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Secondary education

Connect with other parents whose children are starting secondary school on this forum.

Original poster

Unwanted School Imposition

186 replies

LisaRear · 04/10/2021 09:47

Before the summer holiday, my DS's year was given a range of exams after coming back from Covid home education. The general results were poor for the whole year. The school is now seeking to impose a move into some easier subjects for many of these pupils, we feel to manage their generally good history of results. All the previous results for our boy contradict his own result, but the school is not budging. Apart from removal, or private, what remedy, legal or otherwise, do we have? We strongly feel that these subject choices will impact the future and wish to negotiate a longer evaluation period (such as up to Christmas), while some home support kicks in to ensure success. But the school is unwilling for this, we suppose as it might create a precedent.

OP posts:
Bookmarket · 04/10/2021 11:54

What does your son want to do? What is his view?

Original poster
LisaRear · 04/10/2021 11:58

@Bookmarket

What does your son want to do? What is his view?
He is a quiet boy and does not want to be in the middle of any conflict, so I am shielding him from this but basing my approach on my familiarity with his previously consistently high marks and engagement, pre this unfortunate half-year bump.
OP posts:
Bookmarket · 04/10/2021 12:02

Is he bothered that he will do combined scienes rather than x3 single? If he's not, is he really likely to put in extra effort outside of school?

poolblue · 04/10/2021 12:03

As an earlier poster has mentioned, doing combined science rather than three separate sciences won't stop him from studying A level chemistry, biology or physics.

There are plenty of law firms who will take your money - business is business after all, but you really need to ask yourself why you are doing this. Just to make a point? To prove the school 'wrong'?
Save your money and don't put yourself or your son through a costly and stressful process.

Innocenta · 04/10/2021 12:05

If he doesn't engage well with online learning, why do you think it will be different with these online resources? It seems like you have unreasonable expectations for him, honestly.

Comefromaway · 04/10/2021 12:06

Honestly, you are not going to get anywhere and it's not worth the time, effort or stress to you.

There will be no detriment to your son and it may even advantage him.

Bookmarket · 04/10/2021 12:07

Will his current school allow him to do science A levels with combined science?

BungleandGeorge · 04/10/2021 12:10

You posted about catching up 2 minutes before me so no I didn’t see that. But tbh this is a difficult and packed term as it is, trying to fit in the catch up work on top may do him no favours. He may be able but there’s a limit to how much one person can achieve. And it’s unclear whether he will be able to participate fully in his lessons if the other kids are all ahead of him as so much of science builds on basic principles. How was his attainment in his other subjects? If he was in year 10 I might agree with you but I think this is going to be extremely stressful for him. A 1/2 year out of a 2 year course is a significant amount. There’s also no guarantee that there won’t be more periods of remote learning.

Bookmarket · 04/10/2021 12:15

If he looks to be soaring in his other subjects, the school are not going to register him as someone who has just struggled with lockdown learning as his data profile won't show that.

Original poster
LisaRear · 04/10/2021 12:23

@Bookmarket

Is he bothered that he will do combined scienes rather than x3 single? If he's not, is he really likely to put in extra effort outside of school?
He is obviously still a child so a wider perspective is not his at present. He was shocked to be advised with the others of the change and so I think that's percolating down. He knows he has to put in the extra effort and has already begun to do so, since we saw the results for the sciences (individually and collectively) at term's end.
OP posts:
Original poster
LisaRear · 04/10/2021 12:24

@Bookmarket

If he looks to be soaring in his other subjects, the school are not going to register him as someone who has just struggled with lockdown learning as his data profile won't show that.
Some things come naturally, others take a little additional concentration.
OP posts:
Original poster
LisaRear · 04/10/2021 12:26

@Innocenta

If he doesn't engage well with online learning, why do you think it will be different with these online resources? It seems like you have unreasonable expectations for him, honestly.
My expectations are based upon 10 plus years of observation.

Watching a class lecture for 40 minutes is different to engaging with tightly coordinated tests which then outline areas lacking and allow a focus upon those.

OP posts:
Original poster
LisaRear · 04/10/2021 12:30

@BungleandGeorge

You posted about catching up 2 minutes before me so no I didn’t see that. But tbh this is a difficult and packed term as it is, trying to fit in the catch up work on top may do him no favours. He may be able but there’s a limit to how much one person can achieve. And it’s unclear whether he will be able to participate fully in his lessons if the other kids are all ahead of him as so much of science builds on basic principles. How was his attainment in his other subjects? If he was in year 10 I might agree with you but I think this is going to be extremely stressful for him. A 1/2 year out of a 2 year course is a significant amount. There’s also no guarantee that there won’t be more periods of remote learning.
Attainment good otherwise. This is just going to be a period of 9 months crunch for the exams - test, evaluate, patch, repeat.
OP posts:
Original poster
LisaRear · 04/10/2021 12:32

As a side comment, I'm quite shocked at how many effectively believe that 'school knows best' here. Sadly, this is not always the case and often issues like these are very political for those wider organisation and those at different layers within the structure.

