Attending a Catholic School as a non-practicing Catholic

[KateBlush]

My DD is highly likely to be allocated a place a Catholic Girls School tomorrow. I'm interested in what her day-to-day experience might be like for non-practicing pupil.

From school visits and communication coming out of the school, its catholic culture seems pretty all-pervading. DH is catholic (I'm Anglican) and our children are baptised catholic, but religion is not part of our daily lives and if pushed, we both feel pretty negative about the church. It's an 'outstanding' school and academically very strong. It's also unapologetically old-fashioned - combined with the faith factor this worries me a bit - might this be a potentially stifling environment for a non-catholic?

Do any of you have children at faith schools where the faith is not a determining factor for you - how do your children fare? Do they feel excluded in any way? Does it feature in every part of their school experience? Thank you.

one of my kids is at catholic school and we are not religious. the extended family on both sides is culturally catholic, but noone actively practices.
I actually got my kid in as I thought it seemed best suited due to SEN provision after another school didnt work out, so i named it on the EHCP and they had to take him.
Its a nice school but its also a bit old fashioned compared to the other one and im not 100% convinced its the best place for him as he finds the religious part hard going, but I dont feel guilty about not being religious as such because its still a state school and he has as much right to be there as anybody. I actually think its nice for him to learn about the catholic faith and I think it gives a good moral framework.

@Wondermule I'm honestly confused about whether you've mixed me up with someone else or read my post wrongly, as your attack came out of nowhere from my point of view.

@Wondermule I meant that it would be possible to say the admissions criteria was unfair to prioritise non-Catholic children, not that parents should lie about their child's baptism/church attendance. I'm not sure if that's how you somehow interpreted it.

I have also never mocked any faith, and I don't have DC at a Catholic school.

[quote ChildOfFriday]@Wondermule I'm honestly confused about whether you've mixed me up with someone else or read my post wrongly, as your attack came out of nowhere from my point of view. [/quote]
I think I have, please accept my sincerest apologies. My comment was meant for the poster who admitted pretending to go to church to get a school place then disrespecting the Catholics when they got there.

It seems we actually share the same stance. I’m very sorry to have upset you.

Sorry, to prioritise Catholic children, not non-Catholic

My comment was meant for @Lockandtees

@Wondermule Ok thank you

I think it really depends on the school. I went to a Catholic private school in Scotland and it was pretty faith heavy. (Although we didn't have prayers in every class).

We have a small chapel on site where there was Friday mass and every day during Lent. We have benediction (don't think any of us enjoyed this as very boring for teens) monthly. We did have retreats but they were more themed around things like over coming things and friendship etc.

We have a few non-catholic girls I think some were Muslim and some were orthodox. However the vast majority were Catholic.

Oh and we had to do RE to S6 rather than dropping it when we started our highers. But it was nice chance to be with friends in an non exam pressure class. We watched a lot of videos.

Edit: for the Friday and daily mass it wasn't compulsory just if you wanted to go.

I thought GCSE RE was compulsory in all schools now. My DDs certainly had to choose it as an option and they were at a non-denominational school (much to my very catholic mothers horror )

I currently work at an Anglican school and have worked at Catholic schools in the past. As PPs have said, Catholic schools have a huge variety of offerings from very strictly faith based education to those that just brush the surface.

Most Catholic schools (in my experience) have a large minority of practicing Catholic students (around 40%) with many more like your DD - baptised/born to Catholic parents so nominally Catholic, but not personally religious/believing. So your DD will have plenty of other students in the same boat.

Biggest day to day differences are likely to be: prayers in assembly, whole-school or yeargroup Mass (perhaps once a week or just on a few days a year), RS GCSE which is mainly Catholic faith based. I doubt your DD will feel stifled by the faith unless it's a very Catholic school. (Worth pointing out that my DH went to a Catholic school - I didn't - and he got a much better sex ed/critical thinking/well rounded education than I did!)

That said I would seriously reconsider sending your child to a Catholic school if you are so anti-Church. Non-practicing is one thing but you say you feel negative about the church - is this really what you want for your child? How would you feel if your child ended up loving the religious aspect? Or having close Catholic friends? Things to consider before accepting any offers.

Thanks everyone. You've been so helpful. Allocation email just through and DD got a different (non faith) school entirely. We're all delighted. All the best.

Phew

@Lockandtees

No other parents will be paying for my kids to attend a faith schools. Faith schools (at least where I live) are entirely funded by the tax payer. I have as much right to have my children educated in one as anyone else.

Er, no they’re not. We have been over this, I suggest you read my previous posts. Faith schools are in part paid for by their Church, which in turn is funded by worshippers. And you didn’t have any right at all, thats why you pretended to be a Catholic.

You seem completely oblivious to the issue that non-faith kids are often offered an inferior education and, at the very least, a limited choice of schools. There is a absolutely no justification for that. There is no place for religion within schools in a secular society. If you are religious and want your children to have a religious education then you can provide that for them in your own time and at your own expense. Not at the expense of tax payer who predominantly are not religious.

You feel very strongly against religious schools yet happily sent your kids to one when it suits you. Honestly the lack of self awareness is staggering.

However, given the system as it currently stands I have no choice but to have my kids baptised and grudgingly attend church every week to get them a place at the “good” school. The alternative is a non religious school which is underperforming. What would you do in my shoes? Send your kids to a shit school? Of course you wouldn’t.

