Called a ''Social Parasite'' -- for sending DC to grammar

[Basherbasher]

Ok, so long time lurker here. We live in a fully selective area (Kent) where around 25% of children go to the grammars, 10% go to independents, and 60-65% to the high schools (secondary moderns).

Up until fairly recently Kent had a couple of fully comprehensive schools, which were popular with left wing parents who did not support the 11+ system (St Simon Stock in Maidstone and Homewood Comp in Tenterden). SSS is a Christian school, Homewood a community comp drawing from a wide area. My family and friendship circle have always tended to favour these two comprehensives, shunning the grammars. Historically both schools would send pupils to Russell Group universities each year, with St Simon Stock even sending 3-4 pupils per year to Oxbridge colleges.

Anyway, we opted to send our DC to a Maidstone grammar school. But we could never have anticipated the animosity this has resulted in both towards us as parents and to our son. We have even been called 'social parasites' for our decision to send our child to a grammar.

My question is: is this accusation made against gs parents of being or acting like a 'social parasite' something which is a typically held view amongst parents who are supportive of comprehensive or community schools? Does anyone else feel guilty or a sense of shame for having sent their child to grammar school?

Things have become so bad and this is causing such a rift in the family that I am tempted to uproot DS from his grammar school and relocate over the border to Sussex (fully comprehensive area). To be clear this isn't an issue of jealousy or envy as many of our friends and family are professionals with highly able children who could have passed for the grammars. It is much more of a political issue in the sense that we are seen (as a family) as having behaved selfishly and snobbishly.

Thank you,

Basher

Thank you! Honestly I was thinking it was weird a group of professionals working it support families to manage assets would be anti academic separation!

You seem surprised that a non-grammar school has “even” sent some pupils to Oxbridge so yes that suggests some snobbery/attitude problems on your part.

Why would anyone want you to send your child to a secondary modern school when they could go the sister grammar school? These are 2 sides of the same coin.
I am all for a decent eduction for everyone, and can see how the grammar school system disadvantages those who can't go to the grammar, but you don't have another option. You didn't create the system, and I don't think it's reasonable to expect you send your child to a faith school if that is not in accordance with your beliefs. I don't think faith schools should exist in a comprehensive system either, tbh.
But in your area there is a selective system, based on faith and ability. It sucks but what are you supposed to do?
It is none if anyone else's business ,and if they are disparaging of your choice, you can explain your reasons or tell them fuck off.

I really don't get people who would judge a friend on something like this which is absolutely none of their business. I couldn't give a shit how friends chose to educate their kids. People like this are so intolerant it's unreal.

My in-laws fell out with DH and I and top of the list of reasons was grammar schools. Most of my friends know DD well and respect us for our choice and know it was the right fit to send her to a grammar.

We had the choice of a grammar which was our nearest secondary school and that DD could walk to or the comprehensive (live in a borough with only two superselective grammars so the non-selective schools are still described as comprehensive) two buses away and failing.

I'm surprised by the posters saying 'I'm against grammar schools and wouldn't do what you have done'. I also live in a grammar area and am massively against the grammar system. I hate it with a passion - it's unfair, regressive and favours privilege. It's also pretty shitty in the way that it divides kids up at the age of 11 into 'you're good enough' and 'you're not good enough' camps - the affect this has (in both camps) can't be underestimated - I've witnessed both the sense of failure, and the sense of superiority, each group of kids feel. It's utterly horrible and needs to be scrapped.

However, if you live within the system, as OP does, then your hands are tied. If the best school in your area for your kid is the grammar, as painful as this might be ideologically, then it's totally understandable that you have to work with what you've got. In my area, there are grammar schools and other schools that range from pretty shit to OKish. Surely it would be wrong to send your child to the wrong school for them based on your own ideology?

My children aren't at secondary age yet but when they get there, the thing I'm going to really struggle with is the fact that the test has been devised to virtually require tutoring... It's an incredibly difficult test to pass unless you understand what is required of you from it (gone are the days of some comprehension and maths questions, like I did for my 11+ years ago) so, yet again, it'll only be those who are willing and able to tutor that will pass. What's more, primary schools don't teach the test yet local private prep schools do - the whole thing just reeks of money and privilege. It's disgusting. So - if you feel how I do, and the right school for your child in the area is the grammar, do you properly buy into the system (literally), despite how sick it makes you feel, or do you not and let them go to the less good school, even though it isn't right for them?

This is why I don’t employ anyone left-leaning. Holier-than-though ‘holes.

This ^^ with bells on

In a sense my family and friends are right, because I am essentially trying to ‘profit’ by differentiating or stigmatizing children who won’t be attending the grammar schools.

viewed through the prism of Christian socialism or secular democratic socialism, one can understand the historic appeal to maintain some islands of conprehensivisation in an ocean of selection.

But in a system where parents cannot express a comprehensive preference, which is how it’s been in Kent for some time now, we bit the bullet and went for a gs.

the gs is as nasty, snobbish and blinkered as one could imagine. Our fellow parents are neurotic beyond belief, maniacally obsessing over the children’s superiority and difference over non gs children.

But I knew all of what I have said before the decision was taken. Our DS will need to carry this cross for the rest of his days.

OP, are you feeling ok??????

Half you posts sound like you are writing an essay and the other half sounds irrational and a bit mad! We are at a grammar and I don't know any people who match this profile 😂.

nasty, snobbish and blinkered as one could imagine. Our fellow parents are neurotic beyond belief, maniacally obsessing over the children’s superiority and difference over non gs children.

