When parents are slagging off the local comp...

[Everyoneafter3]

I've posted before about my concerns over the local secondary, which, thanks to comments on this board and an excellent recent Ofsted, are very much allayed. I had a very good read of school newsletters etc and am much happier. Dd1 (Y4) is musically gifted and will also audition for a specialist music school.

The area in which we live is very affluent: many children round here go to fee-paying independent schools. These dc are going to school and telling my dd (and others) that the local secondary is rubbish ("my mum and dad say..."). One particularly stupid parent has said at home that "no child of mind will set foot in x school" which of course is coming back home with our dd.

Dd1 has now got it into her head that the local school is terrible, that she's really upset to go to not a good school, that she wishes we weren't poor (we're not! But no, we can't afford independent school fees without having to sacrifice other stuff we prioritise as a family). She's been researching exam results and all sorts.

For our part we've said well look at any local school she'd like to, although as we live across the road from the school in question it'd be unlikely that she'd get in.

I'm heartily sick of parents telling their dc how awful the local school is. It's simply not fair. My dc won't receive a 'lesser' education. They aren't going to a 'rubbish' school. If this continues I'm tempted to speak to their current primary school tbh. What else can I do? I've told dd to not listen, we've looked at the school website, talked about results (!) but I'm at a loss.

Wheredidallthejaffacakesgo
I went state as a kid. Sibling went private.
Different kids have different needs. Neither of us begrudges the other.

You sound very sensible.

poster minifingerz Mon 17-Apr-17 15:57:49
bibbitty I totally understand.

Well that's very kind of you minifingerz but your child's school is the worst culprit locally for divisiveness! How ironic .

Year 4 seems a little young for all this chat and a little young for your DD to be researching GCSE results! Things really have gotten faster!

There is nothing you can do about kids talking. Children do need to talk to their parents about school choices and parents do need to share their opinions. These are important conversations to have.

It's pretty impossible for parents to pass off sending their children to anything other than their local comp as a value neutral choice. Of course it is loaded with meaning and it signals deep opinions and values of other families. Parents are probably couching it much more politely than their children, but at base it stings because not everyone agrees with your choice. But then you don't agree with their choices. We could say that different schools are better for different children, but that often comes out sounding snide and cutting too.

In the end, you just have to believe in your own choices and be confident in your own values.

People can think and say what they like about schools to their kids, but year 4 is plenty old enough for children to also be told not to be tactless about the school choices of others. If the parents aren't doing it the teachers need to have a word. It's a good age to start to learn what is appropriate to say and what isn't.

I've been down this track a few times raspberryice. I think the children start out being tactful and then it descends into a bit of a "pissing contest," when someone takes umbrage or feels a bit sensitive. Bit like some Mumsnet threads!

I don't really understand what you mean by " it descends into a bit of a "pissing contest," when someone takes umbrage or feels a bit sensitive." Can you explain?

Sure Raspberry.

I think it starts with them all happy, curious and interested. The conversation gets started:

"Where are you going to year 7?"
"I'm going to the local friendly comp, are you?"

"No, my mum and dad want to send me to St Serious down the road?"

"Why? We are all going to local friendly comp. you are gonna miss all the fun we have planned!"

"St Seriousis good! They have a pool! And a new chemistry lab! And at the open day, I got to but. My name into a piece of paper with chemicals! I'm not gonna miss out!"

"Well, you just think you are better than us. You are a snob! And posh!"

"Well, kids at your school die in knife fights!"

Or some variant on that. It's a tricky conversation even for adults. Different choices are being made. When kids e plies those choices, it highlights differences. Which can be awkward and uncomfortable.

Sorry for the typos!

I'm guessing the year 4 kids are talking as some are being tutored already for private school admissions.

Luckily, we had none of this with our DS. There is no "obvious" local comp (none within walking distance so a lift, bus or train meant some degree of travelling) and my son's class of 30 dispersed to no less than 10 secondary schools including 2 grammars, 2 faith schools, and 6 comps (no private/indies in our immediate area). 2 of the 6 comps were across the county border into a different LEA. That meant no-one "stood out" for doing something different - there was no expectation to go to a particular school.

Really good for choice actually, as there was no "easy" option, so once you've accepted that you need a bus or train journey, going to town A rather than town B isn't that much of a difference (time/cost wise), so most people went to lots of open days and chose the closest fit. Not having a school on your doorstep made you really think about the options/choices and being so widely dispersed meant there were no snide comments about why you didn't chose the closest!

Threads like this always make me laugh. The people who say things like "Surely children don't talk about things like this?" "You're only projecting your own insecurities" "If you're positive about your choices, your child will be too" are always the people whose child has gone to what, for whatever reason, is considered the "better" choice.

Tell her that many, many universities are now looking for far more from pupils from private schools that state schools.

DS (first ever) has got into Oxford from his comp. Because Oxford, along with other Universities, looks at the whole.