I would be honest and look into other options. You can be deceitful if you want, but you can’t be outraged when the parents of kids you’ve deprived of places through dishonesty get annoyed about it can you?

Who needs parents to teach them honesty and honour when they can bag them some GCSEs 🙄

The school buildings and land of Catholic schools are owned by the Catholic Church. The Church provides these premises, at no charge, to enable the state to fulfil its obligation to provide education for the population

Yes, the building ownership is one reason why faith schools haven't either been abolished or forced to open their admissions to all. Another reason is the churches' powerful lobbying capacity and their unelected hold over the House of Lords. And of course the schools are still very popular with a substantial electorate of voters who use them.

But the Churches' historic wealth was not always morally gained, so I don't think anyone will lose too much sleep over using one of their buildings, especially when they are contributing financially to its upkeep.

I went to catholic schools and was taught by nuns. The religious brainwashing was constant and relentless. For thirteen years.

In primary, almost the entirety of Year 3 was spent preparing us for our first confession and first communion. Year 7 was dominated by preparing us for confirmation. In secondary school, we were taught that masturbation, contraception & sex outside of marriage were sinful. Children were taught that abortion was a ‘mortal sin’ in all cases, including rape. The school had a large ‘Justice & Peace Group’, comprised of priests, nuns, teachers and pupils. The primary purpose of this group was anti-abortion campaigning & activism both inside and outside school.

This was in the 1980s, and while some things may have changed, the primary purpose of catholic schools will always be to create more practicing catholics.

If you are going to consider sending your child to catholic schools you need to understand exactly what that means in practice.

OP, my youngest child is at at Catholic school. We are not religious at all (have never rejected religion, as it was never there for us to reject - we are just completely 'areligous'). It's all absolutely fine. It is not doing her any harm, and it's a great school.

@ScrabbleOriginal

The school buildings and land of Catholic schools are owned by the Catholic Church. The Church provides these premises, at no charge, to enable the state to fulfil its obligation to provide education for the population

Yes, the building ownership is one reason why faith schools haven't either been abolished or forced to open their admissions to all. Another reason is the churches' powerful lobbying capacity and their unelected hold over the House of Lords. And of course the schools are still very popular with a substantial electorate of voters who use them.

But the Churches' historic wealth was not always morally gained, so I don't think anyone will lose too much sleep over using one of their buildings, especially when they are contributing financially to its upkeep.

Morally gained? Maybe hundreds of years ago, but the money today is collected from the hard working congregation.

Look you can justify it how you want, lying to gain a school place is as morally wrong as benefit fraud, or any other type of dishonesty.

Like I said I have zero problems with non Catholics going to Catholic schools when they’ve been offered a place through a fair and honest application.

urgh - OP, you wrote your post while I was coming back to mine. Glad you have got a place at a school you are happy with.

@BigSandyBalls2015

I thought GCSE RE was compulsory in all schools now. My DDs certainly had to choose it as an option and they were at a non-denominational school (much to my very catholic mothers horror )

I think (may be wrong) that studying RE is compulsory to Year 11 in all state schools, but the GCSE isn't. However, some schools take the view that if the kids are studying it anyway they may as well take the GCSE, and make it compulsory for their pupils.

@KateBlush Congratulations on your school allocation! Glad to hear you're pleased with it

Morally gained? Maybe hundreds of years ago, but the money today is collected from the hard working congregation.

@Wondermule, no, the upkeep of the school buildings is funded 90% by the Government and 10% by the parents' voluntary contributions, including the non-Catholic parents' contributions.

If the Church withdrew it's buildings from the state school system it would have to pay for 100% of their upkeep.

Some diocesesan authorities pool the funds for maintaining church and school buildings, which is why you may construe that the church congregations contribute to the the upkeep of the school buildings, but by that logic the school parents (including the non-RC ones).also help to maintain the church buildings.

@ScrabbleOriginal

Morally gained? Maybe hundreds of years ago, but the money today is collected from the hard working congregation.

@Wondermule, no, the upkeep of the school buildings is funded 90% by the Government and 10% by the parents' voluntary contributions, including the non-Catholic parents' contributions.

If the Church withdrew it's buildings from the state school system it would have to pay for 100% of their upkeep.

Some diocesesan authorities pool the funds for maintaining church and school buildings, which is why you may construe that the church congregations contribute to the the upkeep of the school buildings, but by that logic the school parents (including the non-RC ones).also help to maintain the church buildings.

The money comes from the Church. The Church saves the taxpayer tens of millions of pounds a year by loaning it’s land and school buildings for free.

On this topic, all usual mumsnet fairness and logic goes out the window - it becomes acceptable to lie and cheat, at the expense of others.

Let’s just use a theoretical example because I think the fact it’s ‘religion’ makes people feel entitled to abuse it.

Say your child has been going to gymnastics since they were very little, have lots of friends there, really enjoy it and you’re very involved with their club. There is a school which specialises in gymnastics (yes I know that doesn’t happen!), but your child loses out on it to a parent who lies about their child enjoying gymnastics because the school is ‘better’ then their alternatives. The kid that gets the place then never goes to gymnastics, never uses the resources, while your child has to be separated from their friends and a school that fits them, all because of the other parents lying. How would you feel? Knowing they got that place through actual dishonesty?