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Comefromaway · 04/10/2021 12:34

Oh, believe me, I am NOT a school knows best person. I've battled with the system for years (clever boy with SEN) and have had my kids in both state and private.

But in this instance I believe the school are probably right. People get very hung up about triple science. It would be totally different if it was a Foundation/Higher situation

crazycrofter · 04/10/2021 12:38

My ds is in year 11 at a selective school and didn’t cope well with online learning. His school are delaying deciding about combined/triple science entry until after the mocks in December.

Ds’ end of year 10 exam results are probably borderline, but we’re probably going to request he does combined because it’s one less GCSE to revise for. Year 11 is a nightmare with so many exams to revise for. Combined science won’t stop him doing a Science A Level if he wants to. I’m not sure why you’re so concerned about it?

Original poster
LisaRear · 04/10/2021 12:39

@Comefromaway

Oh, believe me, I am NOT a school knows best person. I've battled with the system for years (clever boy with SEN) and have had my kids in both state and private.

But in this instance I believe the school are probably right. People get very hung up about triple science. It would be totally different if it was a Foundation/Higher situation

Very similar circs here, though was originally considered SEN at the upper end.

I would be very content as a compromise for the school to have my child do 2 science in school and one at home. But state inflexible, unlike paid.

OP posts:
Original poster
LisaRear · 04/10/2021 12:42

@crazycrofter

My ds is in year 11 at a selective school and didn’t cope well with online learning. His school are delaying deciding about combined/triple science entry until after the mocks in December.

Ds’ end of year 10 exam results are probably borderline, but we’re probably going to request he does combined because it’s one less GCSE to revise for. Year 11 is a nightmare with so many exams to revise for. Combined science won’t stop him doing a Science A Level if he wants to. I’m not sure why you’re so concerned about it?

Because I wish him to continue on and do all three subjects to the required level, not a more superficial coverage that's reminiscent of the old divide between CSE/GCE. Because if I saw combined science on a CV it would cause me to have some initial assumptions.
OP posts:
Bookmarket · 04/10/2021 12:44

Have you had a meeting with the school to get a clearer picture of why this decision was made? Where his exam results sit within his cohort? Have you spoken with them about his difficulties learning science content via remote learning? Can he convince his teachers that he has been doing extra work since those poor test results? Will they assess him again?

Comefromaway · 04/10/2021 12:45

Private are not more flexible. If you disagree with them, they just ask you to remove your child.

Original poster
LisaRear · 04/10/2021 12:48

@Bookmarket

Have you had a meeting with the school to get a clearer picture of why this decision was made? Where his exam results sit within his cohort? Have you spoken with them about his difficulties learning science content via remote learning? Can he convince his teachers that he has been doing extra work since those poor test results? Will they assess him again?
Not yet, just a series of email communications. I'm in receipt of the complaints policy and formulating this before offering a counter-option.

We have the year average and my boy's, his is about two marks under the year. My compromise will be - as mentioned well above - that he continues until December and then if results are not sufficient, I'll happily defer. Or they can retest now.

OP posts:
Original poster
LisaRear · 04/10/2021 12:49

@Comefromaway

Private are not more flexible. If you disagree with them, they just ask you to remove your child.
Not in my experience. depends I suppose on the school and the circumstances.
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Comefromaway · 04/10/2021 12:49

Your assumptions would be wrong then. Combined science is not a more superficial coverage.

Foundation level (in both combined and triple) is easier.

TeenMinusTests · 04/10/2021 12:54

Because I wish him to continue on and do all three subjects to the required level, not a more superficial coverage that's reminiscent of the old divide between CSE/GCE. Because if I saw combined science on a CV it would cause me to have some initial assumptions.

This is in no way the same as CSE v O level. There is absolutely nothing 'superficial' about combined science. If that is your assumption you are starting from the wrong place. Many highly intelligent pupils choose to take combined science, either so they can do an extra option, or so they can focus on getting top grades on 2/3rds content rather than average grades on 3 GCSEs.
There is a hell of a lot of content in combined.

The more I read the more I think you should listen to the school, as your assumptions are way off.

myrtleWilson · 04/10/2021 12:55

Just echoing your assumptions about combined are wrong. Many schools only offer combined. Plus post a-levels and degree a CV would only list number attained at grade range and confirmation of specific grade requirements met for (usually) Maths and English.
It seems to me your assumptions are possibly driving a decision that may not be in your son's best interests.

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