I have noticed a new way of rubbishing secondary my ds is at. Let's call ds Fred...
Well Fred is the sort of child that will cope anywhere but my Miranda just wouldn't. She needs a similar peer group around her'.
Read what you like into 'peer group'... pretty obvious!

If I had a penny for the amount of times I've heard this...

hamlet state schools don't attract contextual offers just by being in the state sector.

The OP should not give false information just to make her DD feel better. Rocky road that one.

I chose the non catchment school )same distance!) and ds has a horrific time. They sell themselves as specialists is ASD - yet has no clue in reality.
Ds ended up having to move after a breakdown.
Parents are still sending their children there in subsequent years because they are falling for the same "speech" given.

I'd much rather send my child to a realistic school with an amazing ethos (where he is now) than a school run by politics that know how to talk the talk but can't back it up.

"Tell her that many, many universities are now looking for far more from pupils from private schools that state schools.

DS (first ever) has got into Oxford from his comp. Because Oxford, along with other Universities, looks at the whole."

This isn't right. You don't get a lower offer just because you are at state school! And your ds got an Oxford offer because he is very bright, got good grades and impressed at interview. Not because he's at a comprehensive.

True bert.

And let's not even begin to discuss how the widening access traffic went in the wrong direction this year.

But then everyone involved warned and warned. The crisis in state education is going to have serious implications and we're just starting to see it!

Which I guess might be another reason that opinions are running high in OP's class ( though no excuse for rudeness).

OP we had some of this in year 6.

Ds3 sat the 11 plus and failed (to everyone's surprise - except mine. His primary school offered to appeal as he had been through the mill with his disabled brother that year - I said no way). Anyway he never really liked the school anyway. His middle brother is there so he knows it. He doesn't like it being all boys, he said it looks like a prison (it does), and the final straw for him was when a history teacher (his favourite subject - he is obsessed with it) told us to 'get out' at an open day and refused to talk to us about the curriculum! He was outraged.

So all in all he was very happy with his first choice. A very different free school. It's quite quirky -teachers called by first names, a PBL approach - if you have seen the film 'most likely to succeed - very like high tech high featured on there. Anyway being so different, and ds3 being the first to go there from his school it was obviously subject to much tongue wagging. One child off to the local grammar took it upon himself to tell ds3 how inferior his education would be. Now it wasn't a massive problem as ds3 genuinely dislikes the grammar and gave as good as he got relaying how unpleasant some of the teachers are 😂 However, despite ds3 being unruffled and pretty robust I DID have a word with the class teacher about it and asked her to keep an eye on it.

In your dd's case I would definitely have a word. Has your dd looked at the school yet? Ds3 was very clear about which schools he liked and which he didn't. We all agreed on our three favourite and we're happy for ds3 to choose the order on the preference form - he knew exactly which order he wanted them in (& surprised me with the order as I thought choice 3 might be his first choice as his best friend was going there).

I've had a lot of comments in front of my children from another parent - her eldest friends with my second child but actually school year between my eldest - about how local secondary where my eldest attends is in permanent riot state and a dump .

She knows my eldest goes there - and the alternative secondary she wants isn't that great either according to results and ofsted reports.

The secondary my eldest goes to isn't perfect but it has great pastoral care and does well given it's intake and the academic children still seem to do well. We don't recognise the school she describes it as - her view seem base on other people opinions none of who have children there.

I find it rude she runs it down in front of my children but my comments back don't register - so I avoid having her round. I may be lucky that most of the children will go to the secondary so they don't hear much of this their school itself.

I think you just have to focus on the positive points of the school to your DC.

IMO it's better to be an excellent pupil in an average school than an average pupil in an excellent school. There's only so much a school can do - at the end of the day it mostly comes down to the ability and attitude of the individual child and, to an extent, their parents.

A keen, motivated and interested child will likely do well in any school. A bored, lazy and distracted child will likely need the kind of support provided by an independent school. Just depends on the child really and what their parents' expectations are!

You should try having one in private, one in sec modern and one in SS grammar. I am hated by everyone and judged on all points.

Gives me a perspective on all three that most don't have though.

It's not the rudeness. It's the confident assertions that things such as the OP reports don't happen. Or that if if they do happen it's the fault of the people whose child is going to the "lesser" (note inverted commas) school who are jealous, insecure and not "talking up" their option.

Cyprus I have one in special, one on mixed ability quirky free school and one in (supposedly) superselective grammar. I have most complaints about the grammar!

Thanks for explaining Empress. I can imagine that conversation happening. I wonder if the child in dd's class who went private had any snobby comments from the other kids. Possibly. I don't think she would have made any knife fight comments back as her mum would have briefed her. Plus there aren't knife fights at the local schools, although there was a normal fight at the local park. It was probably more an issue in the grammar area I grew up in than in dd's school where all but one went to a comp.