School skirts? Why is it such an issue?

[jobadoo]

I don't have daughters and my sons are still at primary school so I don't understand why secondary school girls' skirts are such a massive issue that there are silly measuring by ruler and pupils protests and drastic school decisions to remove skirts from uniforms??

What's the solution?

My daughter lives with her Dad. She goes to a school that are also measuring length of skirt above the knee. Her skirt is supposed to sit on the knee. She's had a growth spurt and her school skirt is an inch above the knee. She was put in isolation for it today.

Whilst I agree school skirts should be a suitable length, I don't think an inch above the knee is unsuitable and my question is why they are happy to disrupt my daughters education for an inch of material.

That really is outrageous, @Toooldtoworry . Why not just say to her ok, get a new skirt (or take the hem down if that's an option) by next Monday please.

Children grow in fits and starts. DS usually grows at a fairly even pace but I remember one year I bought him all new trousers at the end of the summer and by October they were all two inches too short 😂. It's just normal development, I don't know why they need to turn it into a moral/disciplinary issue.

I never know why schools these days either go between a complete laissez-faire approach or a Draconian approach. Why on earth not send a note home to the parents just informing them and giving them time for a new skirt. What on earth is achieved by putting a kid in isolation for something like that?

Worst thing is they live 200 miles away so I can't just take her out and get her a new skirt which means she'll be in isolation until the weekend. It's ridiculous.

I agree.
I went on a bus the other day and sat opposite 4 school-girls all in short, tight skirts that showed their knickers. They looked like they were auditioning for Porn Hub.

When I went to secondary school girls wore trousers or skirts, boy trousers. Boys had shirt tie and v neck and girls had open neck blouses and v neck jumpers.

Some girls rolled up their skirt but it wasn't a massive problem.

The school was top in the town only behind the girls independent school.

Now it's all inspect length, no rolling up blazer sleeves, no taking blazer off unless in classroom with permission and uniform inspections on the way onto class and negative points put on system for anyone not up to standard.

For the first time in forever it's now gone from outstanding to good. The learning isn't great with a lower progress 8 than other schools in the area - and this is a school feeding an area of leafy middle class dwellers who come from primaries in the same sort of area.

When your lesson starter becomes about uniform and negative points and results are affected you aren't doing it right.

I strongly suggest you ask that question, and why they don't recognise the fact that children grown and it's not reasonable to expect parents to replace skirts every three months or whatever. This school clearly has its priorities all wrong.

itsgettingweird
For the first time in forever it's now gone from outstanding to good. The learning isn't great with a lower progress 8 than other schools in the area - and this is a school feeding an area of leafy middle class dwellers who come from primaries in the same sort of area.

When your lesson starter becomes about uniform and negative points and results are affected you aren't doing it right.

It's a little disingenuous to make a like for like comparison. What used to be required for an "Outstanding" grade result under previous frameworks is nothing compared to what is expected now. The old "Outstanding" barely even compares to the new "Good".

Progress 8 must be looked at with attainment rather than in isolation. Schools with higher attaining intakes for Y7 will find it harder to generate higher Progress 8 scores than those with lower attaining intakes as the grades only go so high.

Already emailed the Head and year head and am waiting a response. They have form for not responding to me though, and her Dad doesn't really care.

This is what really gets me. The schools care more about what pupils are wearing than actually teaching them. Your DD wasn't causing any trouble, and yet she’s in isolation. It's ridiculous!

My daughters school are only allowed branded skirts so there are no other options.

The easiest way to solve it is to ban skirts.
uniform can be smart trousers and polo shirts for both genders. Smart shorts for summer too to make it fair (the boys forever complain how unfair it is girls get to wear skirts whilst they have to wear trousers in heatwaves).
completely gender neutral too for those declaring themselves as trans or non binary.

As with everything, it’s just much more extreme nowadays. Girls have always rolled up their skirts, but in earlier times it would have been embarrassing to know that your pants were on display. By the time I’ve walked a few meters to school with my younger kids I’ve seen the actual bum crack of several children. It’s a safeguarding issue really isn’t it? I once saw one who was unaware her whole skirt had ridden up (because it’s so short) and her whole bum and thong were on display! If underage girls were posing in their pants online most parents and teachers would be concerned. Schools must be at the absolute end of their tether. I can sympathise really with bringing in draconian rules because girls are pushing what is reasonable to the absolute extreme so that it’s indecent. It’s our job as adults to tell children what’s acceptable and what’s not in certain settings.

