SW London Private and Grammar - applying for Year 7 in 2023 (Part VI)

[QuiteAJourney]

Following from our previous thread (link below)

www.mumsnet.com/talk/secondary/4731973-sw-london-private-and-grammar-applying-for-year-7-in-2023-part-v?page=40&reply=123775541

Looking forward to continuing the journey together!

@Parent123456 I would be stunned if students are coming to school high! Is this what we're dealing with at secondary schools now?!

I don't know, 4 Y9 girls were expelled from a local south London coed private school this term for taking ketamine. At school...

Which school?

@Parent123456 I am a current parent with DD in y7 & y8 at SPGS. I have never heard these stories. Where are you getting this from? Current parents?

Please! It’s high time we stop believing and spreading such rumors.

(P.S: what’s wrong with a girl wanting to pierce her own skin? If it’s a cultural issue or forbidden in the family, a public forum may not be the best place to discuss it)

I am wondering if anyone, who has been through the 11+ with a ds and dd could give me some insight on the level of competitiveness? Did you find it more difficult for boys? I feel like there are more options for girls in our area. My dd just finished the 11+, so now I am moving on to my ds. The school was not helpful with dd, so I doubt they would give any insight on what schools to consider for my ds.

@Chiswickmama it comes from a girl in y9.

@Workhar i am not trying to spread any rumours just want to understand and see if the school will be a good fit for my DD. I am not trying to debate on whether it is right or wrong to pierce your own body.

@Parent123456

girls coming with piercing (although not in Y7)
This is basically none of your business. How other people choose to run their families and the rules within them have nothing to do with you. Some of my daughter's friends have their ears pierced. I think that's about it so far. I don't see why older girls shouldn't do whatever the hell they like if their parents are OK with it.

some girls being high at 8.00 when they arrived at school
This sounds really unlikely. Where on earth did you get this from?

For parents with DD there, would you say the school really brings something different and what more than G&L or HB for example or or do you think your daughter would have done as well elsewhere?
It's not about grades. I'm pretty sure my daughter would have got much the same GCSE grades at our local comprehensive. This has been discussed on the other thread about St Paul's that you have posted on and probably elsewhere on MN many times over the years, though you might have to wade through a bit of 'alpha girl' nonsense. If you are mainly interested in grades, you might not like St Paul's.

some girls are being asked to leave if they want to chose a subject where their prediction of grades is not A/A*
What? Last year about 95% of grades were A or A*. Why would anyone be choosing their weakest subject for A level? I'm not aware of anyone being asked to leave for this reason.

Does anyone have an idea of movement at 6th form? It looks like the number of candidates at A level are lower than at GCSE?
Some people leave, some people join. You do realise that people take fewer A Levels than GCSEs per person, right?

We are quite a "strict" family
You might not like St Paul's. It's the opposite of strict.

@SamPoodle123 , if you live near Emmanuel you should enter your ds for the Emmanuel 10 plus to see if he likes preparing for exams and where he sits in his cohort - ie if he gets an offer. It's probably worth starting another thread re this.

@BonjourCrisette thanks for your answer but please don’t patronise me. I am sure you had some questions when your dd went through 11+. I am trying to get a feel and culture of the school and those are things that matters for me.
i am aware that you don’t sit as many gcse than a level but when there is a cohort of 105/106 girls in gcse and 90 something university destinations I am curious where the girls went knowing that some enter at 6th form.
you might be brilliant at maths in gcse but not willing to pursue an a level in maths but in English where your grade might be a bit lower thus my question on a level.

when there is a cohort of 105/106 girls in gcse and 90 something university destinations I am curious where the girls went knowing that some enter at 6th form

Some may be taking a year off/gap year? Some may be going to art school or drama school or conservatoire? Some may not have decided what they want to do next?

Y12 and 13 are much the same size as other years in the school.

People tend to do A Levels in the things they are best at and enjoy. I am not personally aware of anyone being managed out.

Released offers yesterday at WHS, NLCS and Wycombe. My DD always wanted SPGS but we liked equally all of these schools.
commute is much easier also so big factor.

Many thanks @redrobin75 I will try starting another thread about this. We live Emanuel and my ds will def apply there and to LU. I am trying to figure where else. I don't want to pull him out of his current school early, so we will just have to focus on the 11+. He is very happy at his school and w our youngest in nursery one more year, we are more then happy to save on tuition for his schooling for one more year while he is in state school. We will be paying for the youngest and the oldest next year, then the youngest goes to state school and then we will pay for the eldest and the middle dc :)

"usually they are allowed to stay if they agree to take the a level at a public examination centre so as not to tarnish the schools’ ratings should the fateful B or less occur. "

Is this the case in all super selective schools or just SPGS? Is this something to bear in mind about SPGS or a mute point as it happens other similar schools too?

“Yes managing out students who the school thinks will get a B or less at A level is not unheard of and even considered normal.”

This is so disheartening, these schools are the opposite of what a school should be, turfing out a child to a public examination centre on the threat of a B.

Damaging a bright child’s confidence because the school is worried about its image. Schools are meant to find the brilliance in every child and help them focus in on that and grow their confidence in that. These schools are focused on their own brilliance.

These are children who would be stars in a more balanced school and maybe even have a fun time in school but are instead being beaten down over, frankly inconsequential “B” grades in the fullness of time and left with mental health scars that will last them a lifetime.

Accepting this is like a form of Stockholm syndrome. Just terrible imho that this could be classed as normal or acceptable.