If you are feeling that conflicted, it's best you take your son out and leave that GS place for someone who appreciates it.

I’d happily lose the ‘friends’ and tolerate the family in your situation. I went to an excellent grammar school and had a wonderful time. If we were in an area with Grammar schools I’d be absolutely delighted if my child could attend one.

nasty, snobbish and blinkered as one could imagine. Our fellow parents are neurotic beyond belief, maniacally obsessing over the children’s superiority and difference over non gs children
Yeah, no. Don't believe a word of it.

Sending DD to grammar school imploded our wider family. DH no longer talks to his brother and his wife. Brother has poisoned wider family against us.

Do I regret sending Dd to grammar? No. It works for her and she is thriving. The family can all sod off.

But I knew all of what I have said before the decision was taken. Our DS will need to carry this cross for the rest of his days.
Oh, ffs, op! You can't be serious?

Totally jumped the shark with that one.

I cannot tell you how hard it’s been for DS to start at his grammar school with the eyes of other socialists and their children on him. I can solve this at a stroke by simply moving across the Sussex border. I fear this schism in our family will never truly heal.

Others here have also spoken of rifts, fallings out, implosions even. Not everyone is content in their (justified?) selfishness to segregate children at 11, to attempt to ‘profit’ at the expense of other children.

some of us are deeply conflicted and wrestle with this on a daily basis.

Well yes @Basherbasher this is the flipside of grammar schools – no one ever campaigned for more secondary moderns (DD2 went to one).

I hate the 11+ system – making irrevocable decisions about a 10-year-old's future educational path based on a single, non-curriculum based test, taken on one random day is morally and educationally dubious. Children mature at different ages, and 10 is far too young to make that decision.

But given your (lack of) options, your choice os perfectly valid.

From their entrance criteria St Simons still doesn't select on ability and Homewood takes 20% on "aptitude", which in the MC population you describe was probably already the case.

What stopped you continuing with your plan to apply to one of them?

Don’t allow yourself to be conflicted

you know you made the appropriate choice for your child given the local situation

honestly don’t lose a wink of sleep over any of this. It’s only what’s important for your child that matters

anyone offer their opinion? Tell them you’re not interested

you do you. That’s all that any of us can do. As long as your child is happy, that’s all that matters

'I cannot tell you how hard it’s been for DS to start at his grammar school with the eyes of other socialists and their children on him.'
This sounds like you live in a batty socialist worker cult.....Saint Jeremy Corbyn apparently divorced his wife because she wanted their child to go to a Grammar School. That tells you all you need to know about these ridiculous politically-driven attitudes.
As someone else has said there is no such thing as true equality in a free society as educated parents will always be able to help with homework/pay tutors/buy resources. Thank goodness.
Even in Scotland where there are no Grammar schools, there is a thriving private school sector in Edinburgh, Glasgow, Aberdeen and Dundee.
Parents will always do what they perceive to be best for their kids and there is nothing wrong with this.

Your comrades need to lighten up. Providing your ds with a good education is not selfish, it's sensible. Living is selfish, having children is mega selfish.
Is it selfish to go to University? To buy a home? To own a smart phone, a car? Well yes, all those things could be considered equally selfish. A GS education doesn't deprive kids who don't pass the 11+ of anything. Secondary moderns can be great schools depending on funding, intake and quality of leadership and teaching. They just go at a slightly slower pace than GS, which will suit those who are academically not as bright or mature later.

@Basherbasher what will you ultimately do, it sounds like you hate the GS?

I live in Kent and the 11+ grammar schools is a pull for some. To us, it's just the way it is.
My daughter didn't pass, no big deal, went to the local all girl comp, did very well at GCSE and A level and decided against university. She has a great job within the Met Police which she enjoys, pays well and offers lots of career progression. She's buying a place next year and drives a BMW car. No way would I have pressurised her to go to uni.
Son passed, he's at grammar school and doing well but doesn't want to go to uni.
Living in Kent, as I have all my life, it's one of those things you accept. My daughters school is still a good school.
My son passed and so is an outstanding selective grammar but he doesn't like it. I've offered to try to get him moved to a less competitive grammar or the local comp but he doesn't want to as he has lots of friends at school. He thinks he'll dislike all school.
My family are mixed grammar v comp but happy to report, they've all done well.
Ps I never tutored either of mine (mum went to a really pushy independent and always said to me 'money doesn't buy brains'.)

Fuck them. Glad they dont teach my kids. How mealy mouthed. And easy to decide to take the lefty high road as a teacher when you presumably have the ability to tutor them yourself at home.

These people are not your friend and you are completely entitled to make whatever decision you feel suits your child when it comes to schooling.

If they're all so dead set against grammars, why don't they move to some county where the non grammar options are awful, and send their children to school there?

They are only able to call you a social parasite because their alternatives are good schools in nice middle class areas.

What are they doing to improve schools in parts of the county where schools are poor?

What you're hearing is champagne socialism, the voice of privilege.

Oh, I'm in Bexley so our kids sit both the Bexley and Kent tests.
My daughter didn't pass either but us doing very well.
Son passed both - higher pass mark with the Kent than with bexley but the Dartford grammars seemed too intense. I'm not in favour of the IBacc which some schools only offer and I feel are only open to 'good all rounders' and many kids are not allowed to continue sixth form if they don't get the required grades at GCSE.