This ^

The skirts in my daughters high school have to be knee length and I think they look so scruffy! They have these big, thick, pleated knee length skirts, blazers that are far to big for most of the kids & knee high socks. It honestly looks a mess when I've looked at the pictures online of the kids. My daughter rolls hers up so it just above the knee and I think it looks better. It gives the skirt more shape and doesn't looks like a big block of mess. If she's told to roll it down though she does and she knows that if she gets a detention for it then that's on her.

For teen girls a skirt that is about an inch above the knee looks best and is also modest. Of course some kids will always try it on but they do about everything else. That’s life. Parents never do the kid favours by taking the kid’s side as they have ultimately to learn the lessons of life which sometimes are not fair!

my school made us wear skirts, only rules were they weren't allowed to be above knee length, most girls rolled the waist band until the back split was up their backsides and were constantly being told to pull them back down.

i rebelled the other way, i wore long skirts as there were no rules on length that way.. so i was the kid floating about in a long flowy skirt and Dr Marten boots xD

My DDs school allow skirts, trousers, or tailored shorts, nearly all the girls wear trousers.

@crabo an inch ABOVE the knee? No way - it looks ridiculous and really unflattering on most girls. That's far to short.

I’m going to get shot down here BUT you know the school uniform regs before your child starts. If you don’t like it maybe you should reconsider.

My daughter went to a school with a very strict uniform policy and tbh I applaud the school for upholding it. She obviously flouted it on occasions- non reg hoodie under blazer in winter etc… but she felt pride in putting it on every day - and let me tell you her going out dress code often brought a tear to me eye.

If uniform policy’s are implemented I do feel a sense of pride and belonging can follow

If you have hips (coming from someone who has always had large hips), the last thing you want to be wearing is skinny styles trousers...

Because some girls wear their skirts so short that you can see what colour, and style, of knickers they are wearing if you walk behind them. No one needs to be walking around with their literal bum being exposed from the bottom of their skirt. (And I dread to think what the front looks like)

I mean I rolled up my skirt an inch or two so it was mid thigh. But there needs to be a limit.

Maybe if schools chose a uniform that the kids actually like and feel comfortable wearing there wouldn’t be these issues.

My girls have both left secondary school now but while they were there, the uniform requirements got more and more convoluted as time went on.

When they started there it was sensible - black trousers/a line skirts with a white shirt, black V neck jumper and a grey blazer - all of which you could buy from anywhere, and just buy a logo patch from school to sew onto the blazer.

Then the year after my youngest started it became an academy and the uniform changed and it all got more and more ridiculous.

The black, A line skirt became an ugly tartan kilt that could only be bought from the school, which had to be a certain length - except size availability was rubbish and the correct size waistband for my DDs wasn’t long enough

Black trousers - the legs had to be a minimum width all the way down, anything that tapered at the ankle, even very slightly, meant isolation.

The grey blazer had to have striped lining (only available from the school uniform shop of course) because it meant staff could see if sleeves had been rolled turned up - I mean, god forbid anyone rolled their sleeves up. Couldn’t be removed, even in blazing heat, without permission from the class teacher. One memorable year, school staff were sent out around the streets at home time to make sure no one removed the bloody thing on their way home.

On the flip side, in winter, they were not allowed to wear coats to school until the permission text was sent out by the head.

I did my bit, supported the school, purchased said uniform, made sure they left the house suitably attired, but did think it was absolutely ridiculous.

As the parent of a SEN child , who spent an inordinate amount of time sorting shit out and fighting for stuff I shouldn’t have to fight for, I always thought they would have had more important things to worry about than whether DD’s blazer sleeves were rolled up, but apparently not.

One of mine is now at uni, the other at college. Both managing to learn stuff despite being allowed to choose their own clothing.

The solution is to get rid of uniform and have a reasonable dress code but let them express their individuality through clothing if they want to. Instead of treating them as if they are in the armed forces or prison.

Both managing to learn stuff despite being allowed to choose their own clothing.

Exactly. Managing to learn more effectively I imagine now they aren't distracted by old fashioned, scratchy, stiff clothing.

There are no schools without draconian uniform policies and zero parental choice or influence in the matter.

If there were schools without uniform I'd be there like a shot.