Thanks for releasing offers, that’s the correct and kind thing to do and congrats to your brilliant DD, that’s a fantastic set of offers.

It certainly doesn’t happen at DD’s school @freshair14 , but it does in a lot of places. So entry criteria to sixth form is a question to ask at offer days and actually check it in the sixth form details on the website. Most schools will just say ‘it’s automatic progression’ but in reality I know of kids in lots of schools - children of friends and colleagues - who have wanted to do specific A Level subjects but not been allowed without a grade 8/9 at some schools, even the grammar schools do this. It is to protect their results, and it’s a manipulation in my opinion. That’s why it’s an important question to ask - what is the requirement for Sixth Form/specific subjects? I know my friend’s daughter was at Nonsuch and got a 6 in Biology so was told she couldn’t stay there and do Biology so she left. Another was at KGS and a similar thing happened - she had only got one 8 in Art and was told she had to do Art even though she wanted to do English, which she only had a 6 in. My nephew is at Sutton Grammar and has been told he needs a 9 in maths to do maths A level - even an 8 isn’t good enough.

I think that’s how some schools get such high A Level results - because they override personal preference for subjects by pushing kids into certain subjects and maybe that’s for their own good, but I wanted to know DD has free choice in subjects as we don’t know now what subjects she’ll want and I don’t want any options closed off to her. It’s such an important area that I don’t want to think that if she has an off-day at gcse and ‘only’ gets a 7, that she then would be prevented from taking a subject she loves.

This is so important to consider when comparing league tables too - a school where the criteria is ‘you must have a 9 to do this subject at A level’ is likely to get better scores than one which says ‘you need a 6 in the subject’.

for example, a quick google…

KGS:
Please also note that a minimum of grade 7 is required in those subjects, or closely related subjects, that students wish to study for A Level or Pre-U with the exception of Mathematics where students will require a minimum grade 8 at GCSE and Further Mathematics where students will require a minimum grade 9 at GCSE.

wHS:
Our expected entry standard is high and we require entrants to achieve Grades 8 or 9 (A*/A) at GCSE (or equivalent) for the subjects to be studied at A Level;

surbiton:
You must achieve a 9 – 7 grade for the subjects you wish to study at A-level.

In order to access Mathematics, Physics, Chemistry and Biology A-level courses automatically, a 9 or 8 grade in those subjects is required.

emanuel:
For those who receive offers, it is expected that they will achieve an average of 7 or more in their GCSEs and at least 7s in all of the subjects they have chosen for A-Level, with the exception of Maths and Physics where you will require an 8.

@BookMan2 Amen to that - it is also a way of manipulating results without being public about it IMHO.

I've literally never heard of anyone this has happened to at SPGS.

Hope this is not the case in all the highly selective independent schools (face palm).

"Yes managing out students who the school thinks will get a B or less at A level is not unheard of and even considered normal."
I have also heard this for grammar schools (like TGS) that they need to improve or leave - and this leads to heavy tutoring for grammar school children.
But I am hoping this is a rumour and some TGS parents can confirm that this is not the case. Even if it were true - this would apply to highly selective independent schools as well I guess.

@SamPoodle123 - I have been through the process twice, with a DD (3 yrs ago) and now with my DS. Am away at the moment but will share thoughts when I get a chance but feel free to DM me.

@QuiteAJourney I see you are considering WHS. Happy to help with any questions - and of course anyone else in the same boat. DD is v happy in Y9 at WHS.

On a related topic, can KCS & G&L parents confirm if only the super bright are allowed to study IB in 6th form? Or is it a free choice?

That experimental contingent is there in every single school and has been there since time began. At my private school one girl had to leave as she fell pregnant and another was expelled for taking drugs on a school trip. (To this day why?!!!) That was 30 years ago!! 99% of us weren’t up to anything and we just hung with our mates a bit in our spare time and studied. It is absolutely nothing to worry about. If your child is going to get involved in that sort of thing they will find a way. Most children don’t get involved out of peer pressure- they tend to gravitate to peer groups that are similar to them and just gossip about the others.

@WimMum2015 it is the case at Tiffin:

18.1 For students wishing to study a science course at A Level, having followed a Combined Science course at GCSE, an average of a grade 7 is required.
18.2 For students wishing to study two or three sciences, having followed a Combined Science Course, an average grade of 8 or higher in the Combined Science Course is required.
18.3 For students wishing to study Biology, Chemistry or Physics, having taken separate GCSEs in Biology, Chemistry or Physics, a grade 7 or higher is required in the science to be studied in the Sixth Form.
18.4 For Economics, a grade 7 or higher at GCSE in English Language or English Literature and a grade 7 or higher at GCSE in Mathematics are required.
18.5 For Politics and Government, a grade 7 or higher in History, or English Literature or English Language is required.
18.6 For Music, it is expected that students will have passed Grade 5 Theory or General Musicianship before starting the course, and to be of minimum Grade 6 standard on an instrument. GCSE Music is not a requirement for this course.
18.7 For Further Mathematics, a grade 9 at GCSE Mathematics is required.
18.8 For Psychology, a grade 7 or higher at GCSE in English Language or English Literature and a grade 7 or higher at GCSE in Mathematics are required.
18.9 For Art and Design, Design and Technology, Drama, English Literature, French, Geography, German, History, Latin, Greek, Mathematics, Religion and Philosophy or Spanish, a grade 7 or higher is required at GCSE in the subject to be studied in the Sixth Form.