge 9already heard people received a letter 7%-12%) increase. If you read grammar schools and some other state schools' accounts, they have a good reserve. some even over £1m. It is just more or fewer savings for school not affecting basic running.

I am glad I paid for private for DD at primary. She had a great foundation but the cost was paid for out of a combination of savings, income and lodgers so what I earned was not the sole factor. DH was an SAHD and carer for his father. We took in lodgers to help cover some of the fees. Our house was a wreck by end of primary as we couldn’t afford any work on it. The downstairs toilet was out of use and many rooms were overdue decoration.

For secondary we had some great local state options (grammar) and didn’t meet criteria for bursary at private due to equity in home. For us private at primary and being in a grammar area worked very well for DD. The academic support, pastoral care and approachability of teachers in the state grammar was far better than the private school.

@User534 there's quite a few in London. A % of places for language aptitude, music, performing arts, governor's places etc. St Marylebone, Grey Coats, Dame Alice Owens, Camden Girls, Mary Magdalene are some of the ones I know. Siblings than enter normally.

re topic of private secondary or private primary
IMHO it's great to be able to afford both but I would choose private secondary for the family's sake. The reason is it's better to have both income to support the fees AND savings to give you peace of mind that everything else is also covered, with or without the income.

When the kids are in primary stage, your incomes are still growing as you're still working up the career ladder and/or making and learning investment mistakes, it's a huge burden to pay for fees and have very little left to build the safety buffer. Raising young children is physically exhausting already, juggling career demands and managnot having a buffer to fall back on would deprive you of enery in life. No wonder many people sending kids to private primaries despite singing songs about the choice couldn't wait to see the end of it.

apologies for spelling mistakes

True. We are lucky to have few here . Having said that a couple of days ago I've been handing over some 11+ tests to a man who told me that he relocated to Kingston to be in the catchment of the Tiffin Girls grammar school. They moved because of school! 😮 He told me that many people do that

@jobadoo it depends how old you were when you had your DC and how advanced you were in your career. I found that I had got to the pinnacle of my career at point of having DD. It also depends on caring responsibilities for aged Ps and other economic factors in your life like when you first took out a mortgage etc. I don’t think it is quite as simple as you make out.

@ReneeX that's normal...

That's impossible to say as it depends so much on your housing costs and how may people there are in your household-- is it just you and your DC?

Everyone's financial commitments are different as is what they'd be willing to sacrifice.

@ReneeX Very normal and very common all over the country.

? What is a “semi selective state”?

Either you are in a grammar school area or you are not.

Highly amused at all these people saying that private primary schools are better because of all the “confidence” and “love of learning” they instill, then admitting that they live in grammar school areas. If the idea is “use private primary to cram for the 11 plus,” fair enough, that’s one way to do things, but at least be honest and admit that that is what you are doing.

@user1477391263 I'm in London and there are many non grammars state schools that have selective streams

(And frankly, this is another big reason why the grammar school system should be scrapped in this country. It’s not about “giving a leg up to bright but rough kids from difficult areas,” it is about middle class parents who tutor their kids a lot or pay for private prep schools.)

there's (very) obviously no sensible answer to this question.

something like (all pre-tax) '£70k p.a. for one child plus an extra £30k p.a. per additional child plus an extra £5k p.a. per £100k of mortgage minus £5k p.a. per £100k of reasonably liquid household wealth?' even something relatively nuanced like that doesn't begin to scratch the surface.

@Lingar Yes I'm sure some on a high income will choose state primaries - for us it's one of the things we prioritise as we value the difference it provides, and we can easily afford it. Some state primaries may have good facilities, but I don't feel confident in their ability to provide the extra support and services we've been able to enjoy in prep (which is small and not an all through 4-18 school, which suits our DCs). They're happy in their prep and I wouldn't move them on the principle of checking out the local state schools when we have no issue paying the fees.

We aren't overly concerned about fee increases - we can comfortably afford it, and I'd rather fees went up to provide decent facilities and experiences than things like trips being cut back and heating turned off which is the case in some state schools. Some grammar schools may have large reserves, but we're not in a grammar area and our local top performing comp was upfront about financial pressures they are under. The nearest grammars to us are super selectives and it's too early to tell if they'd be the right school for our DCs - my guess is they'd be happier in a less pressured and more creative environment.

The 10k after tax is an annual income (very roughly, based on what I earn a year and month and multiplying it a lot😁) of about 180-200k a year. A person could send a child to private school earning a lot less than that, depending on other outgoings etc.

we are just about managing with a joint household income of £90k but (a) we only have one child and (b) our housing costs are extremely low and (c) we aren't in London and there are good schools around here with fees around £15kpa. if one of these wasn't true we would be priced out so I think we are about on the